J.

KRISHNAMURTI

ON STUDY CENTRES

Selected & Edited by Krishn N th

!"#r the $se #% St$dy Centres& THE STUDY KRISHNAMURTI "OUNDATION INDIA 'AN(A)ORE

J. Krishnamurti ON STUDY CENTRES

(Selections from the Talks & Dialogues of J. Krishnamurti)

Edited by Krishna Nath

"#r * teri l +ri#r t# ,-./0 C#+yri1ht by Krishn *$rti "#$nd ti#n #% A*eric 2 3.O.'#4 ,5.62 O7 i2 CA -869:2 ;.SA "#r * teri l %r#* ,-./ #n< rds0 C#+yri1ht by Krishn *$rti "#$nd ti#n Tr$st )td.2 'r#c=<##d 3 r=2 'r *de n2 H *+shire2 S69: O)>2 U.K. %irst editi#n0 J$ly ,--. Re+rinted ,---

The St$dy Krishn *$rti "#$nd ti#n Indi H rid? n *2 Th t1$ni 3#st2 ' n1 l#re 5.6 6.9 !INDIA& ii

Contents
D#c$*ent 3D"

3re% ce Ac=n#<led1e*ent

i? ?i , ,. 96 9:8 :/ :59 58 5: .9 -, -C -,69 ,,. ,,, ,95 ,88

: . 9: 9/ 8C 5, 5. 5C .6 ., .9 C6 -,65 ,6C ,,6 ,:9 ,,,88 ,:,

1. 2. 3. 4. 5. 6. 7. 8. 9. 10. 11 12. 13. 14. 15. 16. 17. 18.

@h t is 1#in1 t# h ++en <hen K diesA An B shr * BA The d$lt centre D# <e disc$ss the centreA On li%e2 te chin1s nd the centres On the centre The centre nd *y Bdh r* B 'r#c=<##d t#d y nd in the %$t$re On ; s nt ;ih r Disci+les nd st$dy centres Di l#1$e #n the st$dy @h t * =es +l ce reli1i#$sA A reli1i#$s centre @h t re th#se seri#$s +e#+le 1#in1 t# d# thereA Ab#$t the st$dy The Krishn *$rti Centre The ide #% the st$dy centre @h t =ind #% centreA 'ibli#1r +hy

iii

Preface
This selecti#n %r#* J. Krishn *$rtiBs di l#1$es #n St$dy Centres is *#stly * de %r#* ?erb ti* re+#rts nd +resented <ith *ini* l editin1. @h t is the +$r+#se #% this selecti#nA T# e4+l#re the intent #% the %#$nder #% the centres. This e4+l#r ti#n red$ces itsel% t# *y #<n re s#ns %#r 1#in1 t# centre. @hy d# I 1# thereA T# esc +e2 t# <ithdr < nd ret$rn2 t# en7#y <ee=end #r t# e4+l#re the te chin1s nd li?e the te chin1sA @h t is the r#le #% the centres nd the %#$nd ti#ns in ll thisA The selecti#n ddresses these2 *#n1 #ther D$esti#ns. This is n#t n ess y in inter+ret ti#n. N# #ne h s the $th#rity t# inter+ret <h t Krishn 7i re lly h d in his *ind <ith re1 rd t# the centres. The selecti#ns see= t# $n%#ld the ?isi#n2 the <h#le s+ectr$* nd n#t + rt #% it. T# +$t it in c#nte4t2 the te4t h s been selected t# the %$llest e4tent +#ssible. Since these di l#1$es re r#$nd the s *e the*e #?er dec de2 re+etiti#n is $n ?#id ble <ithin nd bet<een +ieces. Re+etiti#n is n#t c$t #$t2 bec $se it is n#t l< ys *ech nic l. Th t 1i?es rhy*e nd rhyth* t# the +resent ti#n2 li=e the re+etiti#n #% n#tes in the $n%#ldin1 #% R 1 . The selecti#ns re rr n1ed chr#n#l#1ic lly. N# tte*+t is * de t# c#nnect #ne t# the #ther. Only the d te2 +l ce nd n *es #% +ers#ns re 1i?en. And #% c#$rse2 the titles. )##=in1 b c=2 it see*s th t Krishn 7i h d centres #% =ind in his *ind %r#* his e rly Eerde2 O**en d ys. There re re%erences t# the s+irit$ l centres2 shr *s2 d$lt centres nd the li=e. He s ys ByesB nd Bn#B t# D$esti#ns b#$t the necessity #r #ther<ise #% the centres. '$t he +erh +s e*+h sised the* *#re t#< rds the l ter + rt #% his li%e. He 1#es int# the centres E the +$r+#se nd =ind #% centres E in de+th <ith li%eEl#n1 %riends #% the %#$nd ti#ns in A*eric 2 C n d 2 En1l nd nd Indi in O7 i in M rch ,-CC. He is c#ncerned b#$t <h t is 1#in1 t# h ++en <hen he is n# *#re. There re sch##ls2 +$blic ti#ns2 rchi?es. '$t there *$st be li?in1 D$ lity t# ll this nd *#re. He <#$ld s= the* 1 in nd 1 in2 FI c#*e %r#* Se ttle nd I s y2 Tell *e ll b#$t hi* .... Tell *e <h t he s id. H ?e y#$ 1#t s#*ethin1 #% itAF The * n %r#* Se ttle h s since then bec#*e le1end in Krishn *$rti circles r#$nd the <#rld. Disc$ssin1 the centres2 he s=ed <h t these centres sh#$ld be2 #r #$1ht t# be. @h t is the +$r+#se2 i% ny2 #% h ?in1 the centresA And <h t =ind #% centresA There is n e4+ect ti#n nd te*+t ti#n t# s$** riGe by < y #% intr#d$cti#n. '$t +erh +s it is better n#t t# 7$*+ t# c#ncl$si#ns nd re dyE * de ns<ers. And let the D$esti#ns st y <ith $s. )et the selecti#ns s+e = %#r the*sel?es. The St$dy Centres c *e int# e4istence <hen "riedrich (r#he 1ener#$sly d#n ted %$nds t# b$ild the +r#+#sed centres in 'r#c=<##d 3 r= nd in Indi in the ,-/6s. He < s *#?ed t# d# s# %ter 1#in1 thr#$1h st te*ent #n F'r#c=<##d T#d y nd in the "$t$reF. The selecti#ns re %#r the $se #% seri#$s +e#+le <h# re 1en$inely in?#l?ed in li?in1 the te chin1s in the St$dy Centres nd in the <#rld t l r1e. The Centres2 it * y be <ell t# n#te2 re 1#in1 the < y th t s$its the eth#s #% the +l ce nd +ers#ns #r1 niGin1 the*. 3erh +s the re l centres re n#t #$t there in +hysic l s+ ce nd in the % cilities cre ted thereH they re necess ry2 b$t n#t s$%%icient. The re l centres re in the *ind nd he rt nd e?en in the bl##d #% the +ers#n li?in1 there. @here?er s$ch +ers#n #r 1r#$+ #% +e#+le e4ists2 <here?er there is b$rnin1 + ssi#n %#r inD$iry nd insi1ht2 there is centre. And n# +rescri+ti#n c n * =e #r * r th t li?in1 D$ lity. Still2 i% the i?

intent #% the %#$nder #% the e4istin1 nd %$t$re centres is =e+t in *ind2 it * y d# s#*e 1##d. All this nd *#re * y n#t le d t# enli1hten*ent. '$t i% it hel+s little2 itBs lri1htH i% it d#es n#t2 e?en then it is lri1ht. @ith these <#rds2 the selecti#ns #n St$dy Centres is +resented t# li?e the te chin1s t#1ether t the centres nd bey#nd. Krishn N th

Acknowledgements
I 1r te%$lly c=n#<led1e the hel+ %r#* %riends0 "riedrich (r#he %#r s$11estin1 *e t# * =e the selecti#ns #n the st$dy centres nd in?itin1 *e t# E$r#+e t# d# s#. Dr. S tish In *d r2 S$sh* In *d r2 Dr. T.K. 3 rch$re2 R * n 3 tel2 R bindr Sin1h2 Kish#re Kh i* r2 H rsh T n=h 2 In1rid 3#rter2 K thy "#rbes2 O.R. R #2 S.3. K nd s< *y2 D ?id S=itt2 (. ( $t * 2 Siddh rth Men#n nd H *id "#r$Gesh (#h r %#r enrichin1 the selecti#ns nd c#**entin1 #n the s *eH Mrs M ry Ii*b list %#r 1i?in1 *e n inside ?ie< #% the centres in the * =in1H R y McC#y %#r rr n1in1 t# * =e the %irst c#+y #% the selecti#ns nd 1#in1 thr#$1h the <h#le te4t nd %#r c#**ents nd s$11esti#nsH The St$dy2 Krishn *$rti "#$nd ti#n Indi 2 ' n1 l#re nd M dr sH the Krishn *$rti "#$nd ti#n Tr$st )i*ited nd the Krishn *$rti Centre2 'r#c=<##d 3 r=2 En1l nd %#r +r#?idin1 h#*e < y %r#* h#*e2 en blin1 *e t# select nd editH M ryEAnn Rid1< y %#r sc nnin12 chec=in1 nd +rintin1 the %irst dr %t #% the * n$scri+t #n the c#*+$terH nd Dr CT K nn n2 J y r 7 K +il K$l sin1he nd Mrs S$chitr N r y n %#r c#rrectin1 the +r##%H C thy H#rn %#r #r1 niGin1 the <#r= t Ch let S#lit$de2 R#$1e*#nt2 S<itGerl nd. Chalet Solitude Rougemont (Switzerland) 1st of August 199

?i

Abbreviations
3 rtici+ nts in the disc$ssi#ns h ?e been identi%ied by their initi ls 0 K AC AK C@ D' DS E' E) "@ JS MC M) MI R' RT SS T) J. Krishn *$rti Ah ly Ch ri Al n Kisb $ Cynthi @##d D ?id '#h* D#r#thy Si**#ns E?elyne 'l $ Ern )illi%elt "ritG @ilhel* J 1dish Sidd## M ry C d#1 n M r= )ee M ry Ii*b list R dh '$rnier R$th Tette*er S r7it Sidd## The# )illi%elt

J Any *ist =e in identi%ic ti#n in the tr nscri+t is re1retted. The te4t is %r#* ?erb ti* tr nscri+ts #% the Re+#rt #% the Intern ti#n l Tr$steesB Meetin1s in O7 i2 ,-CC K Krishn N th

?ii

What is going to happen when K dies?

J.Krishn *$rti0 I th#$1ht <e sh#$ld ll *eet2 the %#$r "#$nd ti#ns J<ith sch##lsK2 t# see nd t# c#nsider <h t is 1#in1 t# h ++en <hen K dies. At +resent2 %r#* <h t #ne h s #bser?ed2 K h s been the centre #% the <#r=. K h s held the di%%erent "#$nd ti#ns t#1ether2 i% I * n#t *ist =en2 nd i% K dies t#*#rr#< #r in ten ye rBs ti*e2 <h t is 1#in1 t# h ++enA @ill ll the %#$nd ti#ns bre = < y %r#* e ch #therA Th tBs #ne #% the c#nsider ti#ns th t <e <ill disc$ss +resently2 s <e 1# l#n1. KBs te chin1s re li?in1 thin1 nd the b##=s2 IB* %r id2 re n#t. N# b##= is. I% K dies2 <h t is 1#in1 t# h ++en t# the te chin1sA Is it 1#in1 t# be re+etiti?e #r re there +e#+le <h# h ?e2 i% I * y $se the +hr se2 dr$n= t the %#$nt in2 nd <h# c n c rry #n %r#* thereH n#t *erely D$#tin1 K2 b$t 1ettin1 the s+irit #% it2 the tr$th #% it2 the ?it lity #% it2 the ener1y #% itA The b##=s re ll ri1ht2 b$t they re* in #n the shel?es. Y#$ +ic= the* $+ #cc si#n lly2 l##= t the*2 re d the* nd %#r1et the*2 nd I %eel there *$st be *#n1st $s s#*e <h# h ?e2 i% I * y $se the +hr se 1 in2 dr$n= t the %#$nt in2 nd %#r the*sel?es see the tr$th nd e4+ress it in their d ily li%e2 nd s# #n2 nd s# #n. I thin= th tBs #ne #% the * 7#r iss$es s % r s IB* c#ncerned. "#r the l st %i%tyEt<# ye rs #ne h s t l=ed 1re t de l b#$t ll these thin1s nd I %ind E I h#+e y#$Bll %#r1i?e *e %#r s yin1 this E there is n#t #ne +ers#n <h# h s seen th t thin1 %#r hi*sel% nd 1#es #n <ith it. I * n#t E +le se $nderst nd E I * n#t dis ++#inted th t there is n# #ne2 s# % rH IB* n#t l##=in1 %#r nyb#dy t# c rry #n. '$t I thin= <e sh#$ld c#nsider ll this. ItBs str n1e % ct2 I < s t#ld the #ther d y in Indi 2 th t there <ere t<# disci+les #% the '$ddh <h# re lly $nderst##d hi* E y#$ * y h ?e re d s#*e #% the '$ddhist liter t$re E he c#nsidered the* the enli1htened #nes t##. '$t they died be%#re the '$ddh died. I d#nBt =n#< i% y#$ see the tr 1edy #% it. A 1r#$+ < s %#r*ed nd 1r d$ lly deteri#r ted nd ll the rest #% it. And I %eel ?ery str#n1ly th t +erh +s I * y li?e n#ther ten ye rs #r2 by n ccident2 * y die t#*#rr#<. @h t is 1#in1 t# h ++enA IB?e been t#ld2 ?ery #%ten2 by ? ri#$s +e#+le2 th t <hen K dies the re l thin1 <ill %l#<er2 bec $se $nder the ' ny n tree2 n#thin1 1r#<s. Y#$ =n#< th t s yin1A Under the T * rind n#thin1 1r#<s. S#2 IB?e been t#ld th t I h ?e been %#r the %$t$re nd n#t %#r the +resent. Als# I h ?e been t#ld th t cent$ries l ter this <ill be $nderst##d2 b$t n#t n#<. '$t I thin= ll th#se thin1s re ? ri#$s %#r*s #% e4c$ses nd there is n# ? lidity in the*. @h t re <e 1#in1 t# d# s %#$nd ti#n2 in Indi 2 in En1l nd2 in C n d 2 nd hereA H#< is this 1#in1 t# be s$st ined2 n#$rished2 nd =e+t 1#in1 in the #ri1in l sense #% th t <#rdH n#t i*it tin12 n#t re+resentin12 n#t s yin1 th t <e re the b#dy nd n#b#dy $nderst nds b$t $s2 y#$ =n#<2 ll #% the #r1 niG ti#n l c l *ity th t c#*es b#$tA S#2 I th#$1ht it <#$ld be 1##d ide i% <e ll *et t# disc$ss ll these * tters. The %#$nd ti#n h s2 s# % r2 been res+#nsible %#r ll this. There h ?e been +e#+le <h# h ?e s id2 B@hy re y#$ the he d #% ny #r1 niG ti#n2 li=e the %#$nd ti#nsABH B@hy re y#$ ch ir* n #% this2 #r in En1l nd2 #r in A*eric 2 #r in C n d AB In Indi they d#nBt < nt *y n *e s the ch ir* n2 #r nythin1 #% th t =ind2 bec $se they c#nsider E i% I * y 1 in re+resent the* E they s y2 BY#$ sh#$ld n#t be #n ny #% these2 %#$nd ti#ns bec $se y#$r n *e is s cred F nd s# #n. S# there re ll these +r#ble*s. The +$blic ti#ns2 the sch##lsH there re n#< %#$r sch##ls in Indi E n#2 *#re th n th t E %i?e #r si4 sch##ls in Indi . And there is 'r#c=<##d2 C n d 2 O7 i. @h tBs 1#in1 t# h ++en t# the* <hen K dies nd <ill the te chin1s be +$t thr#$1h these sch##ls2 #r 7$st +eter #$t s they 1ener lly d#A S# ll these +r#ble*s <e h ?e t# c#nsider. S#2 there it is. I %eel ll the "#$nd ti#ns re #ne b#dy $nder the s *e $*brell 2 the s *e $nit2 th#$1h le1 lly nd %in nci lly se+ r te. 3erh +s the "#$nd ti#ns <hich re richer c n hel+ the +##rer2 b$t it is ll #ne ,

1r#$+2 #ne b#dy2 n#t in< rdly se+ r te b$t #ne c#ntin$#$s thin1 th t <ill 1# #n. 3e#+le h ?e s$11ested2 ls#2 th t <hen K dies ll these "#$nd ti#ns sh#$ld be diss#l?ed2 nd I thin= th t <#$ld be +ity bec $se sch##ls re in?#l?ed in it2 +$blic ti#ns2 nd s# #n. S# <h t sh ll <e ll d# t#1ether b#$t ll these thin1sA I %eel ?ery str#n1ly nd r ther seri#$sly b#$t ll these * tters bec $se e?ery #r1 niG ti#n %#$nded by +ers#n deteri#r tes <ithin %#rty ye rs. This h s been +r#?ed #?er nd #?er 1 in2 s by the The#s#+hic l S#ciety <hich Dr 'es nt re lly b$ilt $+2 nd <hen she died the thin1 1r d$ lly be1 n t# +eter #$t2 lth#$1h there re still l#t #% *e*bers2 nd s# #n. S# <h tBs 1#in1 t# h ++enA These * tters c nn#t be settled in <ee= nd th tBs <hy <e s$11ested *#nth t#1ether t# 1et t# =n#< e ch #ther nd h ?e ti*e t# thin= b#$t these * tters2 nd n#t brin1 'r#c=<##d here <ith ll its +r#ble*s. These re the +rinci+ l thin1s <eBll t l= #?er t#1ether2 th#$1h <eBll t l= b#$t 'r#c=<##d nd C n d nd Indi 2 b#$t the sch##ls. '$t <e re here #nly t# t l= #?er2 disc$ss2 c#*e t# s#*e =ind #% $nderst ndin1. The 3resident #% the "#$nd ti#n #% Indi Mrs J y = r2 S$n nd 2 nd #thers h ?e +$t d#<n #n + +er <h t they thin= sh#$ld be d#ne in this 1 therin1. @eBll 1# int# th t l ter #n. Als# the +ers#n <h# is 1#in1 t# be 3rinci+ l #% Rishi ; lley E nd +le se =ee+ this t# y#$rsel?es $ntil it is #%%ici lly nn#$nced E h s ls# s$11ested nd <ritten ? ri#$s +#ints <hich he <#$ld li=e $s t# disc$ss. And ls#2 b#$t KBs tr ?ellin1 E heBs 1#in1 t# be ei1htyEt<# in M y nd +r#b bly c n c rry #n this =ind #% tr ?ellin1 %#r n#ther %i?e #r si4 ye rs E %ter th t it <ill bec#*e *$ch *#re di%%ic$lt +hysic lly. S# ll these +#ints <e h ?e t# c#nsider2 h#< t# r ise *#ney2 nd ls# thereBs the D$esti#n #% d$lt ed$c ti#n2 lth#$1h I d#nBt li=e th t <#rdH B d$ltB s#$nds r ther silly. IB?e ls# s$11ested in Indi 2 b#th t Rishi ; lley nd t R 71h t2 ed$c ti#n %#r #lder +e#+le2 ed$c ti#n in the sense th t they <ill disc$ss these te chin1s. '#th in R 71h t nd in Rishi ; lley they re ?ery =een #n itH the t<# Indi ns <h# re c#*in1 t#d y <ill tell y#$ ll b#$t it. S# there re ll these +r#ble*s2 n#t +r#ble*s re lly2 ll these iss$es <hich <e re lly *$st disc$ss in det il nd settle2 n#t le ?e it ll ? 1$e. @e *i1ht n#t h ?e n #cc si#n t# *eet li=e this 1 in. Als#2 <hile y#$ re here2 es+eci lly Mrs Si**#ns nd M ry C d#1 n2 y#$ sh#$ld h ?e rest ls#2 bec $se Mrs Si**#ns needs 1re t de l #% rest. SheBs c rryin1 the b$rden #% 'r#c=<##d <hich is re lly 1re t tri l. Y#$ =n#< <h t st$dents re E dr$1s2 se42 lc#h#l nd ll the rest #% it. S#2 +le se2 letBs ll h ?e rest%$l +eri#d nd n#t h ?e the <r n1les 1#in1 #n E b#$t nythin1. My br#ther nd I c *e here in ,-992 %i%tyE%i?e ye rs 1#. (##d (#dL @e li?ed in th t little c#tt 1e then2 7$st b thr##*2 #ne ch ir nd <##d st#?e. And 1r d$ lly <e 1#t ll this. And I %eel O7 i h s s#*ethin1 s+eci lH IB?e l< ys %elt it2 b$t itBs been s+#iled 1re t de l by the c se nd ll the <%$l thin1s. S# <eBll %#r1et ll th t nd +$t it #n ice nd letBs 1et #n <ith it. There2 IB?e t#ld y#$ e?erythin1. My re l2 chie% c#ncern E nd IB?e t l=ed this * tter #?er <ith Dr '#h*2 Mrs Si**#ns2 nd M ry Ii*b list E is <h t is 1#in1 t# h ++en <hen I die. Th tBs re lly *y chie% c#ncern nd I thin= it sh#$ld be the c#ncern #% *#st #% $s2 t##. @h tBs 1#in1 t# h ++en t# the sch##lsA @ill they c#*e t# n end bec $se K diesA Th tBs been #ne #% y#$r D$esti#ns t##. Or <ill they 1# #nA In Indi they <ill 1# #n bec $se th#se t<# sch##ls2 Rishi ; lley nd R 71h t2 re ?ery <ell =n#<n nd re s$++#sed t# be %irstEcl ss sch##ls. TheyBll 1# #n. And in M dr s t##. S#2 ll these +#ints <e h ?e t# disc$ss ?ery c re%$lly2 t =e ti*e2 1# int# it ?ery2 ?ery2 *in$tely s# th t <e re cert in <h t <e re d#in1. S# thereBll be n# d#$bt t the end #% #$r three <ee=sB #r %#$r <ee=sB st y here. Mrs J y = r < nted t# 9

c#*e2 b$t she c#$ldnBt2 s# sheBs s=ed these t<# +e#+le t# c#*e2 R dh '$rnier nd Ah ly Ch ri. R dh '$rnier is the (ener l Secret ry #% the The#s#+hic l S#ciety in Indi 2 nd ls# the he d #% the es#teric secti#n #% the S#ciety. And s# +e#+le h ?e s=ed her nd h ?e s=ed *e2 B@h t the dic=ens is she d#in1 in ll thisBA S# <eBll t c=le her <ith th t D$esti#n. IB?e lre dy s=ed her th t nd sheBll tell y#$ hersel%. I * y h ?e t# < rn her be%#reh ndL BKBs N#teb##=B in Indi h s cre ted E I d#nBt =n#< <h t it h s cre ted. S#*e 1$r$s re s yin1 th t heBs the li?in1 '$ddh nd y#$ *$st 1# nd t#$ch hi*2 nd listen t# hi*H * inly t#$ch hi*2 bec $se then y#$Bll 1et s#*ethin1 #$t #% it2 nd s# #n. S# <h t sh ll <e d# this *#rnin1A @h t sh ll <e t =e $+A D# y#$ thin= <e #$1ht t# dr < $+ n 1end A S#$nds <%$lL I th#$1ht <eBd *eet e?ery #ther d y. N#A D#nBt y#$A E?ery #ther d y2 s# th t #ne d y <e c n 1# nd l##= t the trees nd the *#$nt ins2 #r 1# t# S nt ' rb r 2 #r <here?er y#$ li=e. One d y <e sh#$ld be t this2 in the *#rnin1H n#t in the %tern##n2 bec $se then itBs t## *$ch. MI0 It see*s t# *e th t <eB?e rri?ed in ll this t +#int <hen the <#r= nd the sch##ls re in e4istence nd the d$lt E <h te?er y#$ re 1#in1 t# c ll it E le rnin1 centre is 1#in1 t# be *$ch *#re cti?e e?ery<here2 nd i% ll this res$lts in s#*ethin1 th t is re lly ?it l nd re%lects y#$r te chin1s2 it sh#$ld h ?e 1re ter +#ssibility #% c rryin1 #n #$t #% its #<n stren1th. K0 The d$lt centre2 <h t sh ll <e c ll itA MI0 Y#$ s$11ested the #ther d y2 B d$lt le rnin1B2 inste d #% B d$lt ed$c ti#nB. K0 Ad$lt )e rnin1A Centre #% )e rnin1A N#2 th t s#$nds t## ... Others0 J$st d$lt centre. K0 In Indi the S ns=rit <#rd B shr * B *e ns +l ce t# <hich y#$ retre t2 li=e the C th#lic +l ces t# <hich ny#ne c n 1#2 n#nEC th#lics2 t##2 nd be D$iet there2 %#r s l#n1 s he li=es + 1 n2 nd s# #n. S# th t <#rd B shr * B h s been r$ined by these 1$r$s. S#2 B +l ce #% le rnin1.AB D'0 Th t d#esnBt s#$nd ?ery 1##d. Y#$ < nt t# %ind <#rd B# sisB2 lth#$1h th tBs n#t D$ite ri1ht. re lly 1##d title. Y#$ #nce *enti#ned the

K0 Y#$ =n#< the #ri1in #% th t <#rdA In Indi 2 <e th#$1ht E I s$11ested * ny ye rs 1#2 b$t they didnBt d# it in Indi 2 b$t theyBre 1#in1 t# d# it n#< E <hen y#$ h ?e n d$lt +l ce li=e th t2 nd the sch##l t#1ether #+er tin12 then y#$Bll 1et %r#* the 1r#<n $+ +e#+le s#*e te chers <h# <ill c#*e t# the sch##l nd te ch +er* nently. S# th t ll the ti*e there is 1r#$+ #% +e#+le %eedin1 the sch##l <ith the ri1ht =ind #% te chers. Th t < s the #ri1in l ide H b$t $n%#rt$n tely it h snBt been d#ne. N#< <eBre 1#in1 t# d# it in Indi . I th#$1ht <e sh#$ld d# the s *e here bec $se itBs ?ery di%%ic$lt t# %ind te chers2 the ri1ht =ind #% te chers2 <h# =n#< <h t K is t l=in1 b#$t nd <h# re c#**itted t# the te chin1s nd n#t t# their ide s b#$t the te chin1s2 nd li?e it2 nd s#*eh#< c#n?ey it t# the st$dents. All th t. Th t < s the ide #% h ?in1 n shr * . I $se th t <#rd c re%$lly %#r the ti*e bein1H b#th n shr * nd sch##l t#1ether #+er tin1. E'0 D# y#$ thin= y#$r n *e sh#$ld be ss#ci ted <ith itA Sh#$ld it be Krishn *$rti CentreA D'0 It see*s t# *e th t in Centre y#$ c#$ld tell <hich +e#+le <#$ld be the better te chers2 by bein1 t#1ether <ith the* %#r s#*e ti*e.

DS0 @ell2 I thin= y#$ < nt s#*e<here <here +e#+le c#$ld c#*e nd <e c#$ld 1et t# =n#< the*. E?ery#ne s#$nds * r?ell#$s #n + +er2 b$t the *#*ent y#$ li?e <ith the* %#r <hile2 y#$ be1in t# s#rt the* #$t bit. K0 D#nMt 1# int# det ils yet. I 7$st < nt2 #n this %irst *#rnin12 t# see the seri#$sness #% ll thisH n#t <h t t# d#2 <eMll disc$ss th t s the d ys 1# #n. '$t i% #ne c n c#n?ey the seri#$sness #% <h t K %eels b#$t ll this. 'ec $se it is n#t n $th#rit ri n 1r#$+2 cce+tin1 te cher2 1$r$2 disci+les2 <eMre n#t th t. @eBre n#t %#ll#<ers #% nyb#dyH <eBre n#t belie?in1 nythin1. There re n# d#ctrines2 n# rit$ ls2 s# it bec#*es tre*end#$sly di%%ic$lt t# see the <h#le i*+lic ti#n #% ll this nd the seri#$sness #% it. Th tBs the %irst thin12 #n this %irst *#rnin12 th t I <#$ld li=e t# disc$ss. N#t <h t the sch##l sh#$ld be c lled. @eB?e 1#t +lenty #% ti*e %#r ll the det ils. MC0 ThereBs + rtic$l r di%%ic$lty2 I thin=2 th t s#*e #% $s %ind <hen <e thin= #% y#$r <#r= in c#nnecti#n <ith n d$lt centre E <hich 1 in <e *i1ht thin= b#$t. Y#$ *i1ht ls# be ble t# hel+ $s <ith this2 <hich is th t <hen #ne is seri#$sly interested in <h t y#$ s y2 there re cert in %$ncti#ns <ithin the <#r= <hich re ?ery str i1ht%#r< rd2 %#r inst nce2 rr n1in1 the +$blic ti#ns2 nd s# #nH r$nnin1 the sch##l is % r less str i1ht%#r< rd2 b$t itBs ?ery s+eci%ic %$ncti#n2 bec $se #ne is c#ncerned <ith children <h# re 1r#<in1 nd le rnin1. ItBs *$ch *#re di%%ic$lt <hen <e c#*e int# this #ther re 2 bec $se it see*s s i% s# *$ch #% <h t y#$ s y h s this ++r# ch <hich is2 in #ne sense2 ne1 ti?e. S#*eh#< it h s bec#*e + rtic$l rly lin=ed in * ny +e#+leBs *inds <ith scienti%ic ++r# ch. N#<2 it see*s t# *e th t thereBs this %eelin1 th t th tBs ll ri1ht2 i% y#$ see <h t I *e n2 b$t s#*eh#< the <#rld #% rt2 #r <h te?er else2 d#esnBt see* t# c#*e int# this s# *$ch2 nd I <#ndered <hether <e *i1ht 1# int# this2 t##. K0 Yes2 yes. MI0 @#$ld it be $se%$l %#r y#$ t# 1# int# <ith $s2 <h t is it th t c#**$nic tes cert in enli1hten*ent2 %#r < nt #% *#re c#rrect <#rdA @hen y#$ s+e =2 it is e?ident t# e?ery#ne2 b$t y#$ br#$1ht $+ the * tter #% the '$ddh 2 nd #nly t<# +e#+le re lly $nderst##d hi* nd they b#th died be%#re he did. Ne?ertheless2 '$ddhis* h s been %#rce2 c#rrectly #r $thentic lly2 #r n#t E I h ?e n# ide E b$t t le st it h s end$red nd h s been ?ery +#<er%$l thin1. N#< it end$red in < y th t2 c#*+ red t# t#d y2 is l r*in1H there <ere n# re l rec#rds s <e =n#< the* t#d y. There <ere n# b##=s2 there <ere n# ... K0 N#. MI0 They <r#te it d#<nA K0 N#t <r#te it d#<nH they *e*#rised. All th t I =n#< b#$t this2 it is $thentic. Cert in + rts #% it. MI0 S# there is n $thentic te4t %r#* <hich +e#+le h ?e seen s#*ethin1. @ell2 #b?i#$sly th t e4ists in *$ch <ider sense <ith y#$. '$t y#$ see* t# deni1r te th t s n#t bein1 li?in1 thin1. It sh#$ld be2 in s#*e < y2 s#*ethin1 th t c#*es thr#$1h +e#+le li?in1 it nd c#**$nic tin1 it2 s best they c n2 t# #thers. K0 A%ter ll2 in the Jes$s *yth E i% he re lly li?ed t ll2 nd s#*e belie?e it < s <ritten %ter si4ty ye rs2 by his disci+les nd y#$ c n i* 1ine <h t the disci+les <#$ld d#2 cre te n <%$l *yth. I d#nBt < nt t# 1et < y %r#* this % ct. I d#nBt =n#< i% y#$ %eel the seri#$sness #% this 1 therin12 the s+irit #% it2 the intenti#n t# it. @h t <e decide n#<2 h s t# be s#*ethin1 +er* nent2 B+er* nentB in D$#tes2 nd s# it bec#*es ?ery seri#$s %% ir. And i% e ch t =es it2 s I d#2 ?ery seri#$sly2 then #$t :

#% th t seri#$sness2 thin1s <ill %l#<er. "ritG @ilhel* is (er* n +r#%ess#r I *et t<# ye rs 1# in S nen nd s=ed t# c#*e hereH heBs le%t e?erythin1 in (er* ny nd heBs here <ith the "#$nd ti#n. I %eel the %irst thin1 I <#$ld li=e t# t l= #?er <ith y#$ is <h t <ill h ++en <hen K dies2 either in n er#+l ne ccident2 !#r thr#$1h illness&. IB* ?ery <ell2 <ent t# see the d#ct#r the #ther d y nd he s id2 BItBs e4tr #rdin ry2 t ei1htyEt<#. @h t is y#$r +hil#s#+hyAB I s id2 B' n n sB. I didnBt tell hi* th t2 s id it t# *ysel%. S# <h t is the c#**#n thin1 %#r ll #% $s hereA D# y#$ $nderst nd <h t IB* t l=in1 b#$tA E)0 It see*s t# *e th t the 1re t c#ncern is this en#r*#$s ?#id th t <ill e4ist <hen y#$Bre n# l#n1er hereH <hen y#$ die. 3e#+le2 %#r ll these ye rs2 h ?e been l##=in1 t# #ne * n2 nd the te chin1s #% #ne * n. K0 @hich is s# % t l. E)0 S# the d n1er is2 %#r ll #% $s2 th t they re 1#in1 t# t$rn t# n#ther +ers#n t# re+l ce y#$2 #r theyBll thin= they re the #nes <h# $nderst nd best2 nd * ybe #ne +ers#n #r n#ther ... And I thin= th tBs 1#in1 t# be the 1re t d n1er %#r ny#ne <h# h s been2 #r <h# <ill be re+resentin1 y#$2 #r <h# <ill be <#r=in1 in this d$lt centre2 #r h s been e4+#sed <ith y#$ #n tele?isi#n2 nd in the t +es2 nd s# #n. I thin= itBs 1re t d n1er. K0 Ern )illie%elt2 the +e#+le I =n#< in A*eric 2 nd En1l nd2 nd s# #n2 re ll #% y#$. IB* <ith #ther +e#+le2 b$t n#t s# *$ch. They s y2 B@h t re y#$A Y#$B?e =n#<n hi* *#re th n nyb#dy elseB. E)0 There%#re2 y#$ sh#$ld ... K0 N#. TheyBll s= y#$2 BAre y#$ li?in1 itH h ?e y#$ i*bibed itAB Y#$ %#ll#<. I% I < s n #$tsider2 IBd s y2 B@ell2 y#$B?e =n#<n hi* %#r %i%teen2 t<enty2 thirty ye rsH <h t the hec=L H ?e y#$ 1#t s#*ethin1A Or re y#$ 7$st + ssin1 the b$c= t# s#*e#ne elseA I% y#$ h ?e n#t2 <h t sh ll <e d#A Alre dy in Indi #ne #% the bi1 * 1 Gines. !he "llustrated #ee$ly of "ndia E BThe Y#1 #% KB . They l y d#<n the <h#le thin1H <h t t# d#H <h t n#t t# d#H the <h#le thin1 is <#r=ed #$t s n#ther y#1 H this h s been dded. And the 1$r$s in Indi re n#< s yin12 BY#$ re the <#rldB2 t =in1 bits #% ll this. ItBs n#< bec#*e % shi#n ble2 y#$ %#ll#<A S# th tBs <hy. @h t sh ll <e d# <hen K dies2 nd y#$Bre the #nly +e#+le he sees2 *#re th n nyb#dy else. I% I < s n #$tsider c#*in1 %r#* Se ttle2 nd I s id2 B3le se2 y#$B?e =n#<n hi*2 tell *e <h t he *e ns by *edit ti#n2 <h t he *e ns by this nd th tAB I <#$ld s=. And y#$ s y2 BS#rry2 1# t# the b##=B. E)0 @h t d# y#$ tell the*A Are y#$ inter+retin1A TheyBre s=in1 in the li1ht #% y#$. K0 N#2 I c#*e t# y#$. Y#$Bre %riend #% Christ2 i% he e4isted2 #r '$ddh 2 <h# did e4ist2 nd I c#*e t# y#$. And y#$B?e =n#<n hi* %#r * ny ye rsH y#$B?e t l=ed t# hi*2 tell *e. E)0 I <#$ld h ?e t# tell s I $nderst nd it. '$t I c#$ldnBt inter+ret <h t y#$ *e nt. K0 S#2 y#$Bd s y2 BIB?e $nderst##d little2 IBll tell y#$ b#$t itB. Th t is the %$ncti#n #% the shr * .

MI0 '$t thereBs ?ery s$btle +#int2 Krishn 7i. Is it th t #ne < rns the +ers#n .. K0 O% c#$rse. MI0 ... BY#$Bre 1ettin1 *y $nderst ndin1 nd d#nBt st#+ thereB. K0 Y#$ see2 re <e +re+ redA Y#$ %#ll#< <h t I *e nA

I% K dies t#*#rr#<2 <h t <ill y#$ d#A @ill the *#ney st#+2 the sch##ls cl#se $+A 'r#c=<##d +erh +s <#$ld 1# #n. I d#nBt =n#<. The + rents *$st be n4i#$s b#$t it2 t##. Indi <ill c#ntin$e bec $se they h ?e 1#t their re+$t ti#n. DS0 @h t is di%%erent then2 Krishn 7iA @h t * =es it *#re... in Indi A K0 @ell2 bec $se itBs %i%ty ye rs #ld. RT0 Th t sh#$ldnBt * =e ny di%%erence ... K0 IB* 7$st... they re ?ery <ellE=n#<n sch##ls2 in Indi 2 nd theyB?e bec#*e #rdin ry sch##ls2 %irstE cl ss2 #rdin ry sch##ls. I #b7ect t# th t =ind #% sch##l. IB?e been #b7ectin1 %#r ye rs. DS0 I d#nBt see <hy #ne d#es nythin1 di%%erent %r#* <h t #neBs d#in1 n#<2 <hen y#$Bre n#t here. K0 In the +e#+leBs eyes2 they <ill s y2 BI <#nder <h t h ++ensAB BH s it 1#ne d#<nhillAB RT0 @ell2 itBs n#t d#ne %r#* hier rchic l st ndE+#int. K0 I% y#$ t##= #%% the ch ir* n2 K the ch ir* n2 <h t <#$ld h ++en then2 in En1l ndA T =e < y *y n *e s ch ir* n. @#$ld it * =e ny di%%erenceA E)0 @h t <ill * =e di%%erence is <hen y#$ die. It d#esnBt * =e ny di%%erence <hether y#$Bre ch ir* n #% the b# rd #r n#t. DS0 I thin= it <#$ld * =e ll the di%%erence2 bec $se thereBs n#b#dy tellin1 y#$2 s yin1 <h t he is s yin1. The tr$th is ss#ci ted <ith his n *eH itBs n#t ss#ci ted <ith nyb#dy elseBs n *e. MC0 Ah2 y#$Bre t l=in1 b#$t n#t $sin1 the n *e t ll. '$t Krishn 7i < s #nly t l=in1 b#$t n#t $sin1... K0 N#t $sin1 it t ll. MI0 N#t t# h ?e "#$nd ti#n c lled The Krishn *$rti "#$nd ti#nA K0 N#2 still c lled The Krishn *$rti "#$nd ti#n2 b$t re*#?e hi* s the ch ir* n. MC0 Ah2 th tBs di%%erent thin12 7$st t l=in1 b#$t n#t bein1 ch ir* n. I d#nBt thin= th t * =es ny di%%erence t# th#se #% $s <h# re <#r=in1 <ith y#$ n#<.

DS0 @h t is the +#int #% itA K0 In Indi they #b7ected t# it ?ery str#n1ly bec $se they s y2 BY#$r n *e is s credB2 etc.2 etc.2 etc. MI0 '$t they c ll it The Krishn *$rti "#$nd ti#n #% Indi . K0 They =ee+ the n *e2 b$t they h ?e n# ch ir* n s K. E)0 S# <h tBs the di%%erenceA MC0 C#$ld <e ls#2 <hen <e t l= b#$t <h t <eBre 1#in1 t# disc$ss2 thin= ?ery c re%$lly nd then c#*e t#1ether #n this D$esti#n #% the r#le #% the "#$nd ti#n2 s# th t <e d# n#t bec#*e inter+retersH nd h#< <eBre 1#in1 t# tre d this ?ery r G#r ed1e bet<een s yin1 <h t it *e ns t# $s nd bein1 th t. "@0 I thin= it is n#t i*+#rt nt i% the #r1 niG ti#n c rries #n. I% it d#es n#t c rry #n in the ri1ht sense2 i%2 %#r e4 *+le2 'r#c=<##d c rries #n <ith#$t the n *e2 b$t the te chin1 is 1#in1 #n there2 then th t is +er%ectly ll ri1ht. S# 7$st the #r1 niG ti#n2 <hen the te chin1 is n#t li?in1 in ny #% the #r1 niG ti#ns2 #r ny #% the sch##ls2 I d#nBt thin= thereBs *$ch di%%erence i% the sch##l 1#es #n #r n#t. K0 Y#$ =n#< Steiner Sch##ls2 in E$r#+e nd in En1l nd. Steiner l y d#<n cert in d#1* s2 cert in ttit$des nd ? l$es. In these sch##ls2 itBs Steiner Sch##l in the sense they te ch these d#1* s. "@0 There%#re itBs de d #r1 niG ti#n. K0 Yes2 sir2 b$t IB* s=in1 E y#$ =n#< <h t IB* s=in12 I d#nBt h ?e t# re+e t. "@0 Yes2 sir. I thin= it c#*es d#<n t# the D$esti#n2 h#< c n <e c#**$nic te the te chin1A H#< c n <e t l= b#$t it <ith #ther +e#+leA D'0 I thin= th t the Indi n "#$nd ti#n h s s$11ested th t it <#$ld be *#re ++r#+ri te i% y#$ <ere n#t c#nsidered s ch ir* n2 ll r#$nd the <#rld. K0 Yes2 th tBs <h t they re s yin1. S#2 h ?e the n *e s K "#$nd ti#n2 b$t d#nBt be Ch ir* n. MI0 '$t <e disc$ssed th t 1es 1# <ith the*. K0 I =n#<. 3le se2 <eBll disc$ss it l ter. IB?e he rd K se?er l ti*es nd <ill 1# nd listen s l#n1 s heBs s+e =in1 in di%%erent + rts #% the <#rld. IB?e $nderst##d little2 $nderst##d in the sense2 n#t ?erb lly2 b$t dee+lyH IB?e 1#t the t ste nd the s*ell #% itH itBs in *y he rt. IB?e $nderst##d it2 little + rt. S# I <#$ld 1# #$t nd s y2 BThis is <h t I %eel. IB* 1#in1 t# tell y#$ <h t I h ?e $nderst##d. IB* n#t re+resentin1 K2 b$t this is <h t I h ?e $nderst##d. This is <h t ... B @ell letBs disc$ss it. All the shr *s re *e nt %#r this2 <hich d#esnBt *e n I re+resent K #r s#*eb#dy else. It is <h t IB?e $nderst##d. D'0 Is th t c#nnected <ith the D$esti#n #% Ch ir* nA Is there s#*e sense th t i% y#$Bre Ch ir* n there is s#*e re+resent ti#n 1#in1 #nA

K0 Yes2 th tBs ri1ht. D'0 Y#$ < nt t# disc#nnect th tA ItBs n#t D$ite cle r yet. K0 I c#*e %r#* Se ttle. I he r there is +l ce t O7 i <here #ne #r t<# +e#+le re disc$ssin1. I c#*e there nd re* in %#r t<# #r three <ee=s re lly t# $nderst nd <h t it is ll b#$t. I < nt t# disc$ss <ith the* nd 1# < y. I *i1ht c#*e b c= ne4t ye r. ; ri#$s +e#+le re in?ited nd c#*e t# st y %#r three <ee=s2 #r *#nth2 I d#nBt =n#<. All th#se re det ils. D'0 I thin= thereBs n inesc + ble s+ect #% $th#rity2 th#$1h2 bec $se #ne is tr$stee2 nd +e#+le <#$ld tend t# s y2 B@ell2 bec $se y#$ re this #r th t2 y#$ *$st =n#< s#*ethin1 s+eci lB. K0 I =n#<2 I =n#<. Yes. D'0 And itBs r ther inti*id tin1. K0 It is2 yes. D'0 It is t# *e2 t ny r te. E)0 Th tBs <here <e 1et int# tr#$ble. D'0 E4 ctly. K0 I <#$ld d# th t. I <#$ld c#*e t# y#$2 #r s#*eb#dy E IB?e =n#<n y#$ %#r ye rs2 y#$ h ?e =n#<n K %#r ye rs E nd I s y2 B"#r 1##dness s =e tell *e s#*ethin1 b#$t itB. @h# else <ill I 1# t#A @ill y#$2 <h# h ?e =n#<n hi* %#r ye rs2 s y2 B)##=2 this is <h t he s ysB2 nd disc$ss it <ith the*A Y#$ re res+#nsible %#r this. D#nBt s y2 BS#rry2 IB?e =e+t *y b##=sH IB* n#t interested in itB. MC0 Th t h ++ens ll the ti*e2 t +ers#n l le?el2 lre dy2 d#esnBt itA K0 N#L MI0 '$t #ne *eets +e#+le nd they s y2 B@h t is it y#$Bre d#in1A @h t is it b#$tAB2 nd #ne h s t# res+#nd s#*eh#<. K0 Is this <h t y#$Bre 1#in1 t# d#2 <hen K dies t#*#rr#<A @h t is y#$r rel ti#nshi+ t# the +$blic2 t# NA RT0 It <#nBt be ny di%%erent %r#* <h t it is n#<. K0 R$th2 itBs s#*e<h t di%%erent. I c#*e nd I s y2 BY#$B?e =n#<n hi* %#r ye rsH +le se tell *e s#*ethin1 b#$t hi*B. "r#* y#$. I d#nBt < nt y#$ t# tell *e t# 1# t# s#*eb#dy else2 #r s= *e t# 1# nd re d b##=s. D'0 ThereBs 1#in1 t# be bi1 di%%erence. N#< y#$ c n s y2 B@ell2 c#*e nd listen t# his t l=sB. ) ter y#$ <#nBt be ble t# s y this. K0 Yes

SS0 And <e h ?e this +r#ble* in C n d 2 ri1ht n#<2 bec $se y#$ h ?enBt been there. And +e#+le re c#*in1 nd <e d# try2 in #$r #<n < y2 t# hel+ the* in <h te?er < y <e c n. And i% they re seri#$s2 they =ee+ c#*in1 b c=. K0 Ah2 b$t y#$ see2 y#$ re in di%%erent +#siti#n. These +e#+le h ?e =n#<n K %#r ye rs2 nd s str n1er I c#*e here t# O7 i nd I s y2 BMrs )illi%elt2 tell *e2 <h t =ind #% li%e2 <h t < s he2 I < nt t# =n#<AB I < nt t# %ind #$t. I% I < s in Indi nd the '$ddh died2 IBd < nt t# =n#< <h t the '$ddh < s li=e. IBd 1# t# +e#+le <h#Bd listened t# hi*. IBd < nt t# %ind #$t. SS0 I =n#< <h t IBd s y. IBd s y th t IBd been t# Indi nd IBd se rched hi1h nd l#< nd %in lly the #thers <ere tryin1 t# <e ?e net r#$nd $s nd thereBs %reed#* here. K0 '$t I < nt *#re th n th t. IB?e re d th t in the b##=s. I < nt y#$2 <h# h ?e =n#<n hi* %#r s#*e ye 2 < nt t# t#$ch <h t y#$ h ?e t#$ched2 <hen he < s li?e. E)0 Yes. Th tBs <hy itBs ?ery i*+#rt nt th t <e sh#$ld be t#1ether2 in the ne4t %e< ye rs2 *eet s#*e<here e?ery ye r t# disc$ss nd be t#1ether. D#nBt y#$A Y#$ see* r ther d#$bt%$l. ItBs i*+#rt nt b$t #$r ti*e is li*ited2 t##. K0 Th t is %#r y#$ t# %ind y#$n1 +e#+leH n#t t# bec#*e *issi#n ries2 %#r 1#dBs s =e2 b$t ... D'0 I thin= the *#st i*+#rt nt thin1 <e c#$ld d# #?er the ne4t %e< ye rs is be t#1ether s# th t <e h ?e this %ir*ly nd ... K0 Th tBs <hy IB* s=in12 nd h ?e been %#r se?er l ye rs n#<. M ri nd I h ?e t l=ed 1re t de l2 nd s# h s Mrs Si**#ns2 b#$t <h tBs 1#in1 t# h ++en <hen K dies2 the <h#le thin12 n#t 7$st #ne s+ect #% it2 b$t the <h#le thin1. D'0 3ers#n lly2 IB* n#t s# %e r%$l #% the #$ter s+ect #% it2 the sch##ls2 the %$ncti#ns. All th t2 I %eel r ther sec$re b#$t. ItBs the inner2 li?in1 D$ lity #% it th t is #% *#st c#ncern. K0 I <#$ld s y2 BI% y#$ h ?e =n#<n hi* %#r s# * ny ye rs2 h ?e y#$ dr$n= little bit #% th t < terA I% y#$ h ?e n#t2 <h t the hec= h ?e y#$ been d#in1AB SS0 @ell2 c n <e drin= s#*e #% th t < ter t these t l=s n#<A K0 @ ter. @h tBs *e nt by ll this2 y#$ seeA It *i1ht be n ide t##2 <hich I thin= <ill * teri liGe. S#*e #% the te chers here2 'r#c=<##d2 nd Indi sh#$ld *eet re1$l rly E te chers2 n#t $s E s# th t there is ll #ne sch##l E 'r#c=<##d2 O7 i2 C n d 2 Indi E re1$l rly *eet. Then it cre tes s#*ethin1. And2 %#r th t2 #ne h s t# h ?e %$nd. Als# %#r the +e#+le %#r the "#$nd ti#n2 *eet e?ery ye r2 s+eci l %$nd. E)0 It t =es *#ney. K0 @e h ?e t# c#llect it. ItBs i*+#rt nt %#r $s t# *eet. D#nBt ll #% y#$ < nt t# 1# t# Indi nd be 1$ests #% the "#$nd ti#n #% Indi A N#t this <inter b$t ne4t <inter. IB* hesit tin1 this ye r2 bec $se y#$B?e lre dy c#*e hereH the e4+ense #% it nd ll th t. MC0 It <#$ld be * r?ell#$s i% <e c#$ld *eet in Indi .

K0 They < nt y#$ t# 1#2 nd they s id y#$Bll be their 1$ests. TheyBll +$t y#$ $+ +r#+erlyH theyBll l##= %ter y#$2 d# y#$r l $ndry nd ll the rest #% it. The <#rd B*edit ti#nB is n#< s+re din1 ll #?er the <#rld li=e ye rs nd s=ed2 B@h t d#es he *e n by *edit ti#nA I <#$ld li=e t# =n#<. He is s yin1 s#*ethin1 b#$t *edit ti#n <hich is entirely di%%erent %r#* the rest2 nd I d#nBt =n#< <h t y#$ h ?e d#ne b#$t itB. H#< d# y#$ ns<er it2 ll the rest #% itA D# y#$ thin= there is Centre t O7 i2 c#llecti?e 1r#$+ here t O7 i2 th t c#$ld tell * n %r#* Se ttle <h t it is b#$tA N#t 7$st #ne +ers#n2 y#$ %#ll#<A IB* 7$st <#nderin1 h#< t# *eet this +r#ble*. I c#*e here %r#* Se ttle nd thereBs Dr '#h*2 "ritG2 nd ll #% y#$2 nd I s y2 B3le se2 tell *e b#$t it. IB?e st$died '$ddhis* nd the *edit ti#n #% the '$ddhists nd Ien. IB* % irly ed$c ted l#n1 th#se lines nd I < nt y#$ t# tell *e <h t KBs *edit ti#n isB. C#$ld y#$ d# it th t < yA E)0 S+e =in1 s c#llecti?e 1r#$+2 it <#$ld see* t# *e th t the di%%ic$lty <#$ld be th t there <ill be se?er l +e#+le. ItBs #ne thin1 t# disc$ss it in 1r#$+H itBs n#ther thin1 %#r this * n %r#* Se ttle t# c#*e nd s+e = t# 3r#%ess#r '#h*2 s+e = t# "ritG2 s+e = t# 4yG #% this 1r#$+H he *i1ht 1et di%%erent i*+ressi#ns. K0 Th tBs 7$st itL Th tBs 7$st itL E)0 C#*in1 %r#* y#$ is #ne thin1. D'0 It see*s th t <e h ?e t# est blish th t thereBs #ne *ind here. K0 Th tBs <h t IB* tryin1 t# 1et t. D'0 '$t there is #ne irre%$t ble s#$rce2 nd th t is y#$r #<n <#rds. K0 N#. D#nBt tell *e t# 1# b c= t# the b##=s. IB?e st$died the b##=s. IB* %ed $+ <ith the b##=s. I c#*e here. Y#$Bre 1r#$+ #% +e#+le t O7 i <h# h ?e =n#<n hi* %#r ye rs2 nd I s y t# y#$2 B3le se tell *e b#$t it2 b#$t *edi ti#n nd %e rB. I% "ritG tells *e #ne thin1 nd y#$ tell *e s#*ethin1 else2 IBll s y2 B"#r 1#dBs s =eLB MI0 '$t %#r the +ers#n <h# s ys2 BIB* %ed $+ <ith b##=sB2 thereBs 1re t bi1 d n1er <hich y#$ see ll r#$nd y#$ t#d y2 <hich is th t +e#+le <#nBt t =e the tr#$ble t# listen t# y#$ nd try t# $nderst nd. K0 I =n#< ll th t. IB* seri#$s * n. IB?e s+ent ye rs by *ysel% st$dyin1 ll this. IB?e been t# J + n2 ll this. I =n#< s#*ethin1 b#$t it2 nd I c#*e here2 t# O7 i2 C n d 2 #r t# 'r#c=<##d2 nd I s y2 B3le se2 y#$ h ?e =n#<n hi* %#r ye rs. 3le se tell *eB. I% y#$ s y y#$ re #% di%%erent *inds2 IBll s y2 BMy 1#dL @h t 1r#$+ this isB. E)0 3e#+le <h# h ?e listened t# y#$ ll these ye rs2 they d#nBt 7$st sit there nd t =e <h t y#$ s y. They listen t# y#$ nd then s#*ethin1 h ++ens <ithin the*2 nd s# it isnBt 7$st + ssi?e thin1. K0 N#. S#*ethin1 h ++ens nd they tr nsl te <h t h ++ens in ter*s #% their c#nditi#nin1. There%#re itBs s#*ethin1 t#t lly di%%erent. Th tBs <hy IB* s yin1 it sh#$ld n#t h ++en here. MI0 @e sh#$ldnBt d# nythin1 th t +r#?#=es th t. '$t y#$ y#$rsel%2 Krishn 7i2 c nn#t +re?ent the * n %r#* Se ttle i% heBs 1#in1 t# tr nsl te it int# Christi n Science. K0 N#2 th tBs di%%erent thin1. Here <e sh#$ld n#t. "ritG2 heBs 1#in1 t# be here l#n1er th n *ysel%2 ,6

#r +erh +s Dr '#h*. I c#*e t# "ritG nd I s y2 B)##=2 y#$B?e =n#<n hi* %#r ye rs. Y#$ h ?e t l=ed <ith hi*2 y#$ h ?e listened t# hi*. And I =n#< y#$r b c=1r#$ndH y#$ re scientistH y#$ re +r#%ess#r. D#nBt tr nsl te <h t he s ys in +r#%ess#ri l l n1$ 1e. Th t *e ns y#$ re tr nsl tin1H y#$ re c#nditi#ned by y#$r +r#%ess#rshi+ nd then <h t y#$ h ?e c $1ht y#$ h ?e +$t in th#se <#rds. I d#nBt < nt y#$r +r#%ess#rshi+. I < nt y#$ t# tell *e directly2 n#t cc#rdin1 t# y#$r c#nditi#nin1B. Y#$ %#ll#<A IB* ?ery seri#$s b#$t it. Y#$ c nBt +l y <ith *e. "@0 I thin=2 <ith th t * n2 it is +#ssible t# est blish c#**$nic ti#n. The <#rds <ill n#t be s# i*+#rt nt. O% c#$rse e?ery #ne #% $s *$st $se di%%erent <#rds2 b$t ne?ertheless <e * y c#**$nic te the s *e thin1. K0 N#2 s Dr '#h* +#inted #$t2 <e *$st be #% #ne *ind2 sir. Are y#$ ll #% #ne *indA E)0 I d#nBt $nderst nd <h t th t *e ns. K0 Thin=in1. Y#$ =n#< <h t it *e ns. HeMll tell y#$. D'0 I thin= it *e ns th t <e re re lly in inst nt c#**$nic ti#n2 in < y2 nd th t s#*eti*es #ne sees it in 1r#$+2 th t +e#+le re lly $nderst nd e ch #ther. I% <eBre ll t l=in1 t# this +ers#n %r#* Se ttle2 then e?ery +ers#n is +#intin1 t#< rd the s *e thin12 y#$ see. T)0 IsnBt it re lly D$esti#n #% c#**$nic ti#n *#n1st e ch #ther2 *#n1st $sA K0 Th tBs <h t I * s yin1. Y#$ *$st tr$st e ch #therH y#$ *$st h ?e c#n%idence in e ch #therH y#$ *$st h ?e %%ecti#n. Y#$ $nderst ndA All this. T)0 Yes. @e re #r1 niGin1 b$ildin1s2 <e re d#in1 ll th t2 b$t2 #ther<ise2 d# <e disc$ss this ll t#1etherA K0 ItBs $+ t# y#$2 sir. T)0 Yes2 <ell th tBs <here I thin= the di%%ic$lty is2 re lly2 bec $se <e re b$t n#t #ther<ise. DS0 In d#in1 the #r1 niG ti#n l + rt2 y#$ 1et t# =n#< e ch #ther. T)0 Yes2 b$t thereBs *#re t# it. I thin= <e sh#$ld 1et t#1ether *#re. I% the * n %r#* Se ttle c#*es nd 3r#%ess#r '#h* s ys #ne thin1 nd I s y n#ther thin12 it *e ns <e h ?enBt re lly been ble t# drin= #% the %#$nt in ll t#1ether. K0 I 1i?e it $+ thenH I <#nBt c#*e here. M)0 Sir2 the n t$re #% the #r1 niG ti#n is s$ch th t <e s+end s# *$ch #% #$r ti*e =ee+in1 the #r1 niG ti#n 1#in12 th t thereBs n# ti*e %#r disc$ssi#n. K0 Th tBs 7$st <h t IB* s yin1. Th tBsB <r#n1. Sir2 this sit$ ti#n is 1#in1 t# rise. " ce it n#<. Y#$ re 1#in1 t# h ?e Centre t O7 i. A * n c#*es %r#* Se ttle2 <hich is *e n#<2 nd IB?e been ll #?er the <#rld nd h ?e th#$1ht b#$t ll this 1re t de l. I < nt y#$2 <h# h ?e =n#<n K %#r s#*e ye rs2 t# tell *e <h t K s ys b#$t *edit ti#n. N#t re+e t <h t he s ys2 b$t y#$ re $thentic. 1r#$+2 #r1 niG ti#n lly2

,,

T)0 ThereBs ls# rel$ct nce2 I %eel t le st2 t# ... K0 N#. Y#$B?e n# ri1ht t# %eel rel$ct nt. IB* s=in1 y#$2 nd y#$ s y2 BIB* s#rryH IB* rel$ct ntB. T)0 N#2 b$t I *e n s#*eti*es I d#nBt < nt t# d# +r#+ 1 nd . K0 ItBs n#t +r#+ 1 nd . IB?e c#*e t# y#$. D'0 Krishn 7i2 the di%%ic$lty2 1 in2 is th t <e h ?e tried t# c#n?ey s#*ethin1 %r#* y#$ thr#$1h $s. It ste*s %r#* y#$. K0 It * y ste* %r#* *e2 b$t y#$ h ?e dr$n= t the %#$nt in. I% y#$ h ?e n#t2 <h t re y#$ d#in1A E)0 Th tBs ri1ht. '$t <eBre n#t the %#$nt in. MI0 '$t y#$ s y <e h ?e little $nderst ndin1 bec $se #% this. S#*e #% $s * y %eel2 I d#nBt =n#<2 th t <e h ?e cert in de1ree #% $nderst ndin12 b$t <e ls# * y %eel insec$re b#$t t =in1 the res+#nsibility ... K0 N#. )##=2 M ri . I h ?enBt been ble t# he r the '$ddh H IB?e he rd b#$t hi*2 +e#+le h ?e t l=ed b#$t hi*2 nd I * e4tr #rdin rily interested in <h t he h s s id. And y#$ h ?e =n#<n hi* %#r ye rs nd I s y2 BIBll tr ?el ny dist nce t# %ind #$tB . 'ec $se IB* re lly interested t# %ind #$t <h t y#$ %elt b#$t hi*2 <h t he s id2 h#< *$ch y#$ h ?e i*bibed2 le rned nd ll th t. I c#*e t# y#$ nd y#$ s y2 BIB* s#rry2 <eBre n#t #% #ne *indH <e d#nBt < nt t# re+resent hi*B. I s y2 BC$t #$t ll th tH tell *eB. MI0 I $nderst nd the *#ti?e #% the * n c#*in12 b$t th t * n c#$ld e sily 1# t# s#*e#ne else <h# h snBt ny inhibiti#n2 <h# thin=s they $nderst nd ll th t y#$ s id2 nd <h# <ill 1i?e hi*2 +#ssibly2 s#*ethin1 irres+#nsible. K0 Y#$ re the +e#+le I h ?e c#*e t# bec $se y#$ h ?e =n#<n hi* %#r ye rs. I d#nBt 1# t# s#*e#ne else nd s y2 B@h t did he s yAB Y#$ re n#t 1ettin1 *y +#int. D'0 Y#$Bre s=in1 $s t# be res+#nsible %#r c#**$nic tin1 this s+irit th t h s c#*e %r#* the %#$nt in2 n#t *erely c#**$nic tin1 the <#rds. I thin= I see cert in rel$ct nce %r#* ll #% $s here t# ct$ lly s y th t <e h ?e 1#tten s#*ethin1 %r#* this %#$nt in2 hesit ti#n. K0 IB* the * n %r#* Se ttle. I s y2 BY#$ h ?e =n#<n hi* %#r ye rsH y#$ h ?e t l=ed <ith hi*2 li?ed <ith hi*2 seen hi*2 listened t# his t l=s2 etc. Tell *e <h t y#$ %eel b#$t hi*2 <h t is inside y#$ b#$t hi*B. N#t2 BOh2 he s ys th t .. 2 B I c n re d th t in the b##=s. Y#$ d#nBt see* t# $nderst nd <h t IB* t l=in1 b#$t. E)0 D# y#$ *e n *#re #% +ers#n l thin1A K0 N#. 'ein1 <ith hi*. ItBs li=e bein1 <ith Christ E i% there < s %ind #$t <h t y#$ %eel b#$t hi*. Christ nd IB?e tr ?elled *iles t#

MI0 D# y#$ *e n th t they <#$ld c#*e nd s y2 BIB?e ne?er *et hi*. Y#$ h ?e. Tell *e <h t heBs t l=in1 b#$tBA

,9

K0 Yes. MI0 Th tBs di%%erent. Th tBs n#t s yin12 B@h t h s it d#ne t# y#$AB K0 BTell *e s#*ethin1 b#$t hi*. Tell *e <h t he s id. H ?e y#$ 1#t s#*ethin1 #% itA Y#$2 s 1r#$+. Or y#$ s n indi?id$ l. Tell *e. IB* tre*end#$sly interested. I *i1ht c tch s#*ethin1 %r#* y#$B. And i% y#$ s y2 BIB* s#rry2 <eB?e s+ent #$r li?es in #r1 niG ti#nB2 IBll s y2 B"#r 1#dBs s =e E)0 '$t he s ys it *$ch betterH y#$ c n he r hi* directly #n %il*2 in di l#1$es2 #n ... K0 N#. Y#$ re *issin1 ll the +#int. MI0 Th#se +e#+le < nt s#*e#ne t# e4+l in t# the*. K0 N#2 y#$ h ?e 1#ne #%% the +#int. IBll s y it 1 in. IB?e c#*e %r#* Se ttle. I =n#< 1re t de l b#$t <h t #ther +e#+le h ?e s id b#$t Ien '$ddhis*2 nd #ther *edit ti#n2 S$%i ide s2 nd s# #n. And I he r th t y#$ h ?e =n#<n cert in +ers#n %#r n$*ber #% ye rs2 nd I c#*e t# y#$ nd s y2 B3le se tell *e <h t he h s s id t# y#$2 directly. "r#* y#$ I < nt t# $nderst nd. I =n#< <h t he s idH IB?e listened t# the t +es. I h ?e c#*e here t# %ind #$t <h t it *e ns2 <hether y#$ h ?e 1#t s#*ethin1B. Y#$ $nderst ndA Yesterd y I <ent t# the b rber. I < nt t# 1# nd le rn %r#* M ster ' rber <h t it *e ns t# c$t h ir +r#+erlyL @h t is <r#n1 <ith thisA E)0 Y#$Bre the M ster ' rberL '$t th t d#esnBt * =e $s M ster ' rbers. AK0 '$t <hen K isnBt here2 nd the * n c#*es %r#* Se ttle2 <e re the M ster ' rber. I% <e renBt2 then there isnBt nythin1. K0 Y#$ re the M ster ' rbers. Y#$ d#nBt s y2 BS#rry2 <e re 7$st #r1 niG ti#n l entities. @e d#nBt t l= b#$t it. (# nd re d the b##=s2 listen t# the t +esB. HeBll s y2 B@h t =ind #% 1 n1 is thisA Are they tryin1 t# ?#id s#*ethin1AB K0 I < nt t# =n#< %r#* y#$2 <h# h ?e =n#<n hi* %#r ye rs2 <h t he l##=s li=e2 <h t it %elt li=e. Y#$ %#ll#<A MI0 @ell2 th tBs e sy. Th tBs +ers#n l... K0 I < nt th t. I < nt th t. HellL Y#$Mre *issin1 *y <h#le +#int. Y#$ d#nBt %eel the < y I %eel b#$t it. S#rry. Y#$ =n#< i% I <ere in S#$th Indi E *iles nd *iles2 there <ere n# tr ins E I <#$ld < l= ll th t < y t# %ind #$t <h t the disci+les #% '$ddh s id2 <h t it %elt li=e2 <h t it < s t# %eel <h t they %elt. I d#nBt =n#< <h t they %elt2 I < nt t# %ind #$t. SS0 @ell2 i% y#$ t l=ed t# th t +ers#n ?ery + ssi#n tely2 <ith e4tre*e + ssi#n ... K0 N#. D#nBt tell *e h#< y#$ <ill t l=. I < nt t# =n#< h#< y#$ <ill tell the * n %r#* Se ttle. This is 1#in1 t# rise. I c n ss$re y#$ this is 1#in1 t# rise. M)0 This h ++ens n#<2 <hen y#$Bre n#t in O7 i. K0 E4 ctly. ItBs h ++enin1. Y#$ h ?e t# *eet it.

,8

DS0 H#< d# y#$ e4ist <ith#$t *eetin1 itA K0 I d#nBt =n#< h#< y#$ *eet it. Is 'r#c=<##d2 <ith Mrs Si**#ns2 s yin1 s#*ethin1 di%%erent %r#* Indi A "r#* C n d A Then y#$Bre lre dy dissi+ tin1 the thin12 te rin1 the +et ls %r#* it. MI0 IsnBt it 7$st di%%erent s+ects #% the s *e thin1A K0 My de rL (et the <h#le #% it2 n#t 7$st #ne thin1. I% y#$ re ll s yin1 thin1s di%%erently nd <ith di%%erent c#ntent n#t the <#rds2 the c#ntent then y#$B?e lre dy dissi+ ted it. @h tBs the di%%ic$ltyA I d#nBt $nderst nd this. E)0 The D$esti#n is r ised th t <eBre n#t #% #ne *ind2 +erh +s2 nd I d#nBt thin= <e <#$ld be here i% <e <ere n#t #% #ne *ind. '$t the tr ns*issi#n #% it h s t# be #n n indi?id$ l b sis. K0 N#. I c#*e t# y#$ nd s y2 BTh t * n y#$ re in l#?e <ith2 tell *e b#$t hi*B. @#$ldnBt y#$ tell *eA Y#$Bd be little shy2 b$t y#$Bd tell *e. D'0 Y#$Bre t l=in1 b#$t t<# di%%erent thin1s. Y#$Bre t l=in1 b#$t <h t +ers#n is li=e2 nd y#$Bre t l=in1 b#$t * nBs te chin1s. K0 IB* n#t. I < nt t# =n#< <h t he l##=ed li=e2 <h t he %elt2 <h t he s id. Y#$ c nBt s y2 BS#rry2 itBs t## +ers#n lB2 nd br$sh *e #%%. MI0 The cr$4 is th t the de1ree #% $nderst ndin1 <e h ?e #% y#$r te chin1s is n#t c#ncerned <ith <h t y#$ l##= li=e2 <h t y#$ ...

K0 IB* interested in e?erythin12 %#r 1#dBs s =eL T)0 I d#nBt %eel th t +essi*istic b#$t it. K0 IB* n#t +essi*istic. T)0 HereBs * n c#*in1 %r#* Se ttle. @e *eet2 nd itBs ?ery seri#$s. N#<2 <hen the seri#$sness is there2 I <ill be ble t# 1i?e it t# hi*. 'ec $se IB* 1#in1 t#. K0 Sir2 i% y#$ l#?ed <#* n2 y#$ <#$ld tell *e ll b#$t her2 <#$ldnBt y#$A Y#$r l#?e <#$ld tell *e2 <#$ldnBt itA Th tBs ll I * s yin1. I% '$ddh Bs disci+le is there E he is de d nd th t disci+le l#?ed hi* E he <#$ld tell *e e?erythin1. Th tBs ll IB* s=in1. Are y#$ ll in th t thin1A Th tBs <h t he *e ns by #ne *indA I% y#$Bre ll in l#?e <ith th t <#* n2 I * y re+resent it di%%erently2 y#$ * y tell it di%%erently2 b$t it <#$ld be l#?e s+e =in12 n#t... AK0 N#t c techis*. K0 Yes. E)0 C n th t l#?e2 then2 be tr ns*ittedA K0 N#2 n#. Y#$r l#?e <ill d# s#*ethin1 t# the * n %r#* Se ttle2 n#t y#$r l#?e %#r *e. ,:

SS0 There is l#?ely st#ry b#$t little child <h# h d 1$r$ <h# h d re liGed2 nd s#*e#ne c#*es t# her nd s=s her2 B@ell2 y#$ h ?e seen y#$r 1$r$2 <h t is he li=eAB And she s ys2 My 1$r$2 *y 1$r$B2 nd her % ce 1l#<s nd sheBs in n#ther <#rldH nd he =n#<s. K0 N#. Y#$ see2 I * c#ncerned b#$t this. A%ter ll2 M r=2 M tthe<2 )$=e nd J#hn E <h t is itA E M tthe<2 M r=2 )$=e nd J#hn ll +$t it di%%erently2 ri1htA They in?ented l#t2 IB* D$ite s$re2 b$t they l#?ed th t i* 1e. I thin= <eBd better st#+2 d#nBt y#$A
JRe+#rt #% the Intern ti#n l Tr$steesB *eetin1s in O7 i ,-CC. C#*+iled <ith *ini*$* editin1 %r#* ?erb ti* tr nscri+ts. %irst Meetin12 O7 i2 8rd M rch2 ,-CCK C#+yri1ht ,-CCO,--6 Krishn *$rti "#$nd ti#n Tr$st )i*ited2 'r#c=<##d 3 r=2 H *+shire2 U.K.

,5

n ! shrama"?
K0 Yes2 b$t <h t <ill y#$ ct$ lly d#A )##=2 t O7 i thereBs 1#in1 t# be n B shr * B E th t <#rd h s been r$ined in Indi nd here. In S ns=rit it *e ns +l ce #% retre t. E IB* $sin1 th t <#rd ?ery c re%$lly. ThereBs 1#in1 t# be n B shr * B here nd #?er there. N#<2 <ith the hel+ #% "ritG2 Dr '#h*2 *ysel%2 nd s# #n2 <eBll brin1 it b#$t. N#<2 K is 1#ne. The B shr * B is there. @h t <ill y#$ d#A S$ddenly heBs 1#ne. Disc$ss it. @h t <ill y#$ d# thereA Y#$ c nBt le ?e it t# "ritG2 BJ$st r$n it2 #ld b#y. @e h ?e #ther thin1s t# d#B2 nd 7$st %#r1et it. MI0 It <ill be ?ery di%%erent in #ne senseH b$t <h t is Jt# beK d#ne is n#t 1#in1 t# st rt thenH it *$st st rt ri1ht < y. K0 IB* s yin1 th t. Ah ly 7i h s c#*e %r#* R 71h t nd she is re+resent ti?e #% the <h#le n ti#n #% Indi . She s ys2 B)etBs disc$ssB. It is 1#in1 t# hel+ there2 s# <h t re y#$ 1#in1 t# d#A AC0 Krishn 7i2 e?en <hen y#$ t l= b#$t #ne sch##l2 itBs n#t 7$st the str$ct$re nd this s#rt #% thin1. I thin= <e h ?e t# cl ri%y %#r #$rsel?es ... K0 IB* 1#ne. AC0 ... <h t it *e ns2 the i*+lic ti#ns %#r te chin12 %#r ed$c ti#n. @e h ?e n#t t#$ched e?en the %rin1e #% it2 I =n#<2 in R 71h t2 in Indi 2 nd <e ll h ?e #$r +r#ble*s. ItBs the i*+lic ti#n %#r the te chin1s. I d#nBt thin= <eB?e t#$ched ... K0 I =n#<. Y#$ h ?e n#t. @eBll d# th t n#<. The te chers re here s# <e c n d# th t n#<. TheyBre 1#in1 t# h ?e t# % ce th t +r#ble*. @eB?e 1#t *#nth. '$t n#< I < nt t# =n#< <h t re y#$ 1#in1 t# d# <ith the B shr * B hereA H#< re y#$ 1#in1 t# cre te itA H#< re y#$ 1#in1 t# hel+ it %l#<erA Y#$Bre res+#nsible %#r itH nd y#$2 nd y#$2 ll #% y#$. Y#$ c n disc$ss it. K is 1#ne. @h t <ill y#$ d#A RT0 I d#nBt thin= itBs D$esti#n #% ne< techniD$e2 Krishn *$rti. I thin= <e <ill 1# #n s <eB?e 1#ne #n be%#re2 tryin1 ls# t# enl r1e s# th t <e c n =ee+ in t#$ch <ith ll the #ther br nches. K0 N#2 R$th2 +le se. Y#$Bre 1#in1 t# h ?e n B shr * B hereA Th tBs *y %irst D$esti#n. RT0 A CentreA K0 A BCentreBH <eBll c ll it th t2 %#r the *#*ent. RT0 @ell2 Krishn 7i2 i% y#$ d#nBt *ind2 <e h ?e n#t disc$ssed th t t ll2 re lly. K0 @e h ?enBt. I * 1#neH <h t <ill y#$ d#A RT0 I h ?enBt the sli1htest ide <ith#$t 1ettin1 t#1ether <ith e?eryb#dy else nd disc$ssin1 it. K0 Disc$ss it. Disc$ss it. MI0 Y#$ =ee+ stressin1 y#$r bein1 1#ne s th#$1h th t <ere %$t$re +r#ble*. ItBs +r#ble* n#<. ,.

K0 IB* 7$st tellin1 y#$ I * 1#ne n#<. IB* silent < tcher. RT0 @#$ld y#$ #+en disc$ssi#n #n the CentreA K0 I <#nBt d# th t n#<. I 7$st < nt y#$ t# % ce the +r#ble*s2 y#$ seeA RT0 In < y2 Krishn 7i2 <e re % cin1 the +r#ble*s e?ery d y. ItBs #nly t# dd <h t y#$ <#$ld s+eci%ic lly li=e2 th t is t# be dded. K0 N#. RT0 Then <e sh#$ld d# e4 ctly <h t <e h ?e d#ne $ntil n#<2 nd h#+e%$lly *#re. D'0 @e d#nBt h ?e th t D$ite cle r yet2 <h t Krishn 7i <#$ld li=e. DS0 '$t d#esnBt s#*ethin1 1r#< in itsel%A I *e n2 y#$ 1et 1r#$+. %irst thereBs M r= #nly2 here. Then 1r#$+ #% te chers c#*eH then + rents be1in t# c#*eH then st$dentsH nd they be1in t# be + rt #% the Centre2 by <#r=in1 nd + rtici+ tin1 nd s# #n. K0 Yes. N#<2 K 1#es < y. @ill the Centre dieA DS0 Y#$ d#nBt =n#<2 b$t... K0 @ it2 h < it. M r= )ee ... DS0 E4 ctly. K0 N#2 n#2 *y d rlin1. S#rry2 7$st *in$te. M r= )ee h d K behind hi*. His n *eH ri1htA Th tBs <hy the + rents c *e2 ll the rest #% it. K dies2 nd heBs le%t there2 #r y#$ re ll le%t <ith it. Y#$ re n#t % cin1 the +r#ble*. I =n#< <h t I <#$ld d# i% I < s there. ItBs ?ery cle r %#r *e. Y#$ re < itin1 %#r *e t# tell y#$. @h t I * tryin1 t# s y is2 c n <e ll hel+ e ch #ther t# %l#<erH hel+ t# %l#<er the sch##ls2 the "#$nd ti#ns2 the shr * sA Th tBs ll IB* s yin1. And the +e#+le <h# re res+#nsible2 Ah ly 2 M r= )ee2 nd "ritG nd %#$r #% $s +$t #$r he ds t#1ether nd s y2 B)##= <h t is the ri1ht thin1 t# d# in ll these +l cesAB E'0 The %irst thin1 is t# b$ild c n t l=. Centre E they re < itin1 t# c#*e <here they c n st y2 <here they

K0 I =n#<2 theyBre < itin1 t# c#*e. E'0 Th t <ill 1r#<. Th tBs the seed #% it. K0 S# letBs 1# b c= nd settle #ne #r t<# thin1s. I $sed the <#rd B +e4B t# c#n?ey 1r#$+ #% +e#+le re+resentin1 ? ri#$s "#$nd ti#ns2 <h# <ill h#ld the <h#le thin1 t#1ether. @e ll * y %eel res+#nsible %#r O7 i2 %#r C n d 2 b$t <e re *iles < y2 nd s# there *$st be s#*e 1r#$+ #% +e#+le t# tr ?el r#$nd. @e <ill disc$ss the det ils l ter. S$ch 1r#$+ *$st e4ist t# h#ld the <h#le t#1ether2 s K is d#in1. Th tBs ll *y +#int. I% y#$ 1ree in +rinci+le2 then <e c n disc$ss in det il. @e h ?enBt 1reed in +rinci+le. Th tBs <h t 3$+$l7i nd ll the rest %r#* Indi < nt2 s#*e#ne t# li ise. Y#$ %#ll#<A

,C

D'0 They * y n#t 1# s# % r s t# E i% thereBs tr#$ble in #ne #% these +l ces t# * =e criticis* #% the =ind y#$ * de in Indi . MC0 C#$ld this be s#*ethin1 <e +#nder #n nd then *eet little l terA K0 Yes2 yes. Th tBs <hy I s y <e *$st h ?e #$t #% it.

?ery seri#$s

*#nthH t# br##d2 t l= t#1ether2 nd s#*ethin1 c#*es

T)0 A%ter ll2 itBs n#t D$esti#n #% intensity. Y#$ s y th t2 BI <#$ld =n#< e4 ctly <h t t# d#B. N#< i% s#*e#ne h s intensity ... K0 @e h ?enBt 1#t it2 sir. T)0 @e <#nBt disc$ss sche*es2 i% <e didnBt =n#< <h t t# d#2 <ith this intensity. MI0 I <#$ld t =e iss$e <ith th t2 i% I * y. I thin= t# s y <e <#$ld =n#< <h t t# d# <hen the ti*e c#*es ... @eBre here t# disc$ss <h t <ill h ++en. Ob?i#$sly the intensity <ill h ?e t# %$ncti#n <ithin th t. '$t letBs n#t s y2 B@ell2 <eBll %i1$re it #$t l ter2 nd intensity2 #r s#*e intelli1ence2 <ill tell $sB. @e re here t# decide these thin1s. K0 D#nBt 1# #%% #n +#int2 n#<. I < nt t# %ind #$t i%2 in +rinci+le2 <e sh#$ld h ?e +ers#n li=e K E n#t <ith the $r nd ll the b$siness r#$nd hi* E b$t 7$st <h# h#lds the "#$nd ti#ns t#1ether2 1r#$+ <h# <ill h#ld the thin1 t#1ether2 s K h#lds it t#1ether. 'ec $se he 1#es r#$nd E three *#nths here2 three *#nths t 'r#c=<##d2 nd s# #n E he h#lds it t#1ether. DS0 '$t th tBs KL K0 Yes2 *y de r. IB* s yin1 + rt %r#* K. C n s#*e#ne h#ld it t#1ether2 s#*e#ne <h#Bll criticiGe2 s y thin1s re <r#n1 nd2 B)etBs <#r= t itB. Other<ise2 IB?e %eelin1 itBll ll 1# t# +ieces. @hen I s=2 letBs t l= b#$t it. Is it the ri1ht thin1 t# d#2 #r the <r#n1 thin1 t# d#A @hy d#es K 1# t# Indi nd criticiGe nd they + y ttenti#nA @hyA 'ec $se they thin= they res+ect hi*. They thin= he *i1ht h ?e s#*e cl rity2 insi1ht2 s# they res+ect hi*. And they s y2 B@h t d# y#$ thin=AB2 nd I s y2 BN#2 <h t d# y#$ thin=AB IB?e been thr#$1h ll th t <ith the*. S#2 c n <e cre te s$ch 1r#$+ #% +e#+le2 <ithin the ne4t ten ye rs2 be%#re I +#+ #%%2 <h# <ill criticiGe2 <h# <ill see2 <h# <ill e4ercise .. Y#$ seeH 1r#$+2 * ybe #% t<# %r#* En1l nd2 t<# %r#* Indi 2 t<# %r#* C n d 2 t<# %r#* O7 i2 <h# <ill s y0 B@e re i*+ers#n lH <e d#nBt re+resent C n d 2 #r Indi 2 #r A*eric 2 #r En1l nd. @e re 1r#$+ #% +e#+le <h# re c#*+letely c#**itted t# the te chin1s nd <e < nt t# see th t y#$ re d#in1 the ri1ht thin1BA @hich K is d#in1. They <ill res+ect y#$ nd cce+t i% they %eel y#$ re lly *e n this. C n <e2 s 1r#$+2 cre te th tA I thin= th tBs <h t she *e nt by the <#rd2 B*#reB. Other<ise2 in Indi they h ?e bri1ht2 'r h* nic l *indsH <ellE#iled. H*A @eBll t#++le y#$ #?er. E'0 Sir2 re y#$ s+e =in1 n#< #% +er* nent b#dyA K0 N#2 ch n1e. 1r#$+ #% +e#+le2 * ybe +er* nent2 * ybe i*+er* nent2 d#esnBt * tter. They * y

E'0 Indi?id$ ls * y ch n1e <ithin the 1r#$+A K0 D#esnBt * tter. A 1r#$+ #% +e#+le <h# <ill be res+ected in C n d 2 in Indi 2 in 'r#c=<##d2 nd ,/

here. MI0 @#$ld this 1r#$+ c#*e int# bein1 n#<A K0 Yes. @ithin *y li%eti*e. My li%eti*e * y be <ee= #r ten ye rs. E)0 Are y#$ s yin1 the %l *e *$st be < =ened in $s ... K0 Res+ected. Y#$ h ?e li?ed <ith K %#r s# * ny ye rs nd y#$ h ?e been his %riend. Y#$ h ?e < l=ed <ith hi*H y#$ h ?e d#ne e?erythin1 <ith hi* t#1ether. Other<ise +e#+le <#$ldnBt c#*e here2 i% y#$ re n#t res+ected. IsnBt th t s#A S#2 d$rin1 the *#nth2 c n <e t l= it #?er t#1ether nd see th t s$ch 1r#$+ is %#r*ed <ithin *y li%eti*eA S# th t <hen K dies there is2 t le st2 1r#$+ <h#* +e#+le <ill s y c n be res+ected2 nd n#t #nly the b##=sA I h ?e n# #ther interest. IB* n#t * rriedH IB* n#t se4$ lH it d#esnBt interest *eH *#ney2 +#+$l rityH n#thin1. T# *e the #ther thin1 is t#t l nd c#*+lete. S#2 <hen y#$ h ?e th t =ind #% %eelin12 they res+ect y#$. ItBs #nly s$ch 1r#$+ th t <ill h#ld the thin1 t#1ether. Other<ise itBs 1#ne. Ri1htA I <#r= t th t thin1H itBs *y 7#b. '$t y#$ h ?e t# hel+ *e in this. A1reedA All ri1ht. S# <h tBs the ne4t thin1A @h tBs the ti*eA
JSelected nd edited %r#*0 Re+#rt #% the Intern ti#n l Tr$steesB Meetin1s in O7 i2 ,-CC C#*+iled <ith *ini*$* editin1 %r#* ?erb ti* tr nscri+ts. Sec#nd *eetin12 O7 i2 5th M rch2 ,-CCK C#+yri1ht ,-CCO,--6 Krishn *$rti "#$nd ti#n Tr$st )i*ited2 'r#c=<##d 3 r=2 H *+shire2 U.K.

,-

The du#t Centre

K0 N#< the d$lt centre. M)0 Sir2 re <e t l=in1 b#$t the d$lt centre2 O7 i2 #r ll the d$lt centresA K0 All the d$lt centres2 bec $se itBs ll #ne. I% y#$ e4+eri*ent in #ne < y nd hel+ Indi th t < y #r 'r#c=<##d2 y#$Bll be inde+endent b$t t#1ether. N#< <h t is the %$ncti#n #% the d$lt centreA @hy sh#$ld it e4ist t llA C n <e st rt %r#* th t D$esti#nA @hy sh#$ld it e4istA I thin= it sh#$ld e4ist bec $se it <ill hel+ the sch##ls. @ill it hel+ the sch##lsA Th tBs #ne +#int. Sec#nd2 #$t #% th t2 +e#+le <h# c#*e t# the d$lt centre2 there * y be +e#+le <h# * y be interested in te chin1 in the sch##l2 s# they <ill be %r#* <h#* y#$ c n 1et te chers. Th tBs ll #ne +#int. @ith ll #% th t2 <hy sh#$ld it e4istA In +rinci+le2 sh#$ld <e h ?e itA @eBll st rt by D$esti#nin1 e?erythin1. Then2 <hen <e h ?e D$esti#ned e?erythin12 <e c n be1in t# see <h t is ri1ht. I d#nBt =n#< i% y#$ see ... S# <e re d#$btin1 <hether it sh#$ld e4ist t ll. @hen y#$ be1in <ith d#$bt2 y#$ end <ith cert intyH b$t i% y#$ st rt <ith cert inty2 y#$ end $+ in d#$bt. S#2 %ter th t little ser*#n2 <e c n +r#ceedL S#2 I <#$ld h ?e it bec $se y#$ 1 ther #lder 1ener ti#ns %#r three #r %#$r <ee=s t O7 i2 %#r inst nce2 disc$ss <ith the*2 t l= t# the* n#t s in%eri#r nd s$+eri#r2 s eD$ ls E t# disc$ss2 enD$ire2 +enetr te2 $nderst nd. And they 1# #$t t the end #% three <ee=s nd n#ther 1r#$+ c#*es2 nd s# #n. This c#nst nt %l#<2 in nd #$t2 th t <ill hel+ t# cre te sense #% li?in1 thin1. I% K is here2 th t <#$ld h ++en2 ri1htA There <#$ld be +l ce t# *eetH I <#$ld *eet the* e?ery #ther d y %#r three <ee=s. Then I <#$ld t =e rest nd be1in 1 in. S# there <ill be c#nst nt in nd #$t. And ls# it <ill hel+ t# * =e the thin12 n#t ?erb l2 s$+er%ici l thin12 b$t re lly li?in1 thin1. Ri1ht2 sirA Y#$Bre sh =in1 y#$r he d. T)0 I < s thin=in1 b#$t + rents. K0 Oh2 + rents2 ll th t2 e?eryb#dy. It <ill hel+ the sch##l nd it <ill hel+ the +e#+le <h# re interested in the te chin1sH they <ill c#*e t#1ether ... And th t is <hy <e sh#$ld h ?e it. M)0 D# y#$ see this t<el?e *#nth2 #nE1#in1 thin12 #r in these se1*ents #% ti*e th t y#$ <ere t l=in1 b#$t2 three <ee=sA K0 Yes2 three <ee=s E here they reH y#$ c n disc$ss <ith ll #% $s three <ee=s2 IB* #nly s yin1 three <ee=s. @e tried it in Eerde2 H#ll nd. @hen <e h d Eerde2 the c stle2 there $sed t# be three <ee=s <hen +e#+le c *e2 nd I < s there t# disc$ss <ith the*. They <ent < y nd n#ther 1r#$+ c *e. As l#n1 s I < s there2 th t h ++ened. I% there is s#*eb#dy +er* nently here2 s .... "ritG2 y#$2 #r 4yG <ere here2 it <#$ld be ll the ye r r#$nd. E4ce+t y#$ *$st h ?e h#lid y nd 1# < y nd ll the rest2 b$t it <#$ld be %#$nt in th tBs %l#<in1 ll the ye r r#$nd. At le st2 th tBs h#< I see it. 3le se2 IB* #nly st tin1 ... 3le se2 letBs disc$ss it. And <ill "ritG2 y#$2 #thers hel+ t# cre te thisA Here. Dr '#h* c#*es t<# #r three *#nths t# C li%#rni nd he c n 1i?e s#*e #% his ti*e2 his ener1ies2 his c + city t# this. H*A T# hel+ "ritG nd y#$. And he 1#es < y t the end #% three *#nths. @ill y#$ be ble t# c rry #nA And h#< <ill y#$ c rry #nA @h tBs y#$r res+#nsibilityA H#< 96

<ill y#$ d# itA I% y#$ ll 1ree itBs i*+#rt nt t# h ?e n E I d#nBt li=e the <#rd d$lt centre2 b$t IBll c ll it the d$lt centre %#r the *#*ent. i% y#$ ll thin= itBs i*+#rt nt t# h ?e s$ch centre2 then there is "ritG here. Y#$ %#ll#<2 sirA @h t <ill he d#A @eBll 1# ste+ by ste+. 'r#c=<##d nd Indi nd ls# C n d . I% I < s in "ritGBs +l ce E IB* n#t2 IB* 7$st s$11estin1 E I =n#< <h t I <#$ld d# here. IB* n#t s+e =in1 s K2 b$t IB* * n <h# is in ch r1e #% the O7 i centre E Bin ch r1eB in D$#tes2 in the sense n#t the b#ss #% it2 n#t in $th#rity E b$t #ne #% the +e#+le hel+in1 there E i% I < s n#t K2 nd y#$ h ?e ++#inted *e t# Bt =e ch r1eB #% the centre2 *y %$ncti#n <#$ld be2 h ?in1 he rd K nd bein1 dee+ly interested in KBs te chin1s2 nd li?in1 it2 n#t 7$st ?erb lly s yin1 I 1ree <ith it2 b$t ct$ lly li?in1 it2 I <#$ld 1 ther +e#+le r#$nd *e nd I <#$ld c#*e there nd s y2 B)##=2 IB?e he rd K t l= nd I h ?e $nderst##d <h t he h s s id. I * n#t interested in +$ttin1 *y ide s b#$t itB E I <#nder i% IB* c#n?eyin12 ri1htA E B*y #+ini#ns2 *y e? l$ ti#n2 bec $se I h ++en t# be +hysicist nd ll th t2 b$t IB* re lly interested in <h t he h s s id2 nd s# I < nt t# tell y#$ <h t he h s s id. Act$ lly. @h t I %eel in *y #<n <#rds2 the thin1 I %eel he h s c#n?eyed t# *eB. H*A Ri1ht2 sirA S#2 I +$t side *y +ers#n lity2 *y #+ini#ns2 *y 7$d1e*ents2 *y c + city s +hysicist2 #r dentist2 #r <h te?er I *. Th tBs irrele? nt t# *e. IB* there t# c#n?ey the thin1 <hich I h ?e $nderst##d2 <hich I * li?in12 <hich is t# *e the *#st +r#%#$nd thin1 in *y li%e. I <#$ld disc$ss <ith the*2 n#t s $th#rity2 n#t s sserti?e2 n#thin1. I <#$ld s y2 B)etBs t l= b#$t thisH letBs t#1ether in?esti1 te. Y#$Bre 1#in1 t# be here three <ee=sH <eBll *eet e?ery #ther d y2 #r <h te?er it is2 nd <#r= t it. S# th t <hen y#$ le ?e y#$ h ?e c $1ht s#*ethin1 #% th tH n#t #% <h t I * s yin1H #% th tB. Y#$ %#ll#<A BO% th t thin1 <hich he h s s idB. Th tBs h#< I <#$ld #+er te i% I < s here. S# there is n# +ers#n in?#l?ed in itH t#t lly2 bs#l$tely2 i*+ers#n l. Th t < y it h s 1#t tre*end#$s ?it lity. I d#nBt =n#< i% y#$ %eel th t < yA Y#$ $nderst nd2 sirA I c#*e %r#* Se ttle. I * the Se ttle * n t#d y. I c#*e %r#* Se ttleH I *eet "ritG2 nd y#$2 nd %e< #% y#$. I s y2 B)##=2 tell *e. I < nt t# =n#< e?erythin12 n#t *erely his te chin1s. I < nt t# h ?e th t +er%$*e2 th t t*#s+here2 th t sense #% <h te?er it is2 i**ensity nd ll th t. I < nt t# $nderst nd ll th tB. S#2 i% y#$ s y2 BS#rry2 I d#nBt =n#<. Re d the b##=sB2 heBll s y2 BIB?e re d the b##=s in Se ttle. I c#*e here2 n#t t# re d the b##=s b$t t# <#r= t#1ether2 t# %ind #$t <h t itBs ll b#$tB. C n y#$ s$++ly itA Th tBs the D$esti#n. C n y#$2 "ritG2 <h#e?erBs 1#in1 t# be here2 c n y#$ s$++ly th tA ItBs the s *e thin1 in shr * s in Indi 2 <hich they re 1#in1 t# h ?e in R 71h t nd Rishi ; lley. Y#$B?e lre dy st rted the b ll r#llin1 in R 71h t. S#2 i% <e ll 1ree t# this2 <ill y#$ d# itA @hen N r y n2 the ne< 3rinci+ l2 1#es there2 heBs 1#in1 t# d# it. IB?e lre dy t l=ed t# hi*. @eBll see th t he +$shes th t. S#2 i% <e ll 1ree t# this2 <ill y#$ d# itA MI0 Krishn 7i2 there re * ny2 I thin=2 <h# <ill c#*e n#t #nly t# %ind #$t b$t t# +eddle their #<n n#ti#ns. K0 O% c#$rse2 th tBs $nderst##d. @eBll s##n +$t the* #$t. I% IB* M h rshi Y#1i2 I < nt t# +eddle th t2 #r Krishn C#nsci#$sness2 #r s#*e #ther ... They sh#< the*sel?es #%% ?ery D$ic=ly2 nd I s y2 BO$tB. MI0 @ell2 s$++#se s#*e#ne c#*es <ith seri#$sly disc$ss ... K0 H ?e y#$ le%t itA 9, b c=1r#$nd in s#*e #ther ide nd re lly < nts t#

MI0 @ell2 d# <e de* nd th t they ... K0 I <#$ld. MC0 @ell2 s$++#se th t they re enD$irin1 ... K0 EnD$irin1 is di%%erent thin1. '$t i% I s y2 BIB* 1#in1 t# stic= t# *y 1$r$ nd heBs better th n y#$r 1$r$2 letBs %i1ht it #$tB. IBll stic= t# *y 1$r$ nd s y2 B@ell2 IB?e c#*e here <ith th t %i4ed n#ti#n2 <h t c n y#$ d# <ith *eAB I% y#$Bre sensiti?e nd D$ic= en#$1h2 y#$ <ill s+#t it in %i?e *in$tes. @h t <ill y#$ d# <ith s$ch * nA @ill y#$ =ee+ hi* #$tA E'0 There <ill l< ys be the +#ssibility #% ch n1e ... K0 Yes2 b$t he is n#t 1#in1 t# ch n1e. He s ys2 B@ell2 IB?e %#$nd th t s tis%yin1 t# *e.B Y#$ see2 they re de+endent #n s tis% cti#n nd2 BTh t s tis%ies *eH I h ?e st$died itB. )i=e th t * n I *et the #ther d yH he s id2 BIB* +r ctisin1 =n#<led1eB. Y#$ =n#<2 th t ... E <h t is th tA E th t b#y2 =n#< <h t it *e ns2 I h ?e $nderst##d itH itBs *y tr$th2 *y li%eH it is the *#st * r?ell#$s thin1B. And itBs %i4ed. He c#*es t# y#$ nd s ys2 PYesMH nd his intenti#n is t# c#n?ert y#$ t# th t. MI0 I% s#*e#ne c#*es t# $s nd s ys2 BI bel#n1 t# the s$chE ndEs$ch *#n stery $+ t S n "r ncisc# nd IBd li=e t# c#*e nd t l= <ith y#$ nd disc$ss these * ttersB ... A K0 Disc$ss2 <ith *e. '$t y#$ re n#t 1#in1 t# ch n1e. Y#$ %#ll#<A BDisc$ss <ith *eB. IBll s y2 BC#*eB. '$t i% <e s y2 BN# *eth#d2 n# syste*2 +r ctice2 n# ...B E y#$ %#ll#<A E they re st$c=. D'0 Y#$ h ?e t# ns<er the * n <hen he s ys th t2 BY#$ =n#<2 y#$Bre st$c= t##B. HeBs 1#in1 t# r1$e th t y#$ t## re st$c=2 y#$ see. K0 Oh2 yes2 IB?e h d th t t##. M)0 Sir2 there re * ny +e#+le <h# re in the b$siness #% c#*+ r ti?e reli1i#n2 c#*+ r ti?e %#r*s #%.... nd they en7#y 1#in1 t# ll the centres t# +l y <ith these ide s. Are <e #+en t# +e#+le li=e th tA K0 Th tBs <h t IB* s=in1. @h t <ill y#$ d# <ith th tA E'0 @ell2 c#$ldnBt #ne be #+en t# the*2 b$t n#t +er* nentlyA K0 '$t then y#$Bre st$c= <ith the* %#r three <ee=s. E'0 @ell2 three <ee=s is sh#rt +eri#d #% ti*e. K0 Ah2 n#. T)0 '$t the #thers re seri#$s. K0 Th tBs it. @h t h ++ens t# the #thersA I c n de l <ith the Krishn C#nsci#$sness +e#+le ?ery <ell. MC0 D#esnBt it de* nd th t be%#re y#$ e*b r= #n 99 threeE<ee= sessi#n th t i% +#ssible they c#*e

%irst nd *eet %#r d y <ith s#*e#ne li=e "ritG2 <h# t l=s <ith the*A K0 Yes2 yesH d#. Y#$ c n *eet the* %e< d ys be%#reh nd2 nd ch##se2 nd ll the rest #% it. '$t re <e 1#in1 t# Bc#n?inceB s#*eb#dyA Is th t <h t <e reA MI0 This is the + rt #% the <#rld <here +e#+le re b#$nd t# h ?e %%ili ti#ns t# endless #dd +ers$ si#ns. K0 Th tMs 7$st it. S# <h t is #$r %$ncti#nA )etBs be cle r #n th t. Y#$ tell *e. Y#$ disc$ss2 "ritG nd y#$. Y#$Bre 1#in1 t# be here. @h tBs #$r %$ncti#nA E)0 As the d$lt centreA I <#$ld %eel th t #$r %$ncti#n is t# h ?e +l ce <here +e#+le c n c#*e <h# re seri#$sly interested2 <h# h ?e re d b##= #r he rd b#$t hi* nd <h# re seri#$sly interested t# c#*e t# %ind #$t2 n#t %irst h nd2 b$t inti* tely2 <h t itBs ll b#$t2 <h t it *e ns t# the +e#+le <h#B?e been there2 #r <h# re there2 nd hel+ the* t# cl ri%y it %#r the*sel?es. K0 T# hel+ e ch #ther. @ill y#$ d# th tA I c#*e %r#* Se ttle nd IB?e re d 1re t de l2 IB?e st$died 1re t de l0 Ien2 Tibet n *edit ti#n2 the ? ri#$s *edit ti#ns #% Indi 2 nd s# #n. I c#*e there. @ill y#$ r1$e2 disc$ssA Y#$ %#ll#< *y +#int2 sirA )##=2 IB?e c#*e <ith ll this =n#<led1e2 nd I s y2 BI < nt t# disc$ss <ith y#$ <h t K s ys b#$t *edit ti#n. He s ys s#*ethin1 t#t lly di%%erent %r#* ll the #ther thin1s <hich IB?e c#llected. Tell *e <h t it is b#$t. I < nt t# disc$ss <ith y#$H I < nt t# enD$ireB. T)0 Th t <#$ld c#*e $+ ?ery D$ic=ly. @hen y#$ % ce Y#$ i**edi tely est blish +ers#n l c#nt ct. +ers#n2 his %%ecti#n2 #b?i#$sly y#$ d#.

K0 Yes2 sir. A+ rt %r#* th t. I < nt 1##d br in t# *eet *y br in. T)0 @ell2 <eMd d# the best <e c n. K0 Ah2 n#2 n#. I < nt 1##d Jbr inK2 y#$ =n#< <e *et the* E re*e*ber in 'en res th#se +e#+leA E 1re t sch#l rs nd +$ndits nd Tibet n *#n=sH y#$ =n#<2 hi1h $+. @ill y#$ *eet s$ch +e#+leA And b#<l the* #?erL N#t 7$st s y2 BI 1ree <ith y#$B2 b$t =n#c= the* #?erA Y#$ %#ll#<A S#rry t# +$t it th t < y. Other<ise y#$Bre 1#in1 t# * =e it y#$ =n#<A T)0 @ith#$t ++e rin1 rr#1 nt b#$t it2 I thin= <e c n d# it. K0 All ri1ht. @eBll see. There it is2 y#$Bre 1#in1 t# h ?e centre. ItBs $+ t# y#$. E'0 Sir2 <#$ld y#$ *e n t# re%$te their r1$*ents2 bec $se i% they c#*e $+ <ith ... K0 N#t #nly re%$te their r1$*ents2 b$t ls# 1# bey#nd the*. Sh#< the* h#< sh ll#< nd re+etiti?e E'0 S# #ne <#$ldnBt necess rily h ?e t# s+e = <ith n inti* te =n#<led1e #% the ? ri#$s reli1i#ns2 nd TM2 nd s# #nA K0 N#2 I =n#< n#thin1 b#$t ll th t. Sh ll <e d# it2 sir2 n#< <hile IB* hereA H*A @hy c nBt <e d# th tA C n <e2 sirA

98

"@0 @h tA Meet t# disc$ssA @e re d#in1 this lre dyH +e#+le <h# c#*e ... K0 C n <e d# s#*ethin1 <hile I * hereA All #% $s2 ll #% $s2 c n <e *eet s$ch +e#+leA I < nt t# d# it <hile I * hereH <hile <e re ll here. E'0 C#$ldnBt y#$ send #$t t# +e#+le y#$ =n#< <h# re lre dy interested2 nd they c#$ld cc#**#d te the*sel?es in O7 i <hile y#$ re ll here nd h ?e *eetin1 ... K0 I thin= it <ill hel+ hi* l ter. M)0 I thin= <e c#$ld 1et s* ll 1r#$+ t#1ether. ThereBs <ee= in bet<een. K0 Then 1# he d2 sir. D# it. S# <h tBs the %$ncti#n #% the d$lt centreA I thin= y#$ h ?e t# h ?e E i% I * y s$11est2 h ?in1 tried it E ten t# %i%teen +e#+le. A%ter t<# #r three d ys y#$ 1et t# =n#< e ch #therBs *inds ?ery D$ic=ly nd it bec#*es *#n#t#n#$s. '$t i% y#$ h ?e *#re th n %i%teen E bet<een t<entyE%i?e nd thirty E then itBs c#nst nt... y#$ =n#< ... I thin= th tBs b#$t the ri1ht n$*ber2 thirty. D'0 H#< * ny re y#$ thin=in1 #%A K0 Ab#$t thirty. D'0 I thin= th t *i1ht be l#t t# 1et t#1ether. K0 IB* n#t s$re. "#r three <ee=s2 n#t 7$st t<# d ys2 <ee=ends. @hen there re thirty +e#+le it * =es it *$ch *#re li?e. @eB?e e4+eri*ented <ith this in Eerde. @e h d ten +e#+le ... it bec *e ... <e 1#t t# =n#< e ch #ther ?ery <ell. @e then *#?ed t# t<enty nd th tBs *$ch t## s* ll. 'et<een t<entyE%i?e nd thirty2 I thin=2 is b#$t ri1ht. MI0 Krishn 7i2 <#$ld y#$ c#nsider h ?in1 cert in #% these three <ee= +eri#ds %#r te chers #nly2 #n ed$c ti#nA K0 N#2 te chersB tr inin1 <#$ld be entirely di%%erent. @eBre t l=in1 #% the d$lt centre. AC0 The +#int is2 <#$ld th t be the res+#nsibility #% the d$lt centre2 ls#A @#$ld #ne threeE<ee= +eri#d be de?#ted t# ed$c ti#nA K0 Oh2 yes. H ?e th t. E)0 Krishn 7i2 <hy d# y#$ di%%erenti te bet<een the %$ncti#n #% the d$lt centre nd the disc$ssi#n #% the d$lt centre %r#* the ed$c ti#n ... A K0 IBll tell y#$ <hy. A 1 therin1 #% te chers2 they < nt t# disc$ss h#< t# te ch2 h#< t# tr ns*it the te chin1s t# the st$dents2 nd they re c#ncerned <ith th t. And th tBs ?ery i*+#rt nt2 b$t <eBre t l=in1 b#$t the centre. As y#$ s y2 1i?e the* three <ee=s2 %#r the sch##l2 %#r the te chers. And the rest #% the ti*e %#r the #thers. R'0 '$t there * y ls# be te chers <h# re ls# interested in sel%EenD$iry nd the rele? nce #% sel%E enD$iry t# te chin1. @#$ld the d$lt centre ls# #%%er +l ce %#r s#*e#ne <h# < nted t# c#*e %#r <ee= %#r *edit ti#nA They < nt D$iet +l ceH they < nt +l ce in the K centreH they <#$ld li=e 9:

b##=sH they <#$ld li=e t# *edit te. N# threeE<ee= thin1 s s$ch2 b$t they <#$ld li=e t# c#*e nd s+end s#*e ti*e. K0 '$t then it 1ener lly de1ener tes int# ... AC0 I =n#<. This h s b#thered *e bec $se there re enD$iries b#$t this nd s#*eti*es they b$se it by bein1 #?erEc#*%#rt ble. K0 Th tBs it. S#2 the d$lt centreH <e need it2 ri1htA @e ll 1ree. And <e ll 1ree itBs +l ce <here +e#+le c#*e t# disc$ss2 n#t 7$st ch tterH t# disc$ss2 in?esti1 te2 e4+l#re2 nd t# 1# int# it ?ery dee+ly. And the +e#+le <h# re de lin1 <ith this re n#t #%%erin1 #+ini#ns2 7$d1e*ents2 etc.H they re n#t +$ttin1 #$t their c#nditi#nin1. Ri1htA They re re lly there2 n#t s re+resent ti?es #% the te chin1s2 b$t s re+resent ti?es #% th t <hich they h ?e re lly $nderst##d2 nd re li?in1 it. Ri1htA I thin= th tBs cle r. Ri1ht2 sirA S#2 %r#* th t2 <h t d# <e d#A They *$st h ?e +l ce t# li?e2 n#t in h#tels nd #$tside2 b$t inside. There *$st be ... M)0 It cert inly dds t# the t*#s+here. K0 @e need th t. "@0 I thin= th t li?in1 t#1ether is essenti l. K0 ItBs essenti l2 yes. E t t#1ether nd ll the rest #% it. N#t % ll in l#?e <ith e ch #therBs <i?es #r h$sb nds2 th#$1hL E)0 H#< re <e 1#in1 t# st#+ th tA K0 (#d =n#<s. S# ll ri1ht2 <e need +l ce %#r thirty +e#+le t# st y. They c n e t <ith the sch##l. I thin= th tBs ?ery 1##d ide 2 %#r the* t# e t <ith the children t the sch##l. And +l ce <here they c n * =e their #<n te little bit2 y#$ =n#<2 li=e t 'r#c=<##d. And they st y %#r three <ee=s. N# #ne st ys there +er* nently. They d#nBt t =e r##ts there. I thin= th tBs ?ery i*+#rt nt2 d#nBt y#$A @hen <ill it be re dy t# st rtA MI0 T<# ye rs. K0 H#< l#n1A MI nd E'0 T<# ye rs. K0 Oh2 Jes$s ... E'0 At le st2 t le st. K0 S# <h t sh ll <e d# in the *e nti*eA MI0 TheyBll h ?e t# li?e s#*e<here else. M)0 Y#$ c#$ldnBt %ind en#$1h cc#**#d ti#n in #ne ... K0 A *#tel. 95

M)0 Krishn 7i2 theyBre s# dre d%$l. K0 I =n#<2 b$t... <h t b#$t itA @e ll e t t#1ether in *#telA S+end ll d y here.

T)0 ThereBs ?ery nice h#tel2 )e C +ri. @e c#$ld reser?e the <h#le three <ee=s %#r the*. K0 The <h#le three <ee=sA Yes. D# it n#<. HeBs here2 y#$Bre hereH I s y2 st rt it2 *#?e it. M)0 It <ill 1# #n ll the ti*e2 bet<een y#$r ?isitsA ItBs n#t 7$st <hen y#$Bre hereA K0 N#2 n#. O% c#$rse n#t. Then i% I * de d2 <h t <ill y#$ d#A ItBs centre <hich is li?in12 <hether K is here2 #r K is n#t here. I thin= <e c n d# th t in R 71h t nd Rishi ; lley. And they < nt t# d# this in M dr s t##. "@0 @h t <#$ld +e#+le d# <hen they c#*e $+ here in the d yA @h t <ill they d# d$rin1 the <h#le d yA K0 E?ery *#rnin1 y#$ *eet2 disc$ss. A%ter ll2 y#$ *eet in the *#rnin12 nd then theyBre %ree t# < l=2 #r <h te?er they li=e. MC0 As <e d#2 < l=2 #r < tch ?ide# ... K0 They re 1r#<n $+ +e#+le. The centre <#nBt 1i?e the* entert in*ent. MC0 N#2 I didnBt *e n see %il*. I *e nt see Krishn *$rti ?ide# t +e. K0 N#2 I =n#<. It ll de+ends. I *i1ht < nt t# 1# t# S nt ' rb r 2 I d#nBt =n#<. '$t y#$ c nBt be t it t<entyE%#$r h#$rs d y. Th t is i*+#ssible. E)0 Y#$ did s y e?ery d yA K0 It ll de+ends. 3ers#n lly2 I <#$ldnBt d# it e?ery d y. D'0 @#$ld they c#*e $+ here e?ery #ther d y2 thenA K0 N#2 <eBd h ?e l$nch <ith the*2 nd ll the rest #% it. '$t disc$ssi#ns ... MI0 Re*e*ber2 D ?id s id <ith the scientistsB c#n%erence2 it < s *ist =e t# ... s y2 s#*e #% the* li?ed d#<n in the O =s2 bec $se it * de 1r#$+ th t br#=e < y. K0 Yes. I 1ree. E'0 Is tent +#ssible #n the 1r#$ndsA MI0 I d#nBt < nt t# disc#$r 1e y#$ b$t <e *$st be ?ery c re%$l t## th t <e d#nBt h ?e %l##d #% th t =ind #% cti?ity 1#in1 #n. @e need ll the s$++#rt #% the nei1hb#$rs <hen this c#*es $+ %#r he rin1. @eBre 1#in1 t# h ?e t# 1# thr#$1h ll these he rin1s. ) st t<# ye rs. @eBre 1#in1 t# h ?e the 1r#$nd bre =in1 by the ti*e #% the t l=s. K0 Y#$ see2 'r#c=<##d is ide l2 y#$ =n#<. Alre dy e?erythin1 is there. And in Indi itBs ?ery 9.

si*+le2 bec $se ... <ith te*+#r ry h$ts nd ll th t2 y#$ =n#<. MI0 @here d# y#$ h#$se +e#+le t ; s nt ;ih rA R'0 N#t yet2 b$t <e <ill be d#in1 <h t is necess ry t# h#$se +e#+le. At the *#*ent <e c n h#$se #nly li*ited n$*ber2 b#$t ten #r s#. K0 R ther $nc#*%#rt bly2 ten. R'0 N#2 sir2 c#*%#rt bly ten. This ye r <e intend t# * =e s#*e *#re r##*s ? il ble. Th t *e ns b$ild. @e h ?e st rted c#llectin1 s#*e *#ney. K0 D# y#$ h ?e t# 1et +er*issi#n nd ll th tA R'0 @e h ?e t# 1et +er*issi#n %r#* the city c#r+#r ti#n %#r b$ildin12 b$t itBs n#t re lly di%%ic$lt. MC0 This is t ; s nt ;ih r2 is itA R'0 Yes. @e h ?e t# disc$ss little b#$t th t. MI0 And <h t h ++ens t the d$lt centre n#<A Is there disc$ssi#n s$ch s Krishn 7i h s been describin1A R'0 @ell +e#+le h ?e been c#*in1 e?ery S$nd y %tern##n %#r disc$ssi#ns2 nd sl#<ly <e re b$ildin1 $+ libr ry nd ll th t. @eB?e %#$nd n$*ber #% y#$n1 +e#+le %r#* the $ni?ersity <h# re interested2 s# they dr#+ in ll the ti*e2 e?en d$rin1 the <ee=2 s#*eti*es %i?e #r ten. S#2 <e h ?e been sittin1 nd t l=in1 <ith the*. They re ll ?ery enth$si stic nd I thin= this <ill 1r#<. D'0 I thin= <e *i1ht %ind it h rd t# dr < in +e#+le %r#* this <h#le re 2 y#$ see. St$dents h ?e +r#ble* in?#l?in1 the dist nce nd the *#ney it <#$ld c#st. Is there ny < y t# hel+ the* t# 1et hereA I s < +#stc rd %r#* s#*e #% the st$dents t S nt ' rb r 2 s yin1 they %#$nd the c#st #% c#*in1 here si1ni%ic nt. And )#s An1eles is e?en %$rther. MI0 The *#bility #% the st$dent <#rld is st#$ndin1. They t$rn $+ in S<itGerl nd2 R 71h t. They 1# <here they < nt t# 1#. "@0 I% they re re lly interested2 I thin= they 1et here. They %ind < y. D'0 IB* 7$st c$ri#$s2 y#$ see2 b#$t <here c#$ld th#se +e#+le be dr <n %r#*2 7$st t# 1et n ide . K0 I thin= the *#*ent they =n#< thereBs centre2 y#$Bll be in$nd ted. E)0 Abs#l$tely. R'0 I thin= 1##d n *e sh#$ld be %#$nd2 n#t d$lt centre. MC0 @hy h s shr * bec#*e s$ch dirty <#rd %#r itA K0 'ec $se itBs c#ncentr ti#n c *+ r$n by 1$r$s. ItBs n# l#n1er <h t it sh#$ld be. The 1$r$ is there2 disci+les re there2 they #bey <h t he h s t# s y2 they %#ll#< hi*. I% he s ys2 BT#d y <eBll di1 9C

in the 1 rden nd %#r the ne4t t<# <ee=s <eBll % st... B All th t =ind #% n#nsense.
JRe+#rt #% the Intern ti#n l Tr$steesB Meetin1s2 O7 i2 ,-CC C#*+iled <ith *ini*$* editin1 %r#* ?erb ti* tr nscri+ts. Third *eetin12 Cth M rch ,-CCK C#+yri1ht ,-CCO,--6 Krishn *$rti "#$nd ti#n Tr$st )i*ited2 'r#c=<##d 3 r=2 H *+shire2 U.K.

9/

Do We Dis$uss the Centre?

Krishn *$rti0 D# <e disc$ss the CentreA As there re 1#in1 t# be Centres in Indi 2 'r#c=<##d2 nd here2 nd C n d 2 <h t d# y#$ thin= these Centres sh#$ld be2 #r r ther *$st beA ... I h ?e been t# se?er l Centres li=e this E in *y y#$th E #ne st rted by (er ld He rd2 Ald#$s H$4ley2 nd "eli4 (reene2 in the s#$th #% )#s An1eles. They h d ll =inds #% thin1s there2 *edit ti#n +l ce <here it < s li=e n *+hithe tre2 ?ery s* ll2 +er%ectly d r=2 c$rt ins2 nd y#$ s t there %#r n h#$r three ti*es d y nd *edit ted. And then in the *#rnin1 there <ere dishes t# be < shed2 nd ll the rest #% itH nd then s#*eb#dy s+#=e %#r n h#$r2 either +r#%ess#r %r#* 'er=eley ... @hile I < s there ... In the %tern##n y#$ <#$ld rest2 nd 1 in *edit ti#n2 nd s# #n. "r#* the e?enin12 %ter dinner2 n#b#dy s+#=e t ll2 n#t <#rd2 till the ne4t *#rnin1 %ter *edit ti#n. Th t < s the r#$tine. Th tBs #ne =ind #% Centre. There re the #ther =ind #% Centres li=e E IB?e ne?er been there E Es len2 y#$B?e he rd #% it2 #% c#$rse. There h ?e been Centres in the TS2 The#s#+hic l S#ciety. @h t d# y#$ thin= this #$1ht t# be2 these Centres sh#$ld "@0 I thin= it *$st be Centre %#r le rnin1 nd in?esti1 ti#n b#$t b sic lly the te chin12 b$t rel ted t# the te chin1s e?ery s+ect #% li%e2 t##. K0 @h t d# y#$ *e n by le rnin1A D# I c#*e there t# le rnA "@0 N#t t# le rn in the $s$ l sense th t I cD$ire =n#<led1e2 b$t <e h ?e t# %ind #$t %irst #% ll <h t it *e ns t# le rn2 <h t th t is2 t# 1et n insi1ht int# insi1ht2 +$t it th t < y. K0 )##=2 "ritG2 i% there < s Centre2 y#$ c *e there2 <h t <#$ld y#$ li=e there t# t =e +l ceA "@0 I <#$ld li=e t# %ind +e#+le <ith <h#* I disc$ss *y +r#ble*s s dee+ s +#ssible2 nd dee+er th n th t2 s# th t I re lly 1et the %eelin1 th t thereBs n# li*it ti#n %#r in?esti1 ti#nH th t *y th#$1ht bec#*es cle r2 *y <h#le bein1 bec#*es cle r2 in s$ch Centre. D'0 It see*s t# *e th t * ybe i% there <ere +e#+le <h# < nted t# disc$ss %$nd *ent l D$esti#ns2 #r b#$t the <h#le #% li%e2 this is re lly <h t <#$ld be ++r#+ri te. K0 Sir2 i% y#$ <ere inclined t# 1# t# ny Centre2 <h t <#$ld y#$ li=e t# h ?e there2 t# h ++en there2 #r t# t =e +l ceA @h t <#$ld y#$ li=eA I% y#$ <ere n #$tsider c#*in1 in2 <h t <#$ld y#$ li=eA D'0 @ell2 I thin= I <#$ld li=e t# h ?e 1#ne int# s#*ethin1 ?ery dee+2 nd t# $nderst nd thin1s th t <ere c#n%$sed. Y#$ see2 D$esti#ns +e#+le *i1ht r ise re2 B@h t is the *e nin1 #% li%e s <h#leA @h t is the *e nin1 #% ll this s <h#leAB K0 As <h#le2 yes. D'0 S y2 i% y#$ c#*e %r#* )#s An1eles #r s#*e<here2 y#$ <ill see tre*end#$s ch #s there2 y#$ =n#<2 tr#$ble. )i%e is ?ery *i4ed $+ nd y#$ *i1ht < nt t# c#*e here t# l##= t li%e s <h#le2 in n t*#s+here #% #rder nd h r*#ny in <hich +e#+le c#$ld be D$iet nd 1# ?ery dee+. K0 D# y#$ i*+#se th t D$ietnessA Y#$ =n#<2 in Asi they re $sed t# this2 b$t here they re n#t. S# 9-

<#$ld y#$ i*+#se it2 s y2 PD$rin1 cert in h#$rs #r cert in +eri#d y#$ re silentMA E'0 3erh +s #ne c#$ld h ?e cert in +l ce <here #ne <#$ld be D$iet. Others th t didnBt < nt t# be D$iet c#$ld c#n?erse else<here2 b$t there sh#$ld +erh +s be +l ce <here #ne c#$ld be D$iet. MI0 I% I <ere t# 1# t# the Krishn *$rti Centre2 I <#$ld +res$* bly h ?e s#*e de1ree #% =n#<led1e #% Krishn *$rtiB s <ritin1. It *i1ht be tiny2 b$t I <#$ld thin= *y re s#n t# 1# <#$ld be t# dee+en th t $nderst ndin1. Other<ise2 there re th#$s nd +l ces t# 1# i% I h d +r#ble* <ith *y h$sb nd #r *y children #r *y sisterEinEl <2 #r I d#nBt =n#< <h t. All th#se thin1s +r#li%er te. '$t Krishn *$rti Centre is s#*ethin1 di%%erent. K0 Yes2 b$t <h t =ind #% thin1 <#$ld y#$ li=e i% y#$ < nted t# 1# t# y#$ li=eA @h t <#$ld y#$ thin= is i*+#rt ntA +l ce li=e th t. @h t <#$ld

M)0 ThereBs <ide r n1e. I *e n2 there h s t# be cert in +hysic l +er%ecti#n. K0 A+ rt %r#* ll th t2 sir. @h t is it y#$ <#$ld li=e t# t =e +l ce <hile y#$ re there. SS0 I <#$ld thin= th t it <#$ld be re lly essenti l i% I < nted t# 1# t# +l ce li=e th t2 th t there <ere +e#+le #r +ers#ns there <h# ct$ lly <ere li?e <ith the te chin1s2 <h# c#$ld re lly 1i?e *e s#*ethin1 #% th t thin1 th tBs li?e2 n#t s#*ethin1 th tBs de d2 th t I c#$ld 1et t h#*e. MC0 S$rely th tBs <h t <e ll <#$ld < nt. Unless there < s th t D$ lity <hich <e %ind <hen <e s#*eti*es he r y#$ t l= #r disc$ss <ith y#$2 $nless th t < s in s#*e < y +resent2 this Centre <#$ld n#t be +l ce <e <#$ld < nt t# 1# t#. K0 N#2 s# h#< d# y#$ cre te th tA E'0 D#nBt <e c#*e b c= 1 in t# the %$nd *ent l D$esti#n th t <eB?e re lly been ddressin1 d$rin1 these +eri#ds t#1ether2 #% the D$ lity #% the indi?id$ ls th t re there2 nd their dee+ $nderst ndin1 #% the te chin1sA I thin= this is the $nderlyin1 D$esti#n in e?ery s+ect #% this. MI0 M y <e s= h#< y#$ see it2 Krishn 7iA K0 Th tBs <h t IB* 7$st <#nderin1. I% I <ent there2 <h t is the thin1 I <#$ld s= %r#* the +e#+le I *eet2 %r#* the +l ce2 %r#* the *bience2 nd ll th tH <h t <#$ld I de* ndA I c#*e there de* ndin1 s#*ethin12 #r I c#*e there t# be enli1htened E enli1htened in the sense b#$t cert in +r#ble*s I h ?eA I <#$ld li=e i% I c *e there t# *eet +e#+le <h# disc$ss <ith *e b#$t the D$esti#n #% %e r2 %#r e4 *+le. IB* t =in1 th t0 t# see i% I c n be %ree #% %e r2 $nderst nd it2 1# int# it2 disc$ss it ... l id b re. Y#$Bre ll s# silent. Y#$ =n#<2 this is re lly D$ite seri#$s +r#ble*2 bec $se <eBre 1#in1 t# h ?e Centre there. "ritG2 i% I c *e there t# disc$ss <ith y#$ nd <ith the +e#+le r#$nd y#$2 r#$nd the +l ce2 the D$esti#n #% < reness2 ttenti#n2 the D$esti#n #% n#t bein1 h$rt2 %#r e4 *+le2 nd2 bein1 h$rt2 h#< t# 1# int# it2 c#$ld y#$ hel+ *eA Hel+2 in the sense2 $nr ?el it. N#t intellect$ lly2 IB* %ed $+ <ith th t =ind #% st$%%H I h ?e d#ne th t ll #?er the +l ce. '$t I c#*e here t# #+en it ll $+2 7$st t# be < re #% it. C#$ld y#$ hel+ *eA Or c#$ld y#$ hel+ *e t# end s#rr#<A And <h t it *e ns t# l#?e2 c#*+ ssi#n2 nd ll the rest #% itA I <#$ld li=e t# c#*e here2 %r#* )#s An1eles2 %r#* Se ttle E IB?e *#?ed r#$nd E #r ; nc#$?er2 I c#*e here. C#$ld y#$ hel+ *eA Hel+ *e2 in the sense2 disc$ss ?ery cle rly2 nd y#$ *e n <h t y#$ s y2 n#t intellect$ l2 n#t *erely ?erb l2 b$t y#$ h ?e 1#ne int# it dee+ly y#$rsel%. Att ch*entH IB* tt ched t# *y <i%e2 h$sb ndH IB* tt ched t# s# * ny thin1s. C#$ld y#$ disc$ss <ith *e2 n#t t the ?erb l le?el2 t 86

*$ch dee+er le?el2 <h t re the i*+lic ti#ns #% tt ch*entA Y#$ =n#<2 the %eelin1 #% tt ch*ent nd the %eelin1 #% c#*+letely bein1 %ree %r#* ll tt ch*entA 'ec $se y#$ re 1#in1 t# be here2 y#$2 the )illie%elts2 #r in Indi 2 #r in 'r#c=<##d. I c#*e there. I < nt t# $nderst nd. I h ?e re d s#*e thin1s #% K2 nd IB?e l##=ed int# it2 nd I %ind it ?ery 1##d2 nd it h s de+th t# it. S# I < nt t# 1# int# it <ith s#*eb#dy2 n#t 1 ther #r le rn b#$t it2 b$t I < nt t# =n#< <h t it *e ns t# be t#t lly %ree %r#* tt ch*ent. "@0 I thin= th tMs the %$ncti#n #% the centre. K0 I =n#<. IB* 7$st s=in12 c#$ld y#$ d# itA C#$ld y#$2 the )illie%elts2 nd <h#e?er < s 1#in1 t# be here E <ith the hel+ #% the "#$nd ti#n2 nd the Centre2 nd y#$2 nd ll the rest #% it2 Dr '#h* E c#$ld y#$ * =e *e %eel th t y#$ h ?e $nderst##d s#*ethin1 nd hel+ *e t# *#?e in cert in directi#ns2 n#t in?ented directi#ns2 b$t ct$ l directi#ns <hich y#$ h ?e %#$ndA N# tt ch*entH IB* t =in1 th t s n e4 *+leH <h t it *e ns2 the be $ty #% it2 the de+th #% it2 the intensity #% tt ch*ent2 nd the de+endency2 y#$ =n#< the <h#le #% th t. @#$ld th t be ther +e$ticA @hy d# I c#*e there t llA )etBs see th t. @hy d# I c#*e there t llA @h t is the $r1e in *e t# 1# t# Centre li=e this E IB?e re d K E <here they re % *ili r <ith his ... etc.2 etc.2 etc.A And I h ?e re d 1re t de l #% his ... nd listened t# s#*e t l=s2 nd re d2 nd s# #n. @hy d# I < nt t# c#*e hereA @#$ldnBt I < nt t# c#*e here t# *eet +e#+le #% the s *e =ind #% thin=in12 s *e =ind #% enD$iry2 s *e =ind #% #$tl##=2 <h# h ?e re d2 <h# h ?e th#$1ht b#$t it2 +erh +s <ith <h#* I c n disc$ss in %riendly2 h ++y rel ti#nshi+H n#t be criticiGed nd s y2 B)##=2 <e re <r#n12 <e re ri1htBA @#$ld th t be #ne #% the re s#ns I <#$ld c#*eA R'0 'ec $se s#*ethin1 is <r#n1 <ith *y li%e2 <ith li%e s it is li?ed2 nd I * se rchin1 ... K0 N#2 I <#$ldnBt 1# %#r th#se re s#ns. 3ers#n lly2 I <#$ldnBt 1# %#r th#se re s#ns t ll. @hy <#$ld y#$ 1# thereA "@0 I h ?e seen s#*ethin1 e4tr #rdin ry in b##=2 #r I h ?e listened t# s#*ethin12 nd I < nt t# +$rs$e th t2 <h t I h ?e seen there. I < nt t# 1et re lly in t#$ch <ith it. Th tBs2 I thin=2 the re s#n <hy I <#$ld 1# there. Th t incl$des ll the s+ects2 y#$ =n#<2 <e h ?e been disc$ssin1. K0 S# there re t<# thin1s2 renBt thereA He rin1 K is #ne thin1 E #r '$ddh E I <#$ld 1# nd listen t# hi* 1re t de l2 i% I h d the #++#rt$nity2 i% I h d the *#ney2 nd s# #n. I <#$ld s+end 1re t de l #% ti*e <ith hi*2 listenin1 t# <h t he h s s id2 disc$ssin1. Th tBs #ne c te1#ry. '$t K is 1#ne2 de d2 #r <h te?erH '$ddh is de d. S#2 I < nt t# $nderst nd <h t he s id b#$t cert in thin1s2 nd y#$ +e#+le h ?e listened t# *$ch *#re th n I h ?e2 h ?e 1#ne int# it *$ch *#re th n I h ?e. And I <#$ld c#*e t# %ind #$t <h t he s id <ith re1 rd t# <h t I thin=. Y#$ %#ll#<A I <#nBt cce+t y#$ s n $th#rityH I <#nBt cce+t y#$ s s#$rce #% enli1hten*ent #r nythin1 #% th t =ind. 'ec $se y#$ h ?e listened t# the '$ddh 1re t de l2 nd I <#$ld li=e t# c +t$re s#*ethin1 #% th t thr#$1h y#$. Th t is the re s#n I <#$ld c#*e. C +t$re n#t #nly the +er%$*e #% it2 b$t the D$ lity2 the < y he th#$1ht2 the < y his *ind <#r=ed E y#$ %#ll#<A E h#< it #+er ted2 <h t is his insi1ht2 <hy did he s y cert in thin1s. Y#$ %#ll#< <h t I *e nA I <#$ld be deli1hted t# c#*e2 bec $se I < nt t# $nderst nd his *ind E i% I c n2 I * y be st$+id. Th tBs the re s#n I <#$ld c#*e2 s# th t I 1et the %eelin1 #% th t D$ lity2 <hich <hen I h ?e it2 IBll s#rt *y +r#ble*s s I 1# l#n1H th t bec#*es D$ite e sy. I <#$ld c#*e %#r th t re s#n. And2 <#$ld y#$ be ble t# 1i?e *e th t2 #r ... Th tBs the re s#n I <#$ld 1#2 n#t t# s#l?e *y +r#ble*s. 'ec $se I h ?e re d ll he h s s idH bec $se I see ll th t. '$t I < nt t# c +t$re2 #r b the2 #r li?e2 #r be in th t t*#s+here2 t# see the D$ lity #% the '$ddh . Y#$ 8,

%#ll#<A Y#$ h ?e listened t# hi*2 y#$ h ?e s+ent ti*e <ith hi*2 y#$ h ?e 1#ne int# it <ith hi*2 nd I c#*e there %#r th t re s#n. And bein1 there2 then I #+en $+. Y#$ %#ll#< <h t I *e nA I *i1ht s y2 B3le se2 letBs t l= b#$t c#*+ ssi#n2 h#< he t c=led it. Y#$ listened t# hi*2 y#$ *$st h ?e c +t$red s#*ethin1 #% th t n t$re2 D$ lity. Tell *e b#$t it. I < nt t# disc$ss it <ith y#$ thereB. Y#$ re n#t re+resentin1 hi*2 y#$ re n#t t =in1 his +l ce2 y#$ re n#t ss$*in1 his $th#rityH b$t bec $se y#$ h ?e listened2 bre thed the s *e ir E y#$ %#ll#< <h t I *e nA E the %%ecti#n2 the l#?e2 the %eelin1 th t y#$ h d %#r hi*2 %#r the '$ddh 2 I %eel2 *y 1##dness2 I < nt t# %ind #$t. 'ec $se I h ?enBt been ble t# listen t# hi*2 $n%#rt$n tely2 #r IB?e 7$st listened t# #ne t l= nd th t < snBt 1##d en#$1h. '$t I c +t$red s#*ethin1 there nd I c#*e t# O7 i %#r th t thin1. Th tBs the re s#n I <#$ld c#*e2 nd by c#*in1 %#r th t2 nd i% y#$ c n sh re th t <ith *e2 then I <ill disc$ss <ith y#$ ll the +r#ble*s #% %e r2 this2 th t2 nd the #ther thin1. '$t i% th t is l c=in12 then I <ill s y2 *y 1#d2 <h t is the +#int #% these +e#+le *eetin1A I d#nBt =n#< i% I * c#n?eyin1 nythin1 t ll. A* IA Then i% y#$ c nBt d# it2 <h tBs the +#int #% itA >0 '$t then I c#*e there nd I * y be let d#<n. K0 Th tBs <h t IB* <#nderin1. I c#*e there nd I *eet Or '#h*. He is scientist2 <ellE=n#<n2 <#rld %i1$re. IB* %r#* )#s An1eles2 n#b#dy2 b$t IB?e re d 1re t de l2 IB?e 1#t % irly 1##d *ind. D# I disc$ss <ith hi* science2 +hysicsA I =n#< n#thin1 b#$t ll th t. '$t I < nt t# disc$ss <ith hi* bec $se he h s disc$ssed <ith the #ther2 <ith the '$ddh . And I < nt ... @ill he hel+ *e t# $nderst nd the D$ lity2 the br in2 the *ind2 the <idth nd the de+th #% the '$ddh 2 s# th t I 1et ... A Y#$ %#ll#<A @ill he hel+ *e <ith th tA Or <ill he tr#t #$t s#*e the#ry #% his #<n nd IBll 1et ... d# y#$ %#ll#< E t the end #% it IBll s y2 BOh *y l#rd2 <here * IA I d#nBt < nt ther +y. I * % irly intelli1ent2 I c n ther +e$tiGe *ysel%2 t# he l *ysel%2 t# l##= int# ll the ... b$t th tBs s$ch +etty2 little %% irB. '$t I c#*e there %#r th t re s#n. I thin= *#st +e#+le <#$ld2 <#$ldnBt theyA @#$ld y#$ 1# %#r th t re s#n2 sirA >0 Yes2 sh rin1. K0 N#2 n#2 n#. N#2 <#$ld y#$ 1# %#r th t re s#nA N#t sh rin12 le ?e th t + rt. @#$ld y#$ 1# %#r th t re s#nA >0 Yes2 I <#$ld 1# %#r th t re s#n. K0 And c n y#$ s$++ly *e2 n#t s$++ly2 I c#*e there %#r th t re s#n. @ill y#$ s tis%y <h t I < ntA Jl#n1 + $seK I% I < nt t# %ind #$t <h t the '$ddh < s li=e2 I c n +ic= $+ his b##=s E BThe S yin1s #% the '$ddh B E nd 1et s#*ethin12 b$t itBs n#t the s *e thin1. Y#$ %#ll#<2 sirA I c n t<ist it2 I c n +er?ert it2 I c n s y2 BYes2 I h ?e $nderst##dB y#$ %#ll#<A E BI h ?e 1#t th tB listened t# hi* bec $se2 %#r th t re s#n2 I c#*e2 bec $se y#$ c n #+en the d##r t# see th t2 then I c n be1in t# disc$ss2 h ?e di l#1$e <ith y#$ b#$t * ny thin1s <hich interest *e2 *edit ti#n E y#$ %#ll#<A E s#rr#<2 d#Gen thin1s I <#$ld li=e t# disc$ss. '$t I < nt th t %irst. @ell2 sirA DS0 I <#$ldnBt c#*e %#r th t. K0 Y#$ <#$ldnBtA I <#$ld. DS0 I thin= IBd 1# t# the b##=s %#r th t. 89

K0 N#2 $nderst ndin1 I c n 1# t# the b##=s %#r. I < nt t# c +t$re his < y #% thin=in12 h#< he +$t it2 h#< he l##=ed t it. DS0 '$t IB?e he rd hi* +$t it2 #n the ?ide# t +eH I see the e4+ressi#n #n his % ce. K0 N#2 I h ?enBt 1#t the be stly ?ide#. I %#r1#t th tL N#2 n#2 %#r1et th t2 %#r1et ll th t ?ide#. DS0 '$t y#$Bre t## D$ic= t it2 Krishn 7i. K0 N#2 < it *in$te. IB* +$ttin1 it ne<. )##=2 IB* in l#?e <ith the '$ddh . Ri1htA DS0 'ec $se #% th t2 I <#$ld 1# there. K0 I h ?e seen the ?ide# t +e. I h ?e seen ll the bl sted thin1s. '$t I < nt t# listen t# +e#+le <h# h ?e been <ith hi* %#r n$*ber #% ye rs. MI0 @h t d# I < nt t# %ind #$t %r#* th#se +e#+leA K0 I 1# there bec $se they h ?e been <ith hi* %#r n$*ber #% ye rs. MI0 Then IB* interested in <h t theyBre li=eA K0 N#2 IB* n#t interested in the* t ll. Y#$ h ?e *is$nderst##d. I 1# there bec $se they h ?e been <ith hi*. MI0 @h t d#es th t *e nA K0 3hysic lly2 they h ?e l##=ed t hi*2 they h ?e listened t# hi*2 they h ?e 1#ne s % r s they c n <ith hi*. D#nBt y#$ < nt this =ind #% thin1A N#A Y#$Bre n#t interested in thisA AC0 Th t is s#. In Indi 2 +e#+le c#*e t# s yin1. +l ce li=e R 71h t <ith +recisely this thin1 th t y#$ re

K0 '$t there it bec#*es de?#ti#n2 nd +r#str ti#n2 nd ll the rest #% it. R'0 It is c#nt ct <ith the D$ lity #% th t *ind2 I thin=2 <hich c nn#t c#*e in +rint #r in ... DS0 '$t <hy c nBt it c#*e in +rintA @hy c nBt it c#*e in ?ide# t +eA @h t is the +#int #% the ?ide# t +in1A K0 Then <h tBs the +#int #% the Centre2 thenA DS0 Th t +l$s. K0 Ah2 <h t is the +l$sA DS0 The +l$s is the +e#+le. Are they +$ttin1 ... A K0 The +l$s is the +e#+leA IB* n#t t l=in1 #%... I d#nBt =n#< these %ell#<sL I d#nBt =n#< ny #% y#$L I c#*e %r#* <here?er it is2 I c#*e %r#* l#n1 dist nceH I < nt t# see +e#+le <h# h ?e been <ith 88

hi*. Th tBs ll. MC0 Krishn 7i2 t# c#n?ey the D$ lity #% y#$r *ind is <h t <e see* t# =ee+ c#*in1 t#. YesA K0 3 rtly th t. MC0 In < y <hich <e c nn#t d# thr#$1h the ?ide# t +es #r the b##=s. R'0 N#t #nly the D$ lity #% the *ind2 +erh +s the D$ lity #% the li%e2 the <h#le thin1. K0 Y#$Bre *issin1 ... I d#nBt =n#<H I * y be t l=in1 n#nsense. I < nt t# 1# t# +l ce <here there re +e#+le <h# h ?e t l=ed <ith hi*2 disc$ssed <ith hi*. And s# I < nt t# disc$ss <ith the*. Th tBs ll. >0 'ec $se I ss$*e th t they *$st h ?e s#*ethin1 *#re th n I h ?e. '$t they * y n#t. K0 They * y n#t. IBll %ind th t #$t. >0 They * y be 7$st #rdin ry bl#=es li=e *ysel%. K0 IBll %ind th t #$t. A%ter t<# d ys s y2 BS#rry2 *y <i%e is ?ery ill2 IB?e 1#t le ?eB. And I le ?e. >0 Yes2 b$t then <here re <e nd <here is heA K0 Th tBs 7$st it. M)0 @here is the CentreA MI0 '$t <h t is it they c#*e %#r2 t# be <ith +e#+le <h# re ... K0 N#2 n#. I * y be +$ttin1 it ll <r#n1ly. M)0 Sir2 there re %e< +e#+le <h# c#*e <h# < nt t# =n#< b#$t y#$2 b$t there re l#t #% +e#+le <h# < nt t# 7$st c#*e s +il1ri*s <#$ld c#*e2 c#*e t# +l ce s# they c n *eet +e#+le <h# re li?in1 di%%erently. K0 And ls# IM* n#t interested <hether lie it #r n#t. M)0 @hyA K0 Th tBs $+ t#... IBll s##n %ind #$t. M)0 '$t y#$ <#$ld c#*e <ith th t e4+ect ti#n. K0 I c#*e there h#+in1 th t y#$ re d#in1 this. I% y#$ re n#t2 y#$ re n#t. IB* n#t dis ++#inted. )etBs be1in 1 in. @hy d# I < nt t# c#*eA IB?e listened t# the t +es2 IB?e seen the +ict$res2 hi* t l=in1 #n the ?ide# t +e2 nd ll the rest #% it. Ri1ht. Then <hy d# I < nt t# c#*e hereA I% y#$ s y2 <ell2 y#$ h ?e 1#t ll th t2 then itBs %inished. tele1r * nd *$st

8:

MI0 3e#+le *#stly %eel th t their $nderst ndin1 is #nly + rti l2 nd they < nt t# e4tend th t $nderst ndin1. K0 All ri1ht2 s# I c#*e there. I c#*e there t# e4tend *y $nderst ndin1 in disc$ssi#n <ith +e#+le. Th tBs #ne re s#n. Ri1htA Are y#$ s yin1 th tBs the * in re s#n +e#+le c#*eA MC0 ItBs *#re th n e4tendin1 the $nderst ndin1. K0 Enl r1e th t <#rd. >0 3er%$*e #% s#*ethin1 is s# di%%ic$lt t# e4+l in2 b$t it is still there2 <hich is cre ted <hen +e#+le re t#1ether. T)0 I re*e*ber E* nd I ?isited 'r#c=<##d se?er l ye rs 1#2 nd then <e ?isited 1 in2 nd the sec#nd ?isit there < s s#*ethin1 there <hich < snBt there %#r the %irst ?isit. It < s ?ery di%%ic$lt t# e4+l in2 b$t it hel+ed y#$ in s#*e int n1ible < y bec $se it < s n t*#s+here <hich h d been est blished. ItBs ?ery di%%ic$lt t# s y h#<2 b$t there it < s. MI0 ThereBs been s# *$ch t l= b#$t Bthe b##=s re de dB. I +ers#n lly c nBt $nderst nd th t2 bec $se h#< * ny re lly $nc#$nt ble +e#+le h ?e c#*e bec $se they st#++ed in b##=st#re2 nd +ic=ed $+ b##=2 nd didnBt =n#< <h# this * n < s2 nd either b#$1ht it nd <ent h#*e nd s#*ethin1 h ++ened. The s *e st#ry #% s#*e#ne st ndin1 there re din1 his b##= in b##=st#res h s been t#ld t# *e +ers#n lly I d#nBt =n#< h#< * ny ti*es. I% th t h ++ens t# y#$2 then y#$ < nt t# c#*e t# the t l=s i% y#$ c n2 y#$ < nt t# *eet Krishn *$rti i% y#$ c n. I% n#t2 y#$ <#$ld < nt t# 1# t# +e#+le <h# h ?e s#*ethin1 #% th t. K0 All ri1ht2 t =e th t2 st rt %r#* there. IB?e re d the b##=s nd I < nt t# c#*e t# the O7 i Centre t# *eet #ther +e#+le l#n1 th t < y2 <h# re c#ncerned <ith thisH c#ncerned2 c#**itted2 in?#l?ed in it. 'ec $se IB?e he rd the t +es2 IB?e seen the ?ide#2 etc.2 nd I c#*e there. Is th t the #nly re s#nA DS0 3erh +s %r#* sch##l the ct$ l +$ttin1 int# cti#n d ily2 +$ttin1 this t# the test2 <ill hel+ brin1 this t*#s+here b#$t. Y#$ <ill see it in their li?es2 #r * ybe y#$ <#nBt see it in their li?es. K0 Yes. All ri1ht. (r nted ll th t2 is th t the #nly re s#n I c#*e thereA MI0 Yes2 I thin= it <#$ld be *y chie% re s#n. IBd < nt t# $nderst nd *#re2 =n#< *#re2 t l= b#$t thin1s. The b##= <#$ld h ?e lit %ire. K0 I see. I $nderst nd. Y#$B?e s id it. Y#$B?e re d it in the libr ries2 st ndin1 #n the l dder y#$B?e re d it. I =n#<2 nd y#$ s y2 by J#?e2 etc.2 etc. MC0 @e see* t# be tre din1 r G#rBs ed1e2 bec $se the 1re t +r#ble* %r#* <here IB* sittin1 is D$ite di%%erent %r#* <here y#$Bre sittin12 bec $se y#$ h ?e this $th#rity in the tr$e sense #% the <#rd. I% s#*e#ne c#*es t# *e E nd I c n $nderst nd th t s#*eb#dy <#$ld 1# t# the ends #% the e rth bec $se they <#$ld < nt t# %ind #$t2 s y#$ +$t it2 h#< y#$r *ind <#r=ed E I <#$ld < nt t# d# this. And i% s#*e#ne c *e t# *e nd s id2 BY#$ =n#< hi*2 y#$ <#r= <ith hi*2 tell *e b#$t itB2 t this +#int in ti*e I <#$ld %eel th t I <#$ld s y <h t I c#$ld2 I <#$ld c#**$nic te <h t I c#$ld. '$t2 Krishn 7i2 I <#$ld %eel th t I did n#t h ?e th t $th#rity th t y#$ h ?e t# brin1 this thr#$1h2 bec $se I <#$ld < nt t# s= y#$ n#<2 <hile y#$Bre <ith $s2 *#re b#$t y#$r *ind nd <h t it is2 <hy there is this 1 + bet<een $s l< ys t the essenti l +#int <here <e c nn#t c tch %ire2 <e c nn#t 85

c#**$nic te. K0 @e c n d# th t. @e c n d# th t. MC0 Th tBs <h t <e h ?e t# d#2 +erh +s be%#re <e c n ns<er these D$esti#ns. K0 S#2 is th t the +rinci+ l re s#n y#$ <#$ld 1# thereA MC0 Yes2 th tBs the #nly thin1 th t * =es it di%%erent %r#* ll the #ther #nes ... K0 I see. I see. Y#$ re s yin1 y#$ <#$ld 1# there bec $se y#$ h ?e re d2 he rd2 listened t# t +es2 etc.2 etc.2 nd y#$ he r there re 1r#$+ #% +e#+le t O7 i <h# h ?e d#ne the s *e thin1A And I <ill 1# nd disc$ss <ith the* t# %$rther it l#n12 *#?e it %$rther. MC0 They h ?e been t# the %#$nt inhe d. MI0 They re d#in1 this thin12 this =ind #% li%e2 +res$* bly. Th tBs <hy I <#$ld thin=... they re li?in1 it2 theyBre $nderst ndin1 it2 theyBre e4+l#rin1 itH I <#$ld < nt t# be + rt #% it. MC0 Als#2 there < s s#*ethin1 *#re. One <#$ld 1# t# %ind #$t i% there < snBt s#*ethin1 *#re2 b$t i% there < s direct K0 I $nderst nd ll th t2 I $nderst nd ll th t. '$t I < nt t# dd s#*ethin1 *#re t# th t. T# *e th tBs n#t 1##d en#$1h. ItBs ll ri1ht2 e4cellent2 th tBs +r#b bly the re s#n. '$t I < nt t# h ?e s#*ethin1 *#re. I% I < s 1#in1 there2 bec $se IB?e listened t# the t +es2 IB?e st##d #n the l dder #% the libr ry nd re d it2 nd itBs d#ne s#*ethin1 t# *e. IB?e listened t# the t l=s2 the ?ide# t +e2 disc$ssed2 nd I he r t O7 i there is cert in 1r#$+ <h# re in?#l?ed 1re t de l <ith the sch##l2 I <#$ld li=e t# 1# there2 nd I c#*e there. '$t I < nt s#*e #ther D$ lity there t##. I 1# there t# %ind #$t2 t#1ether. MC0 '$t y#$ s id thereBs s#*ethin1 *#re. K0 Ah2 I < nt *$ch *#reL Y#$ see2 I h ?e listened nd ll the rest #% it. And I c n <#r= by *ysel%2 I c n d# it by *ysel%H I d#nBt h ?e t# 1# ny<here else. As h$* n bein12 I <#$ld d# it by *ysel%. '$t i% I * n#t th t =ind #% +ers#n nd I h ?e re d the b##=s2 t +es2 nd ll th t2 I < nt t# 1# t# O7 i2 bec $se I < nt t# be <ith +e#+le <h# re d#in1 it +r#b bly *#re intensely2 1#ne int# it dee+er. I < nt t# disc$ss <ith the*. IB?e $nderst##d ll th t. '$t I < nt s#*ethin1 *#re in?#l?ed in it. I < nt s#*ethin1 *$ch *#re th n *erely t# disc$ss <ith +e#+le. Are y#$ s tis%ied <ith thisA Re din1 b##=s2 t +esA DS0 N#2 b$t y#$ c n re d the b##=s2 y#$ c n %eel y#$ h ?e s#*e $nderst ndin12 y#$ c n dee+en y#$r $nderst ndin12 y#$ c n be re lly seri#$s2 b$t y#$ need the li%e ener1y #% #ther +e#+le t# rel te t#. K0 All ri1ht2 y#$ 1# %#r th t re s#n. @#$ld y#$ be s tis%ied <ith th tA I% the Centre c n #%%er y#$ ll th t2 <ill y#$ be s tis%ied <ith th tA MI0 Y#$ * y n#t s y2 BIB* s tis%iedB. K0 Y#$ h ?e listened t# +e#+le <h# h ?e been <ith hi*2 disc$ssed <ith hi*2 nd ll the rest #% it. Y#$ c#*e there nd y#$ < nt t# dee+en2 <iden2 c#*+rehend s *$ch ... disc$ssin1 <ith +e#+le 8.

<h# re c#**itted2 <h# re in?#l?ed *$ch *#re th n 1r#$+ #% +e#+le in )#s An1eles. Ri1ht2 <e ll 1reed t# th t. Ri1htA Are y#$ s tis%ied <ith th tA >0 N#2 I <#$ld < nt t# be c#ns$*ed by th t2 <h te?er it is2 <hen I le%t. IBd li=e t# h ?e s#*ethin1 *#re K0 Yes2 th t * y h ++en in disc$ssin12 bec $se y#$ h ?e seen the t +es2 y#$ h ?e been thr#$1h ll the drill2 st ndin1 #n the l dder2 nd y#$ c#*e there2 etc. )etBs stic= t# th t +#int. Y#$ re s tis%ied <ith th tA "@0 @hen I c#*e t# the Centre <h t I < nt b sic lly is th t th t re?#l$ti#n t =es +l ce in *e th t Krishn *$rti t l=ed b#$t. Th tBs <h t I c#*e %#r. K0 Yes2 nd I c#*e there t# disc$ssA "@0 Th t ll is i*+lied. K0 S#2 I * s=in1 y#$ E %#r 1#dBs s =e E i% y#$ re 1i?en th t2 i% the Centre t O7 i #%%ers th t2 y#$ c#*e there nd s y2 BYes2 th tBs 1##d en#$1h2 th tBs ll ri1htB. E)0 @ell2 b$t i% "ritG s ys th t y#$ c#*e there t# 1et this re?el ti#n #% <h t Krishn *$rtiBs t l=in1 b#$t2 nd yet heBs been s+e =in1 %#r %i%tyEt<# ye rs ll #?er the <#rld nd there isnBt ny#ne there th t h s it2 then <h tA HeBs e4+ectin1 l#t. H#< re <e 1#in1 t# *eet th tA "@0 @ell2 he e4+ects the s *e thin1 <hen he is c#*in1 t# listen t# Krishn 7i. He <ill d# th t2 I * D$ite s$re. K0 I <#$ld * =e it ?ery cle r0 BMy %riends2 y#$ re c#*in1 here2 b$t re?#l$ti#n c n #nly t =e +l ce in y#$rsel%2 by y#$rsel%2 n# $th#rityH this +l ce <#nBt 1i?e... etc.2 etcB. '$t IB* s=in1 y#$ i% y#$ s y ll th t2 i% y#$ s y2 BYes2 this Centre *$st be li=e th tBA MC0 Is there s#*ethin1 *#re th n this t#t l re?#l$ti#nA K0 I < nt +l$s. Y#$Bre n#t s=in1 %#r +l$s2 IB* s=in1 %#r itL >0 '$t the +l$s is $+ t# y#$L K0 N#2 i% y#$ s= it y#$ <ill 1et it2 b$t y#$ re n#t s=in1 itL D#nBt y#$ < nt s#*ethin1 *#re2 +l$sA @hy d#nBt y#$ s= %#r itAL MI0 Krishn 7i2 h#< c n y#$ s= %#r itA K0 Y#$ s y2 BYes2 this is the thin1 <e need t the CentreB2 nd y#$ sit b c= nd s y2 BYes2 <eBll cre te th tB. E)0 S# <e < nt the +l$s t# ... K0 Ah2 y#$ h ?enBt s=ed itL E)0 C n y#$ 1et the +l$s by s=in1A 8C

K0 YesL MC0 'y s=in1 y#$A K0 Ah2 IM* de d. MC0 N#2 b$t <e re s=in1 y#$ n#<. K0 N#< < it. It ll de+ends <h t y#$ *e n by s=in1. @h t d# y#$ *e n by s=in1A E)0 @e ll =n#< <e need th t +l$sH <e < nt th t +l$s. K0 IB* n#t t l=in1 #% +l$s. IB* s=in12 BA++ rently y#$Bre ll s tis%ied t# cre te this thin1 th t < yAB E)0 @ith#$t the +l$s. K0 Y#$ h ?e ne?er s=ed the +l$sL MI0 Krishn 7i2 n#b#dy h s s id theyBre s tis%ied. D#es nyb#dy %eel s tis%iedA K0 Then s= itL As= itL MI0 @h t else c n <e... A K0 As= itL MI0 IM* s=in1L MC0 Y#$ *e n s= #$rsel?es2 n#t s=... K0 N#2 y#$ s= it. MI0 @h t is *issin1 %r#* thisA E)0 H#< d# <e 1et itA H#< d# <e s=A K0 N#2 n#2 n#. Y#$Bre s=in1 intellect$ lly. Jl#n1 + $seK A%ter ll2 this is ri1ht2 <h t y#$ re s=in12 <h t y#$ re s yin1H t +e E y#$ %#ll#<A E ll th t *$st e4ist. Ri1htA 3e#+le c#*e t# disc$ss2 t# 1# < y2 t l= t# #thers2 c#*e b c=2 #r hel+ #thers E y#$ %#ll#<A E the *#?e*ent. I $nderst nd th t. Th t y#$ *$st h ?e. S# let $s be cle r #n th t +#int. Ri1htA N#< I * s=in1 *ysel%2 BIs th t ll I < ntAB 3erh +s <e c n cre te th t % irly e sily. Ri1htA Is th t ll y#$ < ntA >0 I thin= <e ll < nt t# 1# th t ste+ %$rther2 b$t <e d#nBt =n#< <h t th t ste+ is s#*eh#<. K0 I < nt s#*ethin1 tre*end#$s t# h ++en there2 + rt %r#* ll this. Ri1htA I d#nBt =n#< <h t th t tre*end#$s thin1 is2 b$t I < nt s#*ethin1 tre*end#$s <hen I c#*e there2 + rt %r#* ll the thin1s <hich <e h ?e been disc$ssin12 st tes nd ll the rest #% it. I < nt s#*ethin1 t# h ++en t# bl st *y *edi#crity. Ri1htA I de* nd itL I *$st h ?e itL IB?e c#*e ll th t < y 7$st t# disc$ss <ith 1r#$+ #% +e#+le <h# re c#**itted t# this. IB?e le%t *y <i%eH she s id2 B(# t# hell2 i% y#$ 1# thereB. IB?e le%t e?erythin1 nd I c#*e here2 nd y#$ disc$ss <ith *e nd 1i?e *e ... ll the rest #% it. Y#$ 8/

$nderst nd <h t IB* s yin1A E)0 I thin= y#$Bre e4+ectin1 1re t de l. K0 N#2 n#. I < nt itL MI0 '$t +e#+le < nt this <hen they 1# t# he r y#$2 Krishn 7i. K0 Oh2 y#$ +e#+le d#nBt... D# y#$ < nt itA As *e*bers #% the "#$nd ti#n2 y#$ < nt th t tre*end#$s thin1 thereA 'ec $se i% y#$ d#nBt s= %#r the tre*end#$s thin12 the tre*end#$s thin1 <#nBt h ++en. "$ll st#+. "@0 Krishn 7i2 in the $nderst ndin1 #% the te chin1s2 is it n#t i*+lied th t *y *edi#crity is bl sted < yA K0 I $nderst nd2 sir2 b$t th tBs #nly ... I < nt s#*ethin1 tre*end#$s2 the 1re test thin1 t# h ++en t O7 i2 t the Centre. I d#nBt =n#< <h t it is. IB?e re d the b##=sH IB?e been thr#$1h ll th t2 b$t <hen I c#*e here I < nt tre*end#$s2 y#$ =n#<2 b$rst #% s#*ethin12 *y 1$ts2 nythin1L MC0 '$t2 Krishn 7i2 s$rely %r#* the < y y#$ re +$ttin1 this2 <e re ll s=in1 this D$esti#n <r#n1ly2 t# y#$. K0 Yes. MC0 Yes2 <e thin= <e < nt this thin1 tre*end#$sly2 b$t y#$ see th t <e d#nBt. K0 N#2 y#$Bre n#t s=in1 it. N#2 < it2 n#2 +le se. N#t y#$ ... Y#$ re n#t cre tin1 #%%er the tre*end#$s thin1L Centre th t <ill

MC0 'ec $se be%#re <e c n d# th t2 <e h ?e t# < nt this tre*end#$s thin1 nd s= %#r it in the ri1ht < y2 <hich <e re n#t d#in1. K0 Yes2 y#$ re n#t d#in1. MC0 S# c nBt y#$ hel+ $s n#< t# ns<er thisA K0 . This is *$ch dee+er th n th t. MC0 '$t isnBt th t the be1innin1A K0 @e re d#in1 it n#<2 l dy. D'0 @h t is this dee+erA K0 I d#nBt thin= E i% I * y 1# b c= t# s#*ethin1 E I d#nBt thin= the b##=s2 the ?ide# t +es ... they re e4cellent2 ri1ht E b$t I d#nBt thin= th tBs the < y t# 1et t# the de+th. They re necess ryH they re ll ri1htH y#$ *$st h ?e ll th tH #ther<ise2 y#$ c nBt ... H ?in1 1#ne thr#$1h ll th t2 th t <ill n#t 1i?e y#$2 #r hel+ t# h ?e th t tre*end#$s de+th. S#*e #ther D$ lity is necess ry. @h t d# y#$ s yA Jl#n1 + $seK 8-

D# y#$ $nderst ndA The b##=s2 ?ide# t +e2 tele?isi#n2 e?erythin1 h s its +l ce. It h s its +l ce. '$t the #ther thin1 c nn#t c#*e thr#$1h this2 th#$1h y#$ *$st h ?e it. Y#$ *$st be <ith#$t %e r. Y#$ %#ll#<A Y#$ h ?e $nderst##d +le s$re nd s#rr#<2 ll the rest #% it. S#*ethin1 else2 y#$ need it. E)0 D# y#$ *e n dedic ti#n t# the... A K0 Y#$ h ?e d#ne ll th t2 #ther<ise... E)0 N#2 b$t I *e n stic=in1 <ith it. K0 Yes2 y#$ h ?e st$c= <ith it. H ?enBt y#$ st$c= <ith it %#r ye rsA E)0 Th tBs ri1ht2 b$t ... K0 Y#$ h ?e st$c= <ith it. N# %e r2 bs#l$tely2 n# tt ch*ent2 ll th t2 s#rr#<H endin1 ll th t is necess ry. Ri1htA '$t th t is n#t the end. M)0 And itBs n#t the < y2 either. K0 O% c#$rse n#t. There is n# < y. IB* tryin1 t# c#n?ey s#*ethin12 nd y#$Bre n#t 1ettin1 it. >0 Y#$ <ere s yin1 <e re n#t s=in1. K0 Y#$ re n#t. I * s=in1. >0 '$t <e re ll here s=in1. K0 I h ?e s=ed2 y#$ h ?enBt s=edL The % ct is y#$ h ?enBt s=ed. >0 The D$esti#n c#*es2 <h t else ... A K0 I < nt the *#st be $ti%$l2 h ++y2 1##d <i%e. Y#$ $nderst nd2 sirA @hen y#$ < nt2 y#$ 1et it. E)0 Y#$ d#nBt 1et it by s=in1. K0 N#2 n#. 'y s=in1 y#$ 1et h#rrible <i%e. Or n <%$l h$sb nd2 <h te?er it is. N#2 y#$ re *issin1 *y +#int. I * n#t tryin1 t# c#n?ey... D# y#$ $nderst nd <h t I * t l=in1 b#$tA >0 N#. K0 N#A @hyA >0 'ec $se I d#nBt =n#< <h t t# s=2 I d#nBt =n#< h#< t# s=. K0 N#2 I didnBt s y th t. D# y#$ $nderst nd <h t I * t l=in1 b#$tA >0 I %eel y#$Bre tryin1 t# ... K0 N#. D# y#$ $nderst ndA

:6

>0 N#2 I d#nBt2 Krishn 7i. K0Q IB* n#t s$re y#$ d#nBt $nderst nd. D#nBt +$t < y e?erythin1. @h t is it he is %eelin1A Jes$sL MI0 Are y#$ s yin12 Krishn 7i2 th t #ne *$st 1# thr#$1h ll the thin1s <ith#$t %e r2 b$t th t is n#t the end in the sense th t #ne is <ith#$t ll these e?ils. Then there is s#*ethin1 entirely di%%erent #% <hich y#$ h ?e s+#=en t ? ri#$s ti*es2 $sed the +hr se Bthe #ther side #% the ri?erB. Is th t <h t y#$ re t l=in1 b#$tA And y#$ %eel th t <e re n#t s=in1 ... K0 3 rtly. @#$ld it be ri1ht t# s y #ne is #n this side #% the b n= E y#$ %#ll#<A E bec $se y#$ h ?e c#*e t# th t side #% the b n=. And re <e tryin1 t# 1et t# the #ther b n= #% the ri?er2 re <e tryin1 th tA A* I +$ttin1 it ll <r#n1lyL DS0 Are y#$ s yin1 s#*ethin1 li=e0 bein1 %ree #% %e r nd bein1 %ree #% ll th t2 is li=e n e4ercise #% the intellectH y#$ $nderst nd it ... K0 N#2 n#. Y#$ re %reeL N#t $nderst nd it. DS0 As y#$ d# it2 s# s#*ethin1 h ++ens ... K0 N#L Y#$ end %e rL N#t B s it h ++ensB. Y#$ h ?e n# %e r. Y#$ h ?e $nderst##d the <h#le b$siness #% +le s$re. Y#$ h ?e $nderst##d <h t it *e ns t# s$%%er2 end s$%%erin1. Y#$ end it2 n#t +l y <ith it2 1# #n. 'ec $se th tBs <h t heBs t l=in1 b#$t2 i% y#$ h ?e re d the b##=s2 the t +es. D'0 ArenBt <e +#intin1 #$t th t th tBs #nly the %#$nd ti#n l yin1 nd is s#*ethin1 else n#< re dy #r ble t# h ++enA K0 Y#$ h ?e l id the %#$nd ti#n. Ri1htA @h t thenA E'0 ItBs s#*ethin1 s# l r1e th t <e c nBt re lly c#ncei?e #% it. The sc#+e is t## ? st. K0 N#2 itBs n#t t# be c#ncei?ed. It c nn#t be c#ncei?ed. E'0 @e re intellect$ liGin1 b#$t it n#< bec $se <e re tryin1 t# i* 1ine <h t it is. Ob?i#$sly <e c nBt d# th t. K0 Ah2 y#$ c nBt i* 1ine2 y#$ c nBt ?is$ liGe it2 y#$ c nBt +l y <ith it2 y#$ c nBt... N#. )etBs st#+ this. I <ill c#*e b c= t# it little l ter. D#nBt y#$ < nt s#*ethin1 tre*end#$s t# h ++en t the CentreA D# y#$ ct$ llyA 3le se listen c re%$lly. D# y#$ < nt s#*ethin1 1re t t# h ++en thereA Is th t <h t y#$ re b$rnin1 <ithA Or Jd# y#$K s y2 BYes2 <h t =ind #% +e#+le2 <h t =ind #% this2 <h t =ind #% ... AB Y#$ %#ll#<A Is th t <h t y#$ <#$ld die %#rA Y#$ %#ll#< <h t I *e nA S#*ethin1 tre*end#$s2 s#*ethin1 e4tr #rdin rily 1re t t# h ++en thereA Other<ise2 <h tA Is this <h t y#$ < ntA I% y#$ re lly2 <ith y#$r bl##d2 y#$r 1$ts2 <ith ll y#$r bein12 < nt it2 it <ill t =e +l ceL Ri1htA Th tBs ll. Jl#n1 + $seK Y#$ see <e h ?e been t l=in1 ll the ti*e E b##=s2 t +es2 he r hi* t l=2 ?ide# t +e E b$t <e h ?e ne?er s id2 B)##=2 <e *$st 1et the #therB. D# y#$ %#ll#< <h t I * s yin1A D# y#$A BI *$st h ?e :,

the #ther. I h ?e been thr#$1h ll this. IB?e %inished. I d#nBt < nt e?en t# disc$ss it <ith ny#ne. IBll disc$ss it2 b$t IB?e l id the %#$nd ti#n. I d#nBt < nt t# s+end the rest #% *y li%e l yin1 the %#$nd ti#n. T# s+end *y <h#le li%e l yin1 the %#$nd ti#n is *edi#crity. '$t IB?e %inished <ith itH IB?e d#ne itB. Then I s y2 BThereBs s#*ethin1 *$ch *#re th t *$st t =e +l ceB. I thin= <e re ns<erin1 #nly the i**edi te D$esti#ns. @e re n#t s=in1 the *#st di%%ic$lt D$esti#ns. Y#$ $nderst ndA Jl#n1 + $seK I c#*e there. I h ?e l id the %#$nd ti#n s % r s I c n2 nd I <#nBt s+end the rest #% *y li%e l yin1 the %#$nd ti#n. I c#*e there t# %inish the %#$nd ti#n by disc$ssin1 <ith ll #% y#$ t the Centre. I < nt t# %inish th t thin1. Ri1htA Th tBs the re s#n I c#*e there. IB?e <#r=ed t it2 nd I d#nBt < nt t# s+end the ne4t %i%ty ye rs2 bric= by bric= by bric=H I h ?e %inished <ith it. I c#*e there t# c#*+letely l y the %#$nd ti#n s# th t n#thin1 c n sh =e it. Th tBs the re s#n I <#$ld c#*e there. Then I <#$ld < nt ls# s#*ethin1 *#re th n th t E th tBs #b?i#$s. @ill I 1et itA B(et itB in D$#tesH BIB in D$#tes. @hen I l y the %#$nd ti#n there is n# BIB2 b$t IB* 7$st s yin12 BI h ?e l id the %#$nd ti#nH IB?e %inished <ith itH I < nt *$ch *#re th n th tB. Jl#n1 + $seK S# I s y t# *ysel%2 B@h t is it I R< ntFA !@ nt in the sense2 +le se ... $nderst##dA& @h t is it I < ntL IB?e l id the %#$nd ti#n2 nd I c#*e here2 nd <ith y#$r hel+ I %inish <ith the %#$nd ti#n. Y#$ %#ll#<A And I < nt the d##r t# b$rst #+en t# s#*ethin1 en#r*#$s2 s#*ethin1 <hich is n#t i* 1in ble2 <hich is n#t +$t int# <#rds2 <hich c nn#t be + inted2 ?erb liGedH s#*ethin1 i**e s$r ble. Th t I *$st h ?e. S#2 th tBs the #nly thin1 I < nt2 n#t ll this. 'ec $se I c n d# ll th t2 <ith y#$r hel+. IB?e d#ne it. And th tBs <h t the Centre is *e nt %#r. Y#$ re s=in1 the 1re test thin1. Y#$ %#ll#<A E)0 A* I s=in1 the i*+#ssibleA K0 I*+#ssible. Y#$Bll h ?e the i*+#ssibleL '$t y#$ d#nBt s= it. 'ec $se <e re ll circ$*scribed by... Y#$ %#ll#<A I thin= <eBd better st#+2 d#nBt y#$A
JRe+#rt #% the Intern ti#n l Tr$steesB Meetin1s2 O7 i2 ,-CC C#*+iled <ith *ini*$* editin1 %r#* ?erb ti* tr nscri+ts. Si4th *eetin12 O7 i2 ,:th M rch2 ,-CCK C#+yri1ht ,-CCO,--6 Krishn *$rti "#$nd ti#n Tr$st )i*ited2 'r#c=<##d 3 r=2 H *+shire2 U.K.

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On %i&e' Tea$hings and the Centres

K0 S# <here re <e n#<A K is n# l#n1er here. "r#* t#*#rr#<2 ct$ lly2 <h t <#$ld h ++enA Indi A 'r#c=<##dA I thin= <e #$1ht t# ct s th#$1h2 %r#* n#<. Y#$ %#ll#<A Y#$ $nderst ndA JN#tK s y2 B@eBll < it till the +##r ch + diesB. C n <e ct2 thin=2 %eel2 $nderst nd s th#$1h he is de d nd b$ried2 n#t b$ried2 b$rned2 inciner ted2 +$t < yA @h t <ill y#$ d#A )etBs +r#ceed %r#* thereA )##= t the +r#ble*s #% the Centre. Ri1htA Ed$c ti#n2 ll the *in#r thin1s <e c n e sily settle2 b$t the D$ lity #% the Centre2 the %ire #% the Centre2 the +e ce #% the Centre2 the stren1th #% the Centre2 the ?it lity2 the %l *e E y#$ =n#<A E n#t de+endent #n ny direct#r2 bec $se in this +r#cess there is n# direct#rH <e re ll t#1ether. @h t <ill y#$ d#A 3le se ... MC0 I thin= #ne thin1 th t see*s t# be e*er1in1 in these disc$ssi#ns is s#*ethin1 th t * ny #% $s re r ther %r id #%2 <hich is the c#nnecti#n bet<een y#$r li%e nd y#$r te chin1 in rel ti#nshi+ t# the Centres nd h#< <e <ill c#ntin$e this. K0 Oh2 I see. I see. Y#$ re s yin12 BIs there di%%erence bet<een y#$r d ily li%e nd the te chin1sAB MC0 This is =ey D$esti#n. K0 'et<een the +ers#n nd the te chin12 bet<een his l##=s2 his beh ?i#$r2 ll th t2 nd the te chin12 the <h#le thin1. There h s been tendency t# di?ide the t<#. MC0 'ec $se <e didnBt < nt t# <#rshi+ #r * =e ... K0 N#t #nly th t. It be1 n <hen K s id s#*ethin1 nd the +e#+le r#$nd hi* s id2 BN# th tBs <r#n12 <h t y#$Bre s yin12 bec $se y#$Bre c#**itted E t# $th#rityB. 3le se t =e int# cc#$nt2 IB?e been thr#$1h ll this2 I s id2 BN# $th#rity2 +riests2 ll the rest #% it2 $th#rity in the s+irit$ l sense #% th t <#rdB. I le rn the ?i#lin %r#* n $th#rity2 <eBre n#t t l=in1 #% th t =ind #% $th#rity. S#2 <hen I be1 n2 in ,-9:2 #r 982 9:2 952 I s id n# $th#rity. The +e#+le r#$nd *e s id2 BTh t is K s+e =in1 <hen he s id Fn# $th#rityF2 nd <hen the te cher s+e =s heBll s y s#*ethin1 entirely di%%erentB. MC0 Oh2 I see <h t y#$Bre s yin1. They di?ided the +#<er th t c#*es %r#* y#$ s se+ r te %r#* y#$A K0 Yes. This is +#st#lic s$ccessi#n in di%%erent < yH the 1$r$2 in di%%erent < y. S#. And #thers h ?e s id2 BK is n#r* l * n2 b$t <hen he te ches he is di%%erent * nB. This 1 *e h s been +l yed endlessly %#r the l st %i%ty ye rs. S# <h t re y#$ s=in1A In the Centre2 <h t is the rel ti#nshi+ #% * n <h# s ys2 BTell *e b#$t K2 + rt %r#* the te chin1sB2 #r I s y2 BIB* n#t interested in KH %#r 1#dBs s =e +$t hi* #$tH IB* interested in the te chin1sBA MC0 Yes2 itBs the <h#le D$esti#n #% the rel ti#nshi+ bet<een the li%e nd the te chin12 h#< *$ch they re inte1r l. Al< ys thereBs been this %eelin1 #% the d n1er #% * =in1 ch$rch. K0 A+ rt %r#* th t2 I * s=in1 D$esti#n n#<. H#< <ill y#$ ns<er this D$esti#nA I c#*e %r#* Se ttle nd I s y2 BTell *e ll b#$t hi*. IB* interested2 little2 in the te chin1s2 b$t re lly I < nt t# =n#< the +ers#n l thin1sB. H#< <ill y#$ ns<er th tA @ it *in$teL H#< <ill y#$ ns<er the * n <h# s ys2 BIB* n#t interested in the +ers#n. Yes2 nice #r +le s nt2 IB* n#t interested2 b$t IB* dee+ly :8

interested in the te chin1sB. H#< <ill y#$ ns<er these t<# D$esti#nsA D'0 Are y#$ s yin1 th t <e sh#$ld cl ri%y <hether there < s <h t y#$Bre s yin1A c#nsistency bet<een y#$r li%e nd

K0 Yes2 ll the rest #% it. @ s his te chin1 se+ r te %r#* his li%eA @ s he *ent lly der n1edA @ s he2 <hen he s+#=e2 e?erythin1 < s * r?ell#$sA D'0 There re +e#+le li=e th t <h# re ?ery 1##d #n cert in +#ints2 li=e CeG nne #r ; n (#1h2 b$t #n #ther +#ints they * y be ?ery c#n%$sed. E)0 '$t th tBs di%%erent K0 N#. Th tBs si*ile. 3le se2 d#nBt r$in the si*ile. I le d cr##=ed li%e2 h*A I s y #ne thin1 nd... IB* c#n%$sed2 in< rdly. '$t <hen I t l=2 s#*ethin1 h ++ens. D'0 Y#$ *i1ht be ins+ired2 y#$ see. K0 Yes2 ins+ired. (# int# it. I% y#$ < nt t# 1# int# the ... Y#$ =n#< the <h#le ide #% the Hind$s2 <here there is * ni%est ti#n #% the 1re test2 b$t <hen th t t =es +l ce nd he s+e =s2 th t c#*es #$t2 nd <hen th tBs 1#ne heBs 7$st +##r little bli1hter r#$nd the c#rner. S#rry. I d#nBt thin= y#$ re % cin1 the +r#ble*. E'0 Ob?i#$sly the * n nd the te chin12 the te cher nd the te chin1s2 re #ne thin1H thereBs n# se+ r ti#n there. K0 @ it *in$te. The te cher * y be ... Y#$ d#nBt li?e <ith hi*. Y#$ d#nBt < tch hi* e?ery *in$te. He 1#es t# his r##* nd s*#=es2 drin=s2 nd c rries #n <ith birds2 <h te?er it is. Y#$ re n#t % cin1 this ?ery i*+#rt nt D$esti#n. Y#$ re 1#in1 t# be % ced <ith it. I < nt t# =n#< i% he < s $thentic. I c#*e t# M ry Ii*b list nd s y2 BY#$ h ?e =n#<n hi*2 y#$ < tched #?er hi*2 < shed dishes nd he hel+ed y#$2 ir#ned nd ll this nd th tH he t l=ed 1re t de l b#$t c#*+ ssi#n. @ s he li=e thisAB MC0 Are y#$ s yin1 th t2 in the %ield #% *$sic2 #r + intin12 #r <h te?er2 +ers#nBs ch r cter c n be t 1re t ? ri nce <ith their bilityA K0 Th tBs 7$st <h t IB* s yin1. MC0 '$t in this %ield <hich is the essenti l thin1 #% li%e2 the reli1i#$s2 the tr$th #% li%e2 there c nn#t be di?isi#n bet<een ... K0 '$t this * n < nts t# =n#<. M)0 Did he li?e s he s+#=eA Th tBs +ertinent D$esti#n. K0 Yes. S# h#< <ill y#$ ns<er hi*A Se?er l0 @e <#$ld tell hi*. K0 Th tBs ll. I <#$ld s= M ry Ii*b list2 BY#$B?e seen hi* +r ctic lly e?ery d y %#r the l st ten ::

ye rs2 did he li?e cc#rdin1 t# <h t he s idAB And i% y#$ s y2 BU**2 I thin= s# Jl $1hterK DS0 @hen <e %irst st rted 'r#c=<##d2 I th#$1ht0 B@hen he dr <s in cl#se2 <ill this be s#*e#ne 7$st li=e e?ery#ne elseAB K0 And did y#$ %ind #$tA DS0 Yes. And he h s t# %ind #$t. K0 Y#$ h ?e t# sh#< hi* th t he < s n#t le din1 d#$ble li%e. "$ll st#+. Or he < s. S# y#$ h ?e t# tell hi* th t. Th tBs ll *y +#int. This is D$esti#n I * s=in1 y#$2 h#< <ill y#$ ns<er the D$esti#n2 th tBs ll. Ne4t +#int is2 K is 1#neH <h t <ill y#$ d#A The CentreA D'0 I * li=e this * n <h# is #nly interested in the te chin1s. K0 Yes. I2 +ers#n lly2 <#$ld s y2 BS#rry2 IB* n#t interested in the +ers#nH IB* bs#l$tely interested in the te chin1s. C$t it #$t. I < nt #nly th t2 n#t ll the thin1s r#$nd itB. E'0 Then is it +#ssible t# s y t# the * n %r#* Se ttle <h# < nts t# =n#< b#$t y#$2 +ers#n lly2 is it +#ssible t# s y t# hi*2 BY#$ c n %ind the * n thr#$1h the te chin1sBA K0 YesH y#$ h ?e n ns<er. Or y#$ c n s y2 #h IB* s#rryH IB?e he rd hi* t l=in1 +$blicly2 IB?e seen hi* e tin12 b$t I re lly d#nBt =n#<. Y#$ *$st h ?e n ns<er2 nd be cle rH th tBs ll *y +#int. S# <h t <ill y#$ d# <ith the * n <h# s ys2 I * n#t interested in the +ers#n2 I * n#t %#ll#<er2 n#t de?#tee2 I * #nly interested in the te chin1sA H#< <ill y#$ *eet hi*A 'ec $se y#$ * y h ?e +ers#n l %%ecti#n %#r hi* nd y#$Bll +r#7ect th t int# the te chin1s. MC0 I thin= the +#int y#$ * de yesterd y < s ?ery necess ry here2 bec $se IB?e l< ys th#$1ht the te chin1s st##d l#ne2 nd <hen <e t l=ed yesterd y y#$ * de this +#int ?ery str#n1ly th t this < s n#t D$ite tr$e. I s id +e#+le re d Krishn 7iBs b##=s nd h ?e ne?er *et hi*2 b$t there re2 ne?ertheless2 +e#+le ll #?er the <#rld <h#se li?es h ?e ch n1ed %$nd *ent lly <ith#$t ny +ers#n l c#nt ct. There%#re2 I th#$1ht the li%e nd the te chin1s didnBt h ?e t# be +$t #?er t#1ether. '$t y#$ * de the +#int ?ery cle rly th t ll thr#$1h hist#ry there h ?e been the te chers2 the s ints2 the *ystics s yin12 BJ$d1e *e n#t by h#< I li?e2 b$t #nly by <h t I s yB. This le ?es 1re t * r1in %#r s+ec$l ti#n nd err#r. '$t %r#* <h t y#$B?e been s yin1 recently2 I 1et this di%%erent sense th t <e d# h ?e t# brin1 t# +e#+le the +er%$*e #% the li%e s <ell s the te chin1s. K0 Th tBs ll2 yes. M)0 They re n#t se+ r te. Th tBs the +#int. E)0 '$t y#$ c nBt se+ r te the te chin1s %r#* #$rsel?es2 either. K0 Th tBs ll. Y#$B?e ns<ered the D$esti#n. D# y#$ $nderst nd <h t y#$ h ?e ns<eredA @h t h ?e y#$ ns<eredA

:5

E)0 It see*s t# *e th t <eBre the #nes <h# re the te chin1s2 s# it d#esnBt * =e ny di%%erence <hether y#$Bre here2 #r <hether y#$Bre n#t here2 nd th t is the #nly thin1 th t <e c n + ss #n. K0 S# <h t h ++ens thenA I% y#$ re the te chin12 y#$ re i*b$ed <ith it2 <h t h ++ensA Y#$ re the te cher. T)0 @e re n#t % =e. K0 Y#$ re n#t % =eL E)0 It c#$ld be ?ery e sily % =ed. K0 O% c#$rse. Th tBs <hy <e *$st l y the %#$nd ti#n. @h t <ill y#$ d# i% K is n#t there ny*#re %r#* t#*#rr#<2 <ith the CentreA @e h ?e 1reed2 ll #% $s2 th t there *$st be +l ce %#r disc$ssi#n2 nd <here +e#+le c n be D$iet2 disc$ss2 rest2 n#t be in?#l?ed in ll the n#ise #% the <#rld. Ri1htA @ill y#$ +r#?ide th tA Th#se in Indi 2 'r#c=<##d2 here2 nd in C n d A Y#$ re res+#nsible %#r thisA Y#$ h ?e $ndert =en itH y#$ re res+#nsible. N#t "ritG2 l#ne2 y#$ re ll res+#nsible. Ri1ht2 sirA E'0 @h t h ++ens %ter $sA K0 A%ter y#$2 y#$ <ill %ind y#$n1 +e#+le t# t =e #?er. There%#re itBs i*+#rt nt t# h ?e y#$n1 +e#+le in the "#$nd ti#nsH =ee+ the b ll r#llin12 #ther<ise it dies. S# c n y#$ +r#?ide this thin1 th t <e st rted #$t <ith2 +l ce %#r disc$ssi#n2 h ?in1 di l#1$eA 3le se +r#ceed. I c#*e %r#* Se ttle nd there y#$ re2 1r#$+ #% y#$2 t the Centre. IB* % irly intelli1entH d#nBt tre t *e li=e n i** t$re b$siness* n2 #r n i** t$re tr ?eller2 see=in12 sh#++in1. IB?e c#*e nd I < nt t# disc$ss <ith y#$2 I < nt t# 1# int# di l#1$e <ith y#$2 dee+ly b#$t %e r. N#t ther +e$tic lly. I < nt t# end %e r. I see the i*+#rt nce #% it nd2 by c#*in1 here2 I h#+e t# end it. And t the s *e ti*e I < nt +l ce <here I c n rest nd be D$iet. O$t #% th t D$ietness2 s#*ethin1 * y h ++en t# *e. 'ein1 there2 disc$ssin12 s#*ethin1 * y y#$ d#A E)0 @eB?e been ?ery de+endent #n y#$. K0 Th tBs 7$st it. And heBs de d. I < nt t# *eet y#$ ll. I < nt t# s+end three <ee=s t O7 i nd d$rin1 th#se three <ee=s I < nt t# end %e r. I d#nBt < nt t# 1# h#*e t the end #% it2 %e r%$l. I < nt t# end it. I c#*e there %ter re din1 the b##=s2 seein1 the t +es nd I < nt t# h ?e di l#1$e bec $se I < nt t# end %e r. Y#$ re res+#nsible. Y#$ re res+#nsible t# hel+ *e t# end %e r. I c#*e <ith ?ery deter*ined * nner b#$t it2 ?ery rdent b$sinessEli=e * nner b#$t it. I d#nBt < nt t# +l y r#$nd. IB?e been t# se?er l #ther cr n=y +l ces nd they +l y <ith *e. I d#nBt < nt t# +l y r#$nd ny *#reH I < nt t# end %e r in *ysel%. I < nt D$iet2 %irst2 t# %eel th t r#$nd *e e?erythin1 is D$iet2 th t +e#+le re n#t %i1htin12 nd there is n# 7e l#$sy2 nd ll th t. I < nt +l ce <here I c n 1# int# the 1 rden nd sit $nder tree. '$t <hen I *eet y#$ ll t# disc$ss I < nt tensi#n2 y#$ %#ll#<A S# th t y#$ dri?e *e t# $nderst nd it. Y#$ dri?e *e2 hel+ *e2 +$t *e in c#rner2 cre te crisis in *y li%e2 s# th t IBll be %ree #% %e r. H#< <ill y#$ de l <ith itA I% y#$ s y2 BIB* s#rry2 I c nBt hel+ y#$ t# end %e r2 b$t <e c n h ?e di l#1$e b#$t it2 bec $se I h ?e n#t ended *y %e r nd there%#re let $s 1# int# it t#1ether2 e ch %eelin1 the $r1ency #% endin1 %e r2 s# <eBll hel+ e ch #ther t# end %e rB. @#$ld y#$ s y th tA S# there is n# :.

$th#rity. I h ?e n#t ended *y %e rH y#$ h ?e n#t ended %e r. 'y c#*in1 t#1ether2 sittin1 D$ietly2 h ?in1 di l#1$e e?ery d y2 #r e?ery #ther d y2 <e * y hel+ e ch #ther t# diss#l?e it. Then y#$ h ?e s#*ethin12 y#$ %#ll#<A Then I =n#< I * de lin1 <ith h#nest +e#+le2 n#t +h#ney cr#<d. And I c#*e here. At the end #% the three <ee=s2 I *$st be #$t #% it2 s# *y $r1ency <ill * =e y#$ $r1ent ls#. It <ill cre te n $r1ency in y#$. And ls# *$ch *#re c#*+le4 +r#ble*s. I < nt t# $nderst nd de th2 *edit ti#n. IB?e tried IenH IB* % irly seri#$s * n2 there%#re I d#nBt try TM nd ll th t b$siness. IB?e st$died little bit #% Ien *edit ti#n nd Hind$ *edit ti#n. And K is s yin1 s#*ethin1 t#t lly di%%erent2 s# IB?e c#*e here. @ill y#$ hel+ *e t# $nderst nd th t *edit ti#nA I c n 1# #n li=e this. 3le seL Other<ise the Centre bec#*es r ther silly. ItBs n#t <#rth it. E)0 Krishn 7i2 y#$B?e s+ent l#n1 li%eti*e t l=in1 t# 1r#$+s2 indi?id$ ls2 nd t l=in1 t# $s s y#$ re t#d yH nd s$ddenly y#$Bre 1#ne nd <e h ?e t# d# this in three <ee=sL K0 S#2 d# it. D# it. Y#$ h ?e h d ten ye rs2 %i%teen ye rs. E'0 '$t I <#$ld s y2 y#$B?e s id it s# *$ch better2 y#$B?e d#ne it s# *$ch2 <e h ?e ll these * r?ell#$s t +es ... K0 I c#*e here. Other<ise <h tBs the +#int #% CentreA I c#*e here %r#* T#=y#2 #r Se ttle. My intenti#n is ?ery seri#$s. I c#*e t# y#$ s 1r#$+ nd I < nt t# 1# int# this nd y#$ s y2 B)etBs listen t# t +eB2 nd I s y2B BAll ri1ht2 letBs listen t# t +eB2 nd then I s y2 BN#<2 letBs disc$ss it2 y#$ nd IB. I < nt di l#1$eH I < nt t# %ind #$t. M)0 Y#$Bre s=in1 $s t# d# it n#<2 <hile y#$Bre still here. K0 Yes. IB?e still 1#t ten ye rsH %#r 1#dBs s =e2 $se *e. It * y be t<# ye rs #r ne4t <ee=. In th t ti*e ... The % ther is de d2 #r the *#ther is de d. Y#$ h ?e t# 1r#< $+ nd s y2 B)etBs % ce thisB. This +r#ble* is 1#in1 t# rise. Y#$ $nderst nd thisA

JRe+#rt #% the Intern ti#n l Tr$steesB Meetin1s2 O7 i2 ,-CC. C#*+iled <ith *ini*$* editin1 %r#* ?erb ti* tr nscri+ts. Se?enth *eetin12 O7 i2 ,.th M rch2 ,-CCK C#+yri1ht ,-CCO,--6 Krishn *$rti "#$nd ti#n Tr$st )i*ited2 'r#c=<##d 3 r=2 H *+shire2 U.K.

:C

On the Centre
Krishn *$rti0 @eB?e 1#t 7$st #ne *#re <ee=2 h ?enBt <eA J$st ne4t <ee=. H ?e y#$ settled *#st #% the #ther thin1s2 li=e the +$blic ti#nsA All ri1ht. @e disc$ssed the Centre l st ti*e2 didnBt <e. "@0 @e disc$ssed 1$ilt. K0 ($ilt2 I =n#<2 b$t <e *$st settle cert in thin1s2 *$stnBt <e2 b#$t the Centre. @h# <ill2 i% I * y s=2 be res+#nsible %#r the <h#le thin1 hereA @h# <ill be res+#nsible2 n#t %#r the sch##l #r the Centre2 b$t t# see the <h#le thin1 %l#<erin1 +r#+erlyA E'0 @#$ld it be 1r#$+ #% +e#+le2 #r n indi?id$ lA K0 Y#$ see2 "ritG @ilhel* c lls hi*sel%2 #r <e th#$1ht he <#$ld be2 Direct#r. I thin= i% <e c#$ld *#?e < y %r#* n *es0 3rinci+ ls2 Direct#rs2 He ds #% sch##ls. Y#$ %#ll#<A I thin= E i% y#$ c#$ld <#r= t#1ether in this thin12 r ther th n #ne * n #r t<# +e#+le2 #r #ne <#* n r$nnin1 the <h#le circ$s. IB* t l=in1 b#$t the sch##l2 the "#$nd ti#n2 the Centre. @h# is 1#in1 t# be res+#nsible t# see th t the thin1 is %l#<erin1 ri1ht A I <#nder i% IB* +$ttin1 it ri1ht A E)0 The +e#+le <h# li?e here ll the ti*e. K0 Yes2 ll the ti*e2 *#st #% the ti*e. Y#$ t<#2 R$th2 nd th#se t<#. Y#$ $nderst nd *y D$esti#nA I h ?e %eelin12 I * y be t#t lly <r#n12 the Centres in Indi 2 'r#c=<##d2 O7 i2 C n d sh#$ld =n#< <h t is h ++enin1 *#n1st #$rsel?es2 these %#$r. I% they re d#in1 s#*ethin1 s+eci l in C n d 2 <e sh#$ld =n#< b#$t it here. Y#$ $nderst nd <h t I * s yin1A S# th t there is c#nst nt r ++#rt. MC0 @hen y#$ s y Bs#*ethin1 s+eci lB2 <h t d# y#$ *e nA K0 . S#*e#ne *i1ht try di%%erent < y #% ++r# chin1 the Centre2 the +r#ble* #% the Centre. And in Indi they * y d# s#*ethin1 D$ite di%%erent. S# I %eel y#$ sh#$ld c#rres+#nd2 re+#rt2 =ee+ in t#$ch <ith #ne n#therH the sch##ls2 the Centre. N#t the d*inistr ti?e nd le1 l sideH th tBs i*+#ssible2 #% c#$rse. It c nn#t be d#ne. @hen K dies E th tBs h#< <e be1 n this <h#le thin1 ll #% y#$ <ill be res+#nsible2 ll #% the "#$nd ti#ns. Res+#nsible in the sense th t2 n#t #nly *e*bers #% the "#$nd ti#n re %l#<erin12 nd <ith#$t ny sense #% 1$ilt. @ill the "#$nd ti#ns cti?ely hel+ e ch #ther t# bl#ss#* nd %l#<er in the te chin1s nd the CentreH hel+ t# brin1 b#$t2 in the Centre2 sense #% B#thernessBA @ill y#$ $ndert =e t# d# ll th tA E)0 It <#$ld be ?ery e sy t# s y yes #r n# t# th t.

JRe+#rt #% the Intern ti#n l Tr$steesB Meetin1s2 O7 i2 ,-CC C#*+iled <ith *ini*$* editin1 %r#* ?erb ti* tr nscri+ts. Ninth *eetin12 O7 i2 96th M rch2 ,-CCK C#+yri1ht ,-CCO,--6 Krishn *$rti "#$nd ti#n Tr$st )i*ited2 'r#c=<##d 3 r=2 H *+shire2 U.K.

:/

The Centre and m( !dharma"

E)0 Krishn 7i2 the thin1 th t b#thers *e is2 I < s ?ery cle r #n <h t it is <e re t# + ss #nH <h t y#$Bre + ssin1 #n. R dh r ised ?ery 1##d +#int the #ther d y <hen she s id2 B@e =ee+ re%errin1 t# the te chin12 t# KBs te chin12 t# the te chin1H re <e cle r b#$t th tAB And <h t is it th t y#$Bre + ssin1 #n2 nd <eBre t# + ss #n2 th t li?in1 thin1A IB* n#t cle r b#$t th t. It isnBt +r#ble* #% brin1in1 in y#$n1er +e#+le2 b$t the thin1 itsel%. K0 D#nBt y#$2 %ter these ye rs2 i% I * y s= ... I <#nBt $se the <#rd B$nderst ndB ... li?e2 del?e2 %ind2 li=e enterin1 *ine nd disc#?erin1 *#re nd *#re nd *#re 1#ld. .. Or re y#$ s yin12 BS#rry2 itBs t## di%%ic$lt %#r *e. ItBs bey#nd *eH itBs i*+#ssibleFA Y#$ =n#<2 bl#c=in1 y#$rsel%. T =e ste+ nd then bl#c= y#$rsel%. @h t * I t# d#A The te chin1s re ... ri1htA The +ers#n <h# t $1ht these te chin1s is $ni*+#rt nt. The te chin1s re i*+#rt nt2 nd the te chin1s c#?er the <h#le %ield #% li%e. Other<ise itBs n#t <#rth it. And in the + st the te chin1s 1#t s# s$llied nd *essed nd n#< itBs +rinted there re #ri1in l c#+ies etc.2 t +es2 etc. Is th t llA Is th t ll in the sense th t th#se +e#+le <h# h ?e =n#<n the +ers#n <h# h s br#$1ht these te chin1s2 h ?enBt they rel ti#nshi+ t# the +ers#n nd t# the te chin1sA And <h t is th t rel ti#nshi+A J$st listeners2 e4+l#rersA J$st 1#in1 little bit int# the *ineA The +ers#n h s 1#ne little bit int# the *ine2 h*A "#r r$bies #r <h te?er it is2 nd he s ys2 BC#*e nd l##= t this e4tr #rdin ry ?einH itBll 1# #n inde%initelyB. And y#$ s y2 BIB* s#rry2 etc.2 etc.B nd y#$ st#+ t the entr nce t# the c ?e. Or re y#$ s *e*bers #% the "#$nd ti#n +enetr tin1 dee+ly int# the c ?eA @e h ?e n#<2 *#re #r less2 settled b#$t the +$blic ti#ns2 b#$t e?erythin1 E y#$ %#ll#<A E ll the s$+er%ici l d*inistr ti?e thin1s. It is settled s % r s IB* c#ncerned. I% Indi c#*+l ins2 #r y#$ c#*+l in2 IB* 1#in1 t# + ss it... IB* #$t #% .itH IB* n#t 1#in1 t# 7#in in this 1 *e ny *#re. S#rry2 IB* * =in1 it ?ery si*+le s# th t <eBre ll cle r ... As th t is ll settled2 s % r s IB* c#ncerned2 I < nt t# =n#< <h t y#$ re 1#in1 t# d# b#$t it ll2 b#$t the *ine in <hich there is +lenty #% 1#ld. Th tBs the * in re s#n <e 1#t t#1ether. All the sec#nd ry re s#ns h ?e been h ++ily settled2 s % r s IB* c#ncerned. The * in thin1 is still2 ? 1$ely2 le%t. @ill the Centre E <e <#nBt c ll it n B d$lt CentreBH th t s#$nds silly E the Centre2 nd it is centre E #% * n. I li=e th t <#rd BCentreB2 letBs cce+t it. Centre #% li1htH centre #% s#*ethin1 en#r*#$sly 1re t. At le st I %eel th t. And K is 1#ne nd heBs le%t it <ith y#$. @h tBs 1#in1 t# h ++enA ItBs ll ri1ht %#r the ne4t ten ye rs bec $se K h#+es t# li?e %#r the ne4t ten ye rs #r *#re E n#t Bh#+esBH +r#b bly he <ill. And %ter< rdsA In the #ld d ys2 te chers s id2 BY#$Bre *y disci+leH I <ill te ch y#$. D#nBt *is$se it2 d#nBt inter+ret it2 nd d#nBt s+#il itB2 nd the disci+les s id2 BM ster2 IBll cce+t itB. '$t they h d their #<n idi#syncr sies2 d#r ti#n2 de?#ti#n. They s id2 BAh2 he did *ir cles ... B Y#$ %#ll#<A And dist#rted the <h#le thin1. N#< <h t is 1#in1 t# h ++en <ith $sA It * y n#t be settled by the end #% the <ee=2 b$t IB* 1#in1 t# +$rs$e this %#r the rest #% *y li%e2 <ith the "#$nd ti#ns. Ri1htA N#t bec $se y#$ re s+eci l +e#+le2 #r I * s+eci l. @e h ++en t# be t#1ether. ItBs h ++ened. "#rt$it#$sly2 #r by ch nce it d#esnBt * tterH it h ++ened. S# *y 7#b is ?ery cle r. O?er the ne4t ten ye rs2 <hene?er <e *eet2 I * 1#in1 t# +$sh this thin1. '$t <h t is y#$r res+#nsibility E <ith#$t ny sense #% 1$ilt. I% y#$ d#nBt c rry #$t th t res+#nsibility2 ll th tBs < shed #$t. @h tBs y#$r Bdh r* B E 1##d <#rd b$t itBs ls# been s+#iled. @h t is the r##t *e nin1 #% th t <#rdA R'0 It re lly *e ns t# h#ld2 t# =ee+2 t# 1$ rd. :-

K0 My Bdh r* B is <h tA N#t t# 1$ rd ... R'0 T# s$st in. K0 T# s$st in the #ri1in2 the #ri1in lH n#t y#$r #ri1in l2 *y #ri1in l2 his #ri1in l2 the #ri1in l2 <hich *e ns D$ite di%%erent thin1. S# i% I * y $se th t <#rd <ith tre*end#$s hesit ti#n2 bec $se th tBs <#rd <hich is ?ery little $nderst##d2 e?en in Indi 2 nd itBs cert inly n#t $nderst##d in the @est2 th t <#rd Bdh r* B *e ns t# h#ld the #ri1in l. I <#nBt $se it2 bec $se it le ds t# ... S# <h t * I t# d# i% I * *e*ber #% the "#$nd ti#n nd K is 1#neA He h s +#$red his li%e nd disc$ssed it <ith y#$ %#r the ne4t ten ye rs. Then 1#ne. @h tBs 1#in1 t# h ++enA The <#rd2 Bs credB. He s ys t# y#$2 BThis is s cred tre s$re2 this *ine <here there is i**ense 1#ld. It is s credH I <ill le ?e it <ith y#$.B @h t <ill y#$ d# <ith itA T$rn it int# C rtier2 Ti%% nyA S#2 +$t y#$rsel% in th t +#siti#n2 %r#* t#d y2 nd see. Y#$ %#ll#<A Y#$ t<#2 R$th2 Mrs 'l $2 the three #% y#$ here2 li?e ... hel+ t# brin1 b c= <h t < s #ri1in lly *e ntA The l nd2 this h#$se ... It h s been tre*end#$s <#r=2 l#t #% ener1y2 1re t de l #% ti*e nd *#ney in 1ettin1 the* 1 in ... All ri1ht th tBs %inished. There <ill be *in#r di%%ic$lties nd ll the rest #% it. Th tBs %inished. And the b##=E=ee+in1 nd ll th t2 y#$ c n h nd it #?er t# s#*e#ne else2 s#*e#ne +r#%essi#n l2 nd th t ends it. And <h t re y#$ %i?e 1#in1 t# d# in En1l nd2 nd in Indi A I see *y Bdh r* B2 <h t I h ?e t# d#. It h snBt been cle r2 b$t in this *eetin1 it h s bec#*e ?ery cle r %#r *ysel%2 %#r K. Is th t s cle r t# y#$2 t##A KBs 7#b n#< is2 + rt %r#* +$blic t l=s nd ll the rest #% th t2 t# 1# <ith the "#$nd ti#n *e*bers in Indi nd here nd in C n d %#r the ne4t %i%teen ye rs2 nd +$sh y#$ nd +$ll y#$ E dri?e E nythin1 int# the c ?e. N#t int# the <ine cell r2 b$t int# s#*ethin1 else. Th tBs ?ery cle r nd I sh ll d# it. I %eel this tre*end#$slyH +le se cce+t th t. "r#* *y seri#$sness2 I %eel this. @h t h ++ensA @h t <ill y#$ d#2 t the end #% ten #r %i%teen ye rsA E)0 I thin= th t #ne #% the di%%ic$lties here is th t <e2 <hene?er <e see e ch #ther2 *e*bers #% the "#$nd ti#n2 <e re l< ys #cc$+ied <ith * tters ... K0 Th tMs %inished <ith n#<. E)0 Yes2 b$t the #++#rt$nity <eB?e h d here t# t l= b#$t dee+er thin1s is #% the $t*#st ? l$e. @e d#nBt see* t# %ind th t ti*e ... K0 Ah. Th tBs <h t h ++ened in 'r#c=<##d. @e disc$ssed it <ith Mrs D. SheBs s# #cc$+ied2 %r#* *#rnin1 till ni1ht2 <ith sch##l * tters2 + rents2 te chers2 st$dents. DS0 I dis 1ree <ith th t Krishn 7i K0 @hyA DS0 IB* #cc$+ied s#*e #% the ti*e <ith th t nd I thin= <eB?e disc#?ered2 here2 th t th t is #ne #% the thin1s th t *$st be l##=ed int#. K0 '$t ... 56

DS0 '$t n#thin1. (et #n <ith it. K0 '$t re y#$2 s Mrs D enterin1 int# the c ?e2 di11in12 %indin1 ne< in1#ts2 ne< thin1s2 #r 7$st $nderst##d th t y#$ re in?#l?ed in the sch##l2 y#$ re hel+in1 the sch##l2 nd s# #nA Are y#$ hel+in1 y#$r te chers t# 1# int# K *#reA DS0 I% #ne isnBt2 then #ne #$1ht t# st#+ d#in1 it. K0 D#nBt ns<er it. IB* n#t s=in1 %#r y#$ t# res+#nd t# the D$esti#n. Is this <h t is bein1 d#ne in Indi nd C n d nd 'r#c=<##d nd hereA IBll d# itH IBll d# it there. Are <e d#in1 the s *e thin1 e?ery<hereA 3le se d#nBt ns<erH IB* 7$st +$ttin1 the D$esti#n %#r y#$ t# l##= t. Is this <h t is h ++enin1 in R 71h tA Rishi ; lleyA ; s nt ;ih rA I c n ns<er th t. "#r %#rty ye rs2 n#thin1 h s been d#ne2 nd n#< it is be1innin1. Ri1htA @#$ld y#$ s y th tA Y#$B?e 1#t t# <#r= t it2 < nt t# d# it. 'e%#re2 there < s ll the tr diti#n2 ll the *ess th t <ent #n. S# IB* ch llen1in1 y#$2 s=in1 y#$2 be11in1 y#$0 BAre y#$ d#in1 thisAB I% y#$ s y2 yes y#$ re d#in1 it2 then it is %inished. DS0 @hy2 Krishn 7iA K0 Then *y ch llen1e h s n# ? l$e. DS0 Y#$ c#$ld dee+en it... K0 IB* s=in1 y#$ t# dee+en it2 n#t I. DS0 ... by disc$ssi#n nd ... K0 @e re d#in1 it2 n#<. This is =ind #% s=in1 it. Are <e d#in1 itA ItBs %i?e *in$tes t# #ne. D# y#$ ll *eet this %tern##nA Y#$ h ?e + rty there2 h ?enBt y#$A "r#* di?ine t# the s$bli*eL

JRe+#rt #% the Intern ti#n l Tr$steesB Meetin1s2 O7 i ,-CC. Ninth *eetin12 O7 i2 96th M rch2 ,-CCK !c& C#+yri1ht ,-CCO,--6 Krishn *$rti "#$nd ti#n Tr$st )i*ited2 'r#c=<##d 3 r=2 H *+shire2 U.K.

5,

)ro$*wood Toda( and in the +uture

"#r %#$rteen ye rs 'r#c=<##d h s been sch##l. It be1 n <ith * ny di%%ic$lties2 l c= #% *#ney nd s# #n2 nd <e ll hel+ed t# b$ild it $+ t# its +resent c#nditi#n. There h ?e been 1 therin1s e?ery ye r2 se*in rs nd ll the cti?ities #% $di# nd ?ide# rec#rdin1. @e h ?e re ched +#int n#< n#t #nly t# t =e st#c= #% <h t <e re d#in12 b$t ls# t# * =e 'r#c=<##d *$ch *#re th n sch##l. It is the #nly centre in E$r#+e re+resentin1 the Te chin1s2 <hich re essenti lly reli1i#$s. Th#$1h <e h ?e *et in S nen %#r the l st t<entyEt<# ye rs %#r *#nth #r *#re2 'r#c=<##d is the +l ce <here K s+ends *$ch *#re ti*e nd ener1y. The sch##l h s ?ery 1##d re+$t ti#n nd Mrs. D#r#thy Si**#ns h s +$t her 1re t ener1y2 her + ssi#n2 behind it. @e h ?e ll hel+ed t# brin1 the sch##l b#$t in s+ite #% 1re t di%%ic$lties2 b#th %in nci l nd +sych#l#1ic l. N#< 'r#c=<##d *$st be *$ch *#re th n sch##l. It *$st be centre %#r th#se <h# re dee+ly interested in the Te chin1s2 +l ce <here they c n st y nd st$dy. In the ?ery #ld d ys n shr * E <hich *e ns retre t E < s +l ce <here +e#+le c *e t# 1 ther their ener1ies2 t# d<ell nd t# e4+l#re dee+er reli1i#$s s+ects #% li%e. M#dern +l ces #% this =ind 1ener lly h ?e s#*e s#rt #% le der2 1$r$2 bb#t #r + tri rch <h# 1$ides2 inter+rets nd d#*in tes. 'r#c=<##d *$st h ?e n# s$ch le der #r 1$r$2 %#r the Te chin1s the*sel?es re the e4+ressi#n #% th t tr$th <hich seri#$s +e#+le *$st %ind %#r the*sel?es. 3ers#n l c$lt h s n# +l ce in this. @e *$st e*+h siGe this % ct. M#st $n%#rt$n tely #$r br ins re s# c#nditi#ned nd li*ited by c$lt$re2 tr diti#n nd ed$c ti#n th t #$r ener1ies re i*+ris#ned. @e % ll int# c#*%#rtin1 nd cc$st#*ed 1r##?es nd s# bec#*e +sych#l#1ic lly ine%%ecti?e. T# c#$nter this <e e4+end #$r ener1ies in * teri l c#ncerns nd sel%E centred cti?ities. 'r#c=<##d *$st n#t yield t# this <ellE<#rn tr diti#n. 'r#c=<##d is +l ce %#r le rnin12 %#r le rnin1 the rt #% D$esti#nin12 the rt #% e4+l#rin1. It is +l ce <hich *$st de* nd the < =enin1 #% th t intelli1ence <hich c#*es <ith c#*+ ssi#n nd l#?e. It *$st n#t bec#*e n e4cl$si?e c#**$nity. (ener lly2 c#**$nity i*+lies s#*ethin1 se+ r te2 sect ri n nd encl#sed %#r ide listic nd $t#+i n +$r+#ses. 'r#c=<##d *$st be +l ce #% inte1rity2 dee+ h#nesty nd the < =enin1 #% intelli1ence in the *idst #% c#n%$si#n2 c#n%lict nd destr$cti#n th t is t =in1 +l ce in the <#rld. And this in n# < y de+ends #n ny +ers#n #r 1r#$+ #% +e#+le2 b$t #n the < reness2 ttenti#n nd %%ecti#n #% the +e#+le <h# re there. All this de+ends #n the +e#+le <h# li?e t 'r#c=<##d nd #n the Tr$stees #% the Krishn *$rti "#$nd ti#n. It is their res+#nsibility t# brin1 this b#$t. S# e ch #ne *$st c#ntrib$te. This ++lies n#t #nly t# 'r#c=<##d b$t t# ll the #ther Krishn *$rti "#$nd ti#ns. It see*s t# *e th t #ne * y be l#sin1 si1ht #% ll this2 bec#*in1 en1r#ssed in ? ri#$s de* ndin1 cti?ities2 c $1ht $+ in + rtic$l r disci+lines2 s# th t #ne h s neither ti*e n#r leis$re t# be dee+ly c#ncerned <ith the Te chin1s. I% th t c#ncern d#es n#t e4ist2 the "#$nd ti#ns h ?e n# si1ni%ic nce t ll. One c n t l= endlessly b#$t <h t the Te chin1s re2 e4+l in2 inter+ret2 c#*+ re nd e? l$ te2 b$t ll this bec#*es ?ery s$+er%ici l nd re lly *e nin1less i% #ne is n#t ct$ lly li?in1 the*. It <ill c#ntin$e t# be the res+#nsibility #% the Tr$stees t# decide <h t %#r* 'r#c=<##d sh#$ld t =e in the %$t$re2 b$t l< ys 'r#c=<##d *$st be +l ce <here inte1rity c n %l#<er. 'r#c=<##d is be $ti%$l +l ce <ith #ld * 1ni%icent trees s$rr#$nded by %ields2 *e d#<s2 1r#?es nd the D$ietness #% the c#$ntryside. It *$st l< ys be =e+t th t < y2 %#r be $ty is inte1rity2 1##dness nd tr$th. J. Krishn *$rti 59

On ,asanta ,ihar
; s nt ;ih r sh#$ld dr < +e#+le <h# h ?e 1##d br in2 1##d intellect. They sh#$ld st$dy the Bte chin1sB th#r#$1hly2 s# = in it dee+ly s y#$ <#$ld d# i% y#$ <ere t# st$dy *edicine #r '$ddhis* #r ny #ther s$b7ect. St$dyin1 *e ns t# 1# dee+ly int# the s$btleties #% the <#rds $sed nd their c#ntents nd seein1 the tr$th in the* in rel ti#n t# d ily li%e. They sh#$ld be ble t# disc$ss <ith t#+ br ins2 s+eci lists in ny br nch #% =n#<led1e2 s sch#l rs d#. And these +e#+le <hile they re st$dyin12 sh#$ld h ?e s+irit #% c##+er ti#n. S+irit #% c##+er ti#n d#es n#t *e n <#r=in1 t#1ether %#r s#*e %$ncti#n2 b$t <hile I * %$ncti#nin12 I * di11in12 I * thin=in1 #?er s#*ethin1 nd I * y#$r %riend nd y#$ re ls# d#in1 s#*e <#r=. I r$sh t# y#$ nd disc$ss <ith y#$ <h t I h ?e disc#?ered. Y#$ * y d#$bt it2 D$esti#n it b$t I * sh rin1 <ith y#$ the disc#?ery. It is n#t *y disc#?ery0 it d#es n#t bel#n1 t# *e #r nyb#dy. 3erce+ti#n is ne?er +ers#n l. S$ch sh rin1 is c##+er ti#n. '$t it *$st n#t be c#n%essi#n. There re 1r#$+s in A*eric <h# c#n%ess t# e ch #ther2 li=e < shin1 y#$r #<n dirty linen in +$blic. And ls# i% I * li r2 it is the res+#nsibility #% y#$ nd ll the %riends. 'ec $se <e ll re interested in the Bte chin1sB nd in st$dyin1 it dee+ly2 nd in li?in1 it in #$r d ily li%e2 <e re res+#nsible t# e ch #ther %#r <h te?er <e re. This t#1etherness *#n1 %riends <h# re interested in the disc#?ery #% tr$th in their d ily li%e nd the sense #% res+#nsibility they h ?e t# e ch #ther is the s+irit #% c#E#+er ti#n. And <hen e?ery#ne2 <h# li?es in ; s nt ;ih r h s this s+irit #% c##+er ti#n2 it <ill brin1 b#$t2 <ill cre te n t*#s+here in <hich ne<c#*er <ill ls# %l#<er.

JDisc$ssi#n <ith K in the c r en r#$te t# Rishi ; lley Sch##l %r#* M dr s #n ,-.,,./82 C#$rtesy0 Dr. T.K. 3 rch$reK

58

Dis$ip#es and Stud( Centres

M ry )$tyens0 ... Krishn 7i2 t the ti*e I < s <ritin1 the sec#nd ?#l$*e #% y#$r bi#1r +hy2 I he rd y#$ s y th t the b##=s2 c ssettes nd ?ide#s <ere n#t en#$1h nd th t it < s *#re i*+#rt nt <h t y#$ c lled the +er%$*e #% the te chin1s sh#$ld be +reser?ed nd h nded d#<n by the +e#+le <h# h d been cl#se t# K nd th t < s <hy y#$ < nted s * ny "#$nd ti#n *e*bers s +#ssible t# be <ith y#$ t# ?isit #$r "#$nd ti#ns <hile y#$ <ere there etc. I ls# he rd y#$ s y t<ice th t i% ny #% the '$ddhist disci+les < s still li?e y#$ <#$ld < l= h$ndreds #% *iles t# t l= t# the* nd le rn <h t it < s li=e t# h ?e been cl#se t# hi*. @#$ld y#$ re lly r ther t l= t# the disci+les #% the '$ddh th n re d his #<n <#rds2 listen t# hi* #n c ssette #r see hi* s+e =in1 #n ?ide#2 s$++#sin12 #% c#$rse2 th t s$ch rec#rds <ere ? il bleA It see*s t# *e th t i%2 %ter y#$r de th2 +e#+le <h# h ?e n#t =n#<n y#$ 1# t# ny #% the K centres nd t l= t# th#se <h# h ?e been in cl#se c#nt ct <ith K2 theyBll recei?e c#n%$sin1 n$*ber #% di%%erin1 re+#rts2 rec#llecti#ns2 i*+ressi#ns nd e4+l n ti#ns #% the te chin1 <hich h ?e been %iltered thr#$1h their #<n *inds. D# y#$ still %eel th t these +ers#n l inter+ret ti#ns E ll n# d#$bt2 cl i*in1 t# be +reser?in1 the +er%$*e #% the te chin1s re *#re i*+#rt nt th n the b##=s2 c ssettes nd ?ide#sA This is * tter2 I thin=2 <hich sh#$ld be cle red $+2 bec $se2 s st ted in *y b##=2 K h s s id th t the b##=s2 etc. re n#t en#$1h. J. Krishn *$rti0 Yes. Y#$ see2 IB?e %eelin12 it is n#t %eelin1 #nly b$t % ct E th t disci+les dist#rt e?erythin12 #$t #% their de?#ti#n2 #$t #% their l c= #% intelli1ence2 l c= #% +erce+ti#n nd s# #n. The disci+les 1ener lly destr#y the te chin1s. '$t i% the '$ddh <ere li?e E nd I c#$ldnBt 1# t# hi*2 nd #ne #% his disci+les t# <h#* the '$ddh s id E FY#$ re it2F <ere there E then I <#$ld 1# t# hi* nd then I <#$ld s y2 l##=2 letBs t l= b#$t it. S$ch +ers#ns d#nBt e4ist n#<. The t<# disci+les #% <h#* the '$ddh s id h d re lly $nderst##d <h t he < s t l=in1 b#$t2 S ri+$tr nd M $d1 ly y n died be%#re he did. N#< th t there re c ssettes2 b##=s2 ?ide# t +es2 nd s# #n2 th tBs 1##d en#$1h %#r *e. I <#$ldnBt 1# t# ny disci+le. I <#$ldnBt 1# t# ny disci+le #r ny +ers#n <h# h s been2 s# c lled Fcl#seF t# hi*. M)0 This is ?ery interestin1. This is <h t I < nt t# =n#<. K0 The +e#+le <h# re ?ery cl#se t# hi* 1ener lly d# n#t $nderst nd <h t he is t l=in1 b#$t. They li=e hi* nd ll th t =ind #% st$%% b$t ct$ lly2 IB?e n#ticed th#se +e#+le <h# re ?ery ?ery ?ery cl#se2 + rt %r#* the +resent c#*+ ny2 h ?e ?ery little 1r s+ #% ll this. It bec#*es *#re #% +ers#n l <#rshi+2 +ers#n l sense #% bein1 cl#se t#1ether. '$t the ?ide#s2 the t +es nd the b##=s E I <#$ld be s tis%ied <ith th#se nd n#t 1# ne r disci+le t ll. M)0 (##d2 bec $se IB* ?ery interested in <h t y#$ s y bec $se I thin= it is ine?it ble th t2 %ter K dies there re 1#in1 t# be 1re t * ny inter+reters. K0 N#t #nly inter+reters b$t they re lre dy s yin12 F<e2 <h# $nderst nd hi* E he h s ++#inted $s nd <e re 1#in1 t# t =e ch r1e #% ll this.F M)0 Yes2 th t is <h t is s# <#rryin1. K0 I h ?e re+e ted this #?er nd #?er nd #?er 1 in th t K is n#t 1i?in1 his * ntle t# nyb#dy. M)0 (##d2 IB* 1l d t# he r y#$ s y th t. 5:

K0 ... t# ny 1$r$2 t# ny l#c l he d #r he d #% cert in dist nt c#**$nity nd s# #n. They < nt t# $se KB s n *e in #rder t# b##st the*sel?es $+. M)0 ... nd in #rder t# %ind +l t%#r* %#r the*sel?es. K0 "#r the*sel?es2 th tBs ri1ht. M)0 E?eryb#dy see*s t# be #$t %#r +l t%#r*. I h ?e h d d#Gens2 l*#st h$ndreds #% letters b#$t *y sec#nd ?#l$*e #% bi#1r +hy %r#* * ny +e#+le tellin1 *e <h t y#$ re lly *e n. K0 O% c#$rse. M) ... And they re l< ys $sin1 the <#rd F*$stF #r Fsh#$ldF. K sh#$ld 1# b c= t# this2 th t #r the #ther. K *$st d# this2 th t #r the #ther. As i% they =n#< *$ch better th n y#$ d# <h t y#$ re re lly s yin1. This is ?ery dist$rbin1. MI0 It is i**ensely i*+#rt nt Krishn 7i th t y#$ s y this n#t #nly t# M ry nd t# *e n#< b$t th t y#$ s y it +$blicly nd +#intedly nd +erh +s s #%ten s +#ssible. K0 I h ?e s id this +$blicly2 b$t y#$ see2 there re se?er l 1r#$+s in Indi nd in A*eric nd s# #n E nd here t##2 in En1l nd E they < nt t# e4+l#it !t# +$t it br$t lly nd cr$dely&2 they < nt t# $se KBs n *e. I d#nBt =n#< <hy they < nt t# d# this bec $se %ter ll2 K is n#t ?ery <ell =n#<n nd ll the rest #% it. They < nt t# enter int# the lre dy =n#<n. D# y#$ =n#< <h t I *e nA M)0 ... cli*b #n t# the b nd< 1#n. K0 ... #n the b nd< 1#n. Th tBs +#litic l thin1. I did n#t < nt t# $se it. M)0 N#2 y#$ didnBt $se it. I did. This is di%%erent Krishn 7i2 %r#* <h t y#$ s id e rlier nd <h t M ry re d. Y#$ h ?e ch n1ed %r#* th t +#int #% ?ie< in %#$r ye rs. K0 N#2 I c#$ld n#t h ?e s id it. And i% I s id it2 I *e nt th t I <#$ld 1# t# #ne #% the disci+les t# <h#* the '$ddh h d s id2 FY#$ h ?e $nderst##d.F M)0 @ell2 then I *issed th t +#int nd I d#nBt thin= y#$ ct$ lly s id it th#$1h it is <h t y#$ *e nt. And i% y#$ c#$ld +#int #$t s#*eb#dy2 <hich I d#nBt thin= y#$ c n2 nd s y2 FS# E nd E s# re lly $nderst##d *e ... F K0 I <#$ldnMt d# it. M)0 N#2 bec $se y#$ d#nBt %eel it. K0 I <#$ldnBt d# it2 I c#$ldnBt d# it. MI0 As % r s I =n#<2 y#$ h ?e ne?er +#inted #$t ny#ne +ers#n #r +ers#ns <ith th t c#nn#t ti#n. K0 N#. M)0 In % ct2 y#$ h ?e s id <hich I h ?e D$#ted ls# in the b##=2 th t n#b#dy re lly $nderst##d ... th t n#b#dy h s h d the ch n1e th t y#$ t l= b#$t. 55

K0 ... %$nd *ent lly. M)0 This tr ns%#r* ti#n2 this *$t ti#n. K0 Yes. M)0 As % r s y#$ =n#<2 there is n#b#dy. K0 There * y be. M)0 There * y be2 b$t s % r s y#$ =n#< there is n#b#dy. MI0 3e#+le %reD$ently s= b#$t this th#$1h in the D$esti#n nd ns<er sessi#ns. They s y E FTell $s2 there *$st be E is there s$ch +ers#n ... F nd Krishn 7i2 s % r s I =n#<2 h s l< ys s id th t there * y be. K0 Yes2 * y be. It is n#t *y b$siness t# s y. I <#$ld c#nsider it n ins$lt #r n i*+$dence #n *y + rt t# s y E FY#$ h ?e #r y#$ h ?enBt.F M)0 There * y be s#*e#ne <h# h s c#*e %#r t l= nd <h# 1#es < y ch n1ed. Cert inly2 there re l#t #% +e#+le2 <h#* I h ?e h d letters %r#*2 <h# s y th t h ?in1 re d #ne #% y#$r b##=s h s ch n1ed their li?es. K0 I =n#<. M)0 '$t th t d#esnBt *e n t# s y necess rily th t it h s ch n1ed the* c#*+letely. K0 O% c#$rse n#t. M)0 They le d di%%erent li%e s i% <ind#< blind h d 1#ne $+. K0 The #ther d y there < s * n here. He s id FIB?e 1#ne thr#$1h e4 ctly <h t y#$B?e 1#ne thr#$1h ... the +r#cess nd ll th tF. I s id t# hi* th t se?er l +e#+le ls# s y th t t# *e. He s id th t they c nBt be ri1ht. FY#$ nd I re the #nly +e#+leF2 he s id. MI0 D# y#$ re*e*ber the * n in Ne< Y#r= this <inter2 Krishn 7iA Y#$ <ere s$ddenly #n c#rner #n M dis#n A?en$e nd * n st#++ed nd l##=ed t Krishn 7i2 c *e $+ t# hi* nd s id2 FY#$ re Krishn *$rtiF. Krishn 7i s id FyesF nd the * n re+lied2 FY#$ ch n1ed *y li%e.F He sh##= his h nd nd < l=ed < y. @ell2 th t < s n# nice bec $se he didnBt < nt nythin1. It < s s# i*+ers#n l. It < s e4tre*ely s+#nt ne#$s. K0 He < s %r#* Ar1entin . M)0 I thin= there re n$*ber #% +e#+le in the <#rld <h#se li?es h ?e been ch n1ed b$t2 s y#$ s y2 itBs n#t y#$r b$siness t# =n#<. K0 O% c#$rse n#t. Th t <#$ld be silly. M)0 Y#$ re s yin1 n#< th t y#$ c#$ldnBt +#int t# #ne sin1le +ers#n <h# y#$ *i1ht c ll s Bcl#seB t# y#$ nd b#$t <h#* y#$ *i1ht s y2 F )isten t# this +ers#n %ter IB* de dF. 5.

K0 I c#$ldnBt nd I <#$ldnBt. It <#$ldnBt be ri1ht either. It 1#es 1 inst *y 1r in. M)0 There isnBt ny#ne ny< y. @hen y#$ h ?e this center2 +e#+le <ill c#*e there2 nd #ne c nn#t n t$r lly st#+ the* nd #ne d#es n#t < nt t# st#+ the* %r#* t l=in1 b#$t y#$. '$t this is D$ite di%%erent. I *e n y#$ c nn#t st#+ +e#+le %r#* t l=in1 b#$t y#$. '$t it see*s t# *e th t y#$ d#nBt < nt #ne +ers#n in ch r1e #% the centre !#r +erh +s y#$ d#& <h# <ill be e*+#<ered t# e4+l in y#$. H#< <#$ld y#$ %eel b#$t th tA K0 E?en th t I <#$ldnBt li=e. M)0 N#. K0 'ec $se2 s$++#se y#$Bre 1#in1 t# st rt s#*ethin1 here2 nd the b$ildin1 1#es $+. 3e#+le <ill c#*e2 listen t# t +es2 ?ide#s nd ll the rest #% it. They *i1ht < nt t# disc$ss *#n1 the*sel?es. K0 N#t #ne +ers#n le din1 the* #r s yin12 FHe *e nt this ... he did n#t *e n th tF. Th t <#$ld be int#ler ble. M)0 This is <h t I *e n. Y#$ re lly < nt t# s y this E Th t y#$ d#nBt < nt #ne +ers#n t# be in the centre2 t# be in ch r1e #% the centre <h# is 1#in1 t# tell the* <h t t# thin=. K0 O% c#$rse n#t. MI0 Krishn 7i2 <ith re1 rd t# this it <#$ld be 1##d *#*ent t# h ?e y#$ s y ... S$++#sin1 there re +e#+le in the centre nd they re t l=in1 nd they re t l=in1 cle rly *ist =enly2 they *is$nderst##d. N#<2 <h t is the cti#n2 the ri1ht thin1 t# d# %#r +ers#n <h# *i1ht be there E #ne #% $s E #r <h#e?er is in ch r1e #% the centre t# d# b#$t th t. @hen #ne cle rly sees th t s#*e#ne h s 1#t it $+side d#<n. @h t sh#$ld th t +ers#n d# <ith#$t bein1 n $th#rity #r n inter+reter. H#< sh#$ld he h ndle th tA K0 A%ter ll2 i% the * n <h# is res+#nsible %#r the centre is intelli1ent2 h#nest2 heBll s y2 F)##=2 y#$ he r. )etBs t l= b#$t it. I h ?enBt 1#t <h t he s id. I2 *#re #r less2 1r s+ed <h t he s id b$t IB* n#t c + ble #% disc$ssin1 these thin1s2 b$t letBs t l= it #?er.F M)0 Or c#$ld he s y2 R)etMs listen t# #ne #% his t +es 1 in.S K0 Yes. M)0 )et $s listen 1 in nd see nd i% y#$ d#nBt %ind #$t %r#* hi* the ns<er t# y#$r D$esti#n2 %ind #$t i% y#$ h ?e *isinter+reted it. Re d it 1 in. It *i1ht be e sier %#r y#$ t# re d th n t# listen ... #r it *i1ht be e sier %#r y#$ t# listen th n t# re d. K0 Yes. S y %#r inst nce2 i% I <ere str n1er i% I c *e t# +l ce li=e this2 %irst I <#$ldnBt $nderst nd t ll. I < nt t# %ind #$t <h t he is re lly s yin1. S# I listen t# it t<# #r three ti*es2 +$t < y %#r the ti*e bein12 %#r c#$+le #% d ys2 c#*e b c= t# it <hen IB* %resh nd li?e E n#t <ith drin= #r dr$1s nd s# #n E b$t ct$ lly *ent lly2 #$r br in cti?e2 listen t# th t 1 in. I <#$ld +l y <ith it s# th t I be1in t# c +t$re n#t #nly the n#nE?erb l *e nin1 b$t ls# the D$ lity2 the +er%$*e2 the sense #% ll th t. I <#$ld d# it +ers#n lly th t < y. I <#$ld li=e t# disc$ss <ith +e#+le. M)0 N#< i% s#*eb#dy c *e l#n1 in the < y y#$ s id E s#*e#ne interested in Krishn *$rtiH E nd 5C

they s id I * ?ery interested. I d#nBt re lly $nderst nd. C#$ld y#$ hel+ *eA @h t d# y#$ thin= <#$ld be 1##d thin1 %#r *e t# re d %irstA K0 A b##=. M)0 Then I thin= the +ers#n in ch r1e c#$ld then s y E FThis is the e siest b##=F. K0 Yes. Yes. M)0 They c#$ld hel+ in th t < y nd s y FI thin= this b##= 1i?es y#$ better2 sh#rtH nd ?ery2 ?ery e sy t# $nderst ndF. I% +e#+le e?er s= *e b#$t y#$2 I 1i?e the* "reed#* %r#* the Kn#<n bec $se t# *e itBs li=e Krishn *$rti +ri*er. ItBs 1#t the essence in it2 b$t ?ery2 ?ery si*+ly +$t %r#* y#$r #<n <#rds2 it < s the b##= th t t $1ht *e %irst ny $nderst ndin1 I h ?e 1#t. MI0 I did the s *e. M)0 There *i1ht be si*+le t +e. @here s2 <hen y#$ c#*e t# the2 I thin=2 *#re c#*+lic ted thin1s li=e y#$r t l=s <ith D ?id '#h* <hich re hi1hly intellect$ l E b$t * y ++e l 1 in t# +e#+le <h# < nt t# see it thr#$1h their intellects <here s2 there re #ther +e#+le <h# l#?e t# c#*e thr#$1h n t$re. K0 Yes2 yes. M)0 The C#**ent ries ls# re <#nder%$l b##=s bec $se they ll st rt <ith little bit #% n t$re E <hich s#*eh#< +$ts y#$ int# *##d2 <here the <h#le thin12 y#$ re rece+ti?e t# it ll. They h ?e <#nder%$l be $ty. K0 I <#nder <hy E i% it is the +r#+er *#*ent t# s= E <hy they c nBt E b$t the*sel?es2 h ?e b##=s nd t +es E %ind #$t ll this %#r the*sel?es. @hy d# they h ?e t# l##= t# s#*eb#dy2 s#*e b##=s2 s#*e thin1s t# < =en the* t# *#?e in di%%erent directi#n. M)0 D#nBt y#$ thin= itBs bec $se #% their c#nditi#nin1A I *e n2 <e re br#$1ht $+ t# belie?e in cert in ide ls2 th t her#is*2 l#y lty2 + tri#tis*2 re 1##d thin1s. And y#$ re br#$1ht $+ #n th t %r#* childh##d. C#*in1 cr#ss y#$2 e?erythin1 is b$lld#Ged. Y#$ s$ddenly re liGe th t + tri#tis* is terrible thin1 E le ds t# < r2 ide lis* le ds t# ?i#lence. All these re tre*end#$sly $+settin1 thin1s nd y#$ *i1ht ne?er c#*e cr#ss these in y#$r <h#le li%e E t# be t#ld th t (#d is dis#rder E t#t l dis#rder. All these thin1s y#$ s y re re?#l$ti#n ry. D#nBt y#$ thin= th tBs +erh +s <hy they d#nBt thin= it #$t %#r the*sel?esA K0 IB* n#t s$re2 M ry. IB* n#t D$ite s$re ... th t itBs *erely th t. M ybe th t <e re l Gy E inherently E ind#lent E cce+t thin1s s they re E <hy b#ther b#$t ll thisA @h t I < nt is %##d2 cl#thes2 little se4 nd little *$se*ent E nd %#r (#dBs s =e2 le ?e *e l#ne. MI0 I d#nBt thin= y#$n1 +e#+le re li=e th t n t$r lly. K0 N#. M)0 I thin= y#$n1 +e#+le2 l*#st %r#* the d <n #% sel%Ec#nsci#$sness2 re s=in1 ?ery dee+ D$esti#ns. @h t is (#dA I re*e*ber s=in1 *ysel%2 s e rly s I c n re*e*ber2 <hy is there <#rld t llA And I thin= <e * y 1et l Gy s <e 1et #lder2 b$t I d#nBt thin= children re l GyE 5/

*inded. I thin= they re l< ys < ntin1 t# =n#<. They re l< ys s=in12 nd their elders2 ?ery #%ten2 h ?enBt 1#t the + tience t# ns<er their D$esti#ns. They re s=in1 <h t this is E th t is. They re t## b$sy. And children h ?e 1#t these tre*end#$sly inD$irin1 *inds nd they re br$shed #%% by 1i?in1 si*+le2 D$ic= ns<ers. They e4+ect 1r#<nE$+s t# be ble t# ns<er these di%%ic$lt D$esti#ns. MI0 I thin= s#. '$t e?en th t2 %r#* in% ncy y#$ s= D$esti#ns nd y#$ re 1i?en re+lies2 y#$ re 1i?en 1$idelines. Y#$ re t#ld <h t the ns<er is #r <h t y#$ sh#$ld thin= nd this is b$ilt int# the childBs *ind nd the d$ltBs *ind thr#$1h#$t their li?es. M)0 ... bec $se they $s$ lly h ?e either l#?e %#r the d$lt <h# l##=s %ter the* #r h ?e res+ect nd there%#re2 i% they l#?e their % ther nd their % ther 1i?es the* n ns<er2 they cce+t it bec $se it c#*es %r#* hi*. MI0 And ls# they de+end #n the =n#<led1e #% the #lder cre t$re2 the #lder h$* n2 the + rent. M)0 In #ne < y the N nny <h# br#$1ht $s $+ nd i% <e s=ed2 F@hy *$st <e d# thisAF she $sed t# s y Fbec $se N nny s ys s#.F K0 !l $1hs& M)0 She h d 1re t $th#rity2 ne?er2 ne?er <ent b c= #n her <#rd. I% she thre tened y#$2 <ith s#*ethin12 y#$ =ne< she <#$ld c rry it #$t. '$t she < s s# s<eet nd s# =ind. She =ne< the di%%erence bet<een n $1htiness nd *ischie?#$sness. K0 This *#rnin12 #n the tele?isi#n s#*e +riest < s blessin1 <ell. H#ly % ther nd ll th t. I listened t# it r ther c re%$llyH n#t nt 1#nistic lly #r nythin1. '$t I s id re lly E <h t d#es it *e nA Y#$ %#ll#<A " ther nd the H#ly (h#st nd ll th t. 3e#+le re br#$1ht $+ #n ll this. Acce+tin1 it. I thin= th t is re lly it. Obey. "#ll#<. M)0 They %#ll#< tr diti#ns. The c#nditi#nin1 #% their + rents #r their sch##l E * ster #r *istress i% y#$ li=e #% sch##l *i1ht h ?e *#re in%l$ence th n y#$r + rents. Or y#$ c n c#+y n elder 1irl. I *e n2 I h d r ther cr$sh #n n elder 1irl. She $sed t# t$rn her %eet #$t li=e d$c=. She < l=ed li=e this. I th#$1ht it < s * r?ell#$s nd I < l=ed li=e th t nd t<# ye rs .. %ter< rd2 I h d t# <e r s$r1ic l b##ts t# c#rrect. Y#$ c n 1et 1##d in%l$ences ! ls#&2 it d#es de+end #n the + rents nd the te chers s y#$ h ?e l< ys s id. H#< t# 1et the 1##d te chers nd the 1##d + rentsA K0 I <#$ld li=e t# s= D$esti#n. @hy d# +e#+le n#t %eel res+#nsibleA N#t res+#nsible #nly t# their % *ilies. IB* n#t t l=in1 b#$t th t. There is n# %eelin1 th t e ch #ne is c#ncerned <ith the <h#le * ss *#?e*ent #% h$* nity nd %eels res+#nsible t# see th t s#*ethin1 ... nd n#t 1# int# the s *e #ld + ttern. IB?e been < tchin1 it here2 t 'r#c=<##d. Th tBs <hy IB* s=in1 this D$esti#n. MI0 ItBs ?ery interestin1 D$esti#n. M)0 It c n be ?ery cr$shin1 thin12 <hich y#$ +$t #n +e#+le <hen y#$ s y th t2 BY#$ re the @#rldB2 By#$ re n#t di%%erent2 By#$ re h$* nityB2 B<h t y#$ re2 the <#rld isB. S$ddenly2 #ne is res+#nsible #r t# bl *e2 in #neBs D$ic= re cti#n2 %#r ll the *#nstr#$s thin1s th t re h ++enin1 in the <#rld nd this is +retty sc ry +r#s+ect t# s$ddenly %eel th t it is y#$r % $lt th t +e#+le re bein1 sl $1htered nd t#rt$red nd t#r*ented r#$nd the <#rld .. MI0 @ell2 it is in < y. It is sensible2 <h t he s ys. @hy is the <#rld li=e th tA The <#rld is li=e 5-

th t bec $se <e re li=e th t in #$rsel?es nd in #rder t# bec#*e res+#nsible %#r the <#rld2 I i* 1ined2 I d#nBt =n#< <hether he *e ns th t the %irst ste+ is t# bec#*e res+#nsible %#r #$rsel?es. And i% <e c n 1et in< rdly the sense2 itBs #$r bi11est c#ntrib$ti#n. M)0 T# the de1ree th t <e re n#t di%%erent %r#* th t2 <e re res+#nsible2 <e re t# bl *e. MI0 3erh +s2 is th t <h t y#$ *e n2 little bitA K0 @e %eel ?ery 1$ilty. MI0 @e re 1$ilty s#ciety. K0 ($ilty2 bec $se <e c nBt % ce ll this nd there%#re <e %eel 1$ilty. M)0 '$t <e re e?en 1$ilty in #$r #<n c#$ntry2 in #$r #<n c#**$nityH <e re 1$ilty. K0 O% c#$rse2 #% c#$rse. M)0 @e re 1$ilty bec $se <e =n#< th t there re +##r in #$r c#$ntry nd <e re li?in1 ?ery hi1h st nd rd #% li?in1. @e =n#< th t there re +e#+le li?in1 $+ in (l s1#< <h# re l*#st s b dly #%% s in the third <#rld nd <e sh$t #$r eyes. In the s *e < y #ne c#*es cr#ss +ict$re in * 1 Gine #r n d?ertise*ent %#r ch rity. A +ict$re #% st r?in1 child. And they s y E BD# n#t t$rn this + 1e #?er.B And y#$ l##= t the + 1e bec $se they s y th t. And y#$ =n#< they re ri1ht2 th t y#$r instinct is t# t$rn the + 1e #?er nd %#r1et b#$t it. @e re 1$ilty. MI0 @e re 1$ilty nd 1$ilt is I thin= #ne #% the *#st di%%ic$lt thin1s t# $nt n1le2 +sych#l#1ic lly. Cert inly2 in the <estern <#rld nd I c nBt 7$d1e %#r the e stern <#rld bec $se si*+ly re cti#ns t# 1$ilt #r c#nce+ts #% 1$ilt re ?ery di%%erent. M)0 '$t the less y#$ h ?e y#$rsel%2 the less 1$ilty y#$ re. I re*e*ber the d ys <hen I < s terribly +##r2 <ell2 <h t I c#nsidered re lly +##r E <hen I did n#t h ?e en#$1h %#r b$sE% re. I %elt % r less 1$ilty th n I d# n#<. MI0 I %elt 1$ilty s child bec $se I h d en#$1h t# e t nd bec $se I h d nice2 cle n bed2 r##% nd ll th#se b sic thin1s t#r*ented *e <ith 1$ilt s child. It t##= *e ye rs t# $nderst nd th t2 nd be %ree #% it. K0 @h t ti*e is itA 'ec $se IB?e 1#t t# t l=. M)0 .. .Is there nythin1 else #n this s$b7ect th t y#$ <#$ld li=e t# s yA K0 N#. I% I * y s$11est2 n#ther ti*e2 y#$ s= se?er l D$esti#ns. Y#$ =n#< <h t I *e nA (et re lly 1##d D$esti#ns. M)0 '$t I th#$1ht it < s r ther i*+#rt nt th t <e cle r $+ this D$esti#n. K0 This is i*+#rt nt. Th t <e h ?e d#ne. '$t ne4t ti*e2 I re lly <#$ld li=e y#$2 b#th #% y#$2 t# +$t D$esti#ns E +ic=in1 dee+. Y#$ =n#< <h t I *e nA
JJ. Krishn *$rti in di l#1$e <ith M ry )$tyens nd M ry Ii*b list2 'r#c=<##d 3 r=2 ,/th J$ne ,-/:. Tr nscribed %r#* t +e by S dh n Sh$=l 2 The ; lley Sch##l2 ' n1 l#re2 ,-th Oct#ber2 ,--.K

.6

Dia#ogue on the Stud(

Krishn *$rti0 @hy did y#$ red$ce it %r#* t<enty #ne t# nineteenA Sc#tt "#rbes0 I red$ced it bec $se it <#$ld %it in better2 bec $se it s ?ed s#*e *#ney. Krishn *$rti0 N#< 7$st *in$te0 in th t b$ildin1 y#$ re 1#in1 t# h ?e the rchi?es. Sc#tt "#rbes0 @ell2 t the *#*ent <e re n#t h ?in1 the rchi?es. Krishn *$rti0 @hyA Sc#tt "#rbes0 @ell2 1 in bec $se #% *#ney. Re*e*ber <e h ?e cert in sh +e. Krishn *$rti0 J$st *in$te2 sir. The rchi?es h ?e t# be there. Sc#tt "#rbes0 I thin= s# t##2 yes. Krishn *$rti0 T +es2 ?ide#s2 ll there. Sc#tt "#rbes. Yes2 yes. Krishn *$rti0 And ls# Mrs C d#1 n is 1#in1 t# retire s#*e ti*e2 I d#nBt =n#< <hen. The #%%ice h s t# be there. Sc#tt "#rbes0 Yes. I 1ree. N#< the *#di%ic ti#ns th t I * de in the dr <in1s2 Krishn 7i2 <ill ll#< $s t ny %$t$re ti*e t# dd #n <in1. Krishn *$rti0 Y#$ $nderst nd ddin1 #n is l< ys *$ch *#re e4+ensi?e. Sc#tt "#rbes0 Yes2 Krishn 7i2 b$t <e 7$st d#nBt h ?e it t the *#*ent. M ry Ii*b list0 @e c#$ld s= %#r +l nnin1 +er*issi#n <hen <e reD$est the +er*issi#n %#r this b$ildin12 bec $se they < nt t# =n#< <h t #$r %$t$re +l ns re. It is ?ery 1##d *#*ent s# s y2 this is <h t <e re lly <ill need b$t <e d#nBt h ?e the *#ney2 nd <e d#nBt h ?e t# $se it D$ite yet2 b$t <e re +l nnin1 t# d# this. S# they <ill 1i?e +er*issi#n2 nd then t s#*e %$t$re *#*ent #ne h#+es <e c n dd ll this. Sc#tt "#rbes0 I *i1ht n#t s= %#r th t +er*issi#n t the *#*ent bec $se i% y#$ s= %#r it n#<2 n#< <e h ?e t# t l= the* int# it nd s# <h t <e < nt t# d# is sh#< th t <h t <e re 1#in1 t# d# there is n e4tensi#n #% the sch##l nd is necess ry %#r the sch##l2 <hich <e c n d#. I% <e re 1#in1 t# dd #%%ices t# it I thin= th t th t is *#re di%%ic$lt. Once the b$ildin1 is b$ilt <e c n dd #n nd dd #n2 th tBs e sy bec $se y#$ c n dd #n t# ny e4istin1 b$ildin12 nd the +er*issi#n %#r th t is ?ery e sy t# 1et. '$t <e re st rtin1 %resh b$ildin1 in n re th t is c#*+letely %#r +l ns. Ri1htA !)#n1 bl n= #n the t +e& MI0 @ell letBs t l= b#$t <h t y#$ <ill e?ent$ lly < nt there2 Krishn 7i. Y#$ s id y#$ < nted e?ent$ lly +l ce %#r the rchi?es <hich is t# *e tre*end#$sly necess ry. I h ?e t l=ed t# e ch #ne #% y#$ b#$t this2 b$t h ?in1 the* in the b se*ent t 'r#c=<##d is *#st insec$re.

.,

S"0 Is b d ide . K0 Underst##d. M#?e. Y#$ re re+e tin1. MI0 Th t c n be D$ite e4+ensi?e bec $se y#$ < nt t# ins$l te it2 %ire +r##% it2 etc. K0 S# there <ill be rchi?es2 y#$r +l ce. S"0 I c n sh#< y#$ #n bit #% + +er E c#$ld I sh#< y#$ D$ic=ly #n bit #% + +er <h t <e *i1ht thin= #% d#in1A There is #ne <in12 then there is the st#rer##*2 there is the =itchen2 it 1#es li=e this2 then li=e this2 then there is the D$ dr n1le. K0 I =n#< it l*#st by he rt n#<. S"0 And bedr##*s. S# these re bedr##*s2 nd there re bedr##*s b#?e2 nd this 1#es #%% here2 bec $se there is *#re. At the *#*ent this c#rrid#r <hich 1#es t# the end #% the bedr##*s2 nd the c#rrid#r ls# 1#es here. N#< <h t <e c n d# E this is st#rer##* s# <e c n dd #n s+ ce this < y %#r $di# t +e <#r=in12 %#r the %#$nd ti#n #%%ices2 %#r sendin1 #$t b##=s2 etc.2 etc.2 nd this c#rrid#r 7$st =ee+s 1#in1 li=e this. At the end #% the c#rrid#r2 le ?in1 1##d s+ ce in bet<een th t nd nythin1 else2 s# it is ll by itsel%2 <e c n h ?e the rchi?es. K0 All th t I * s yin12 sir2 is <e h ?e t# h ?e2 t# =ee+ in *ind th t <e h ?e t# b$ild n#t #nly rchi?es2 ll y#$r c#ncerns2 t +e2 ?ide#2 <h te?er y#$ d#2 nd ls# <here the t +es re 1#in1 t# be =e+t. MI0 IsnBt th t lre dy in the +resent b$ildin1A S"0 @ell the ?ide#s c n be =e+t in s#*e +l ce2 b$t they sh#$ld ll be t#1ether in n ir c#nditi#ned2 +r#+er E nd th t sh#$ld 1# in the rchi?es. MI0 Act$ l <#r= #n the ?ide#sA S"0 Th t ll t =es +l ce there. MI0 It isnBt en?is 1ed in the +resent h#$seA S"0 Yes2 it is. All the ?ide# <#r= nd ll th t <ill t =e +l ce in this b$ildin1 be%#re the e4tensi#n. MI0 S# th t isnBt n e4tr . S"0 N#2 n#. '$t t# d# the e4tr 2 t# h ?e the rchi?es2 nd t# h ?e the $di# <#r=2 nd t# +$t ll th t d#<n there2 th t <ill t =e *#re *#ney th n <e n#< h ?e. K0 H#< *$ch *#reA MI0 @ell letBs disc$ss <h t it is be%#re <e try nd +rice it. @e sh#$ld s= M ry C d#1 n2 b$t <h t <#$ld K" #%%ice t 'r#c=<##d c#nsist #%. Ob?i#$sly r##* <ith secret ry2 <h t elseA S"0 There <ill h ?e t# be three r##*s2 n#t l r1e2 b$t three r##*s %#r the +resent rchi?es <#r= th t 1#es #n t 'r#c=<##d2 <hich re the $di# t +es2 * =in1 the d$+lic ti#ns2 nd th t <#r=2 sendin1 .9

#$t ll the b##=s2 nd d#in1 the #%%ice2 the s* ll *#$nt #% #%%ice <#r= th t R y d#es. MI0 I =n#< %r#* O7 i th t st#r 1e #% the b##=s th t re bein1 s#ld t =es D$ite bit #% r##*. @e re l< ys st$c= <ith it2 it is in the b se*ent #% the c#tt 1e2 etc. S# y#$ need s+ ce t# st#re <h t is 1#in1 t# be * iled #$t. S"0 @e c n h ?e D$ite bit #% st#r 1e s+ ce2 th tBs e sy bec $se there is n ttic b#?e ll #% th t. S# ll #% th t c n be desi1n ted st#r 1e s+ ce. MI0 @ell <#$ld there be r##* %#r the secret ry #% the "#$nd ti#nA S"0 I c n tell y#$ ++r#4i* tely h#< *$ch it <#$ld c#st. I% y#$ thin= #% D#r#thyBs #%%ice2 th t siGe2 th t c#sts T/2666. S# e ch #ne #% th#se y#$ 7$st thin= #% T/2666 +er r##*. MI0 H#< * ny r##*s d# <e need2 I h ?enBt est blished th t. S"0 @ell2 i% y#$ h ?e three %#r the $di# <#r= nd b##=s. One t# h ?e ct$ lly the t +e rec#rders nd t# d# ll th t <#r=. One t# h ?e ll the b##=s2 %#r <r ++in1 the* $+ nd ll the b##=s2 shel?in1 nd ll th t. And then #ne %#r s* ll #%%ice %#r s y2 R y <h# is d#in1 ll th t <#r=2 t# <#r= in. Three #% th#se. I% y#$ thin= %#r the "#$nd ti#n #%%ice2 M ry h s t<# #% th#se. MI0 @hy d#es she need t<#A S"0 She h s secret ries nd <h#e?er is 1#in1 t# r$n the #%%ice. K0 "i?e lt#1ether. S"0 @h t <e re c#$ntin1 is %i?e. MI0 '$t <h t <ill the #%%ice be <hen ... retiresA I <#$ld thin= #ne e%%icient secret ry. S"0 N#2 it reD$ires *#re th n th t. S#*e#ne is 1#in1 t# h ?e t# be the secret ry #% the "#$nd ti#n2 nd the secret ry #% the "#$nd ti#n <ith ll the +$blic ti#ns <#r=2 nd ll the di%%erent %#rei1n c#**ittees. There is n <%$l l#t #% <#r= 7$st s#rtin1 #$t ll th t. MI0 S y three r##*s %#r $di# nd t<# r##*s %#r the "#$nd ti#n. S"0 Ri1ht. Th tBs %i?e2 s# th t is T:626662 nd then the rchi?es2 the ct$ l rchi?es s %e2 <hich sh#$ld be t le st t<# #% th#se r##*s2 b$t y#$ <#$ld +r#b bly h ?e t# c#$nt #n h ?in1 t<ice the e4+ense bec $se it h s t# be ll %ire +r##%ed nd s# #n2 s# i% y#$ s y ei1ht #% th#se r##*s lt#1ether. S# th tBs T.:26662 s y TC62666. K0 And y#$ h ?e red$ced it t# nineteenA S"0 Nineteen2 yes. MI0 '$t y#$ ls# h ?e t# c#nsider2 <ill y#$ need *#re li?in1 s+ ce2 <ill y#$ h ?e t# h#$se the secret riesA K0 Yes2 sir. Or they c n li?e #$tside in c#tt 1es. .8 r##*

S"0 At the *#*ent they re 7$st hired2 y#$ =n#<2 #$tsiders. MI0 @#$ld it be +erh +s better +l nnin1 t# thin= #% h#$sin1 th#se +e#+le. @e re 1#in1 t# h ?e t# h#$se st %% better th n they re. M ybe s#*e d y <e <ill be ble t# 1et s#*e #% the #ther c#tt 1es2 nd +$t s y secret ry %#r the "#$nd ti#n #$tside #% this b$ildin1 E I d#nBt =n#<. @e sh#$ld t le st tent ti?ely thin= #% this. S"0 I thin= #ne #% the thin1s <e < nt t# e?ent$ lly thin= #% is b$ildin1 +r#+er h#$sin1 %#r the st %%. K0 J$st *in$te2 sir2 7$st *in$te. MI0 Y#$ see <e s+#=e #% this ne< #?er<hel*in1 d#n ti#n. @e h ?enBt #b?i#$sly decided <h t t# d# <ith th t b$t "riedrich nd Krishn 7i h ?e t l=ed b#$t it2 nd M ry2 b#$t i*+r#?in1 st %% cc#**#d ti#n. K0 IBd li=e t# s y s#*ethin1. This <ill be =e+t +ri? te2 <#nBt itA S"0 Yes. !'l n= #n t +e& K0 It sh#$ld be * de2 the <h#le #% it2 s s cred +l ce2 n#t 7$st rchi?es2 this2 th t nd the #ther2 tre*end#$s cti?ity 1#in1 #n. In s+ite #% the cti?ity2 in s+ite #% +e#+le c#*in1 nd 1#in12 there sh#$ld be +l ce there2 s I %eel2 <h t they $sed t# c ll in the #ld d ys2 *edit ti#n r##*. Y#$ $nderst nd2 <here y#$ <ent t# be D$iet. Ri1htA Sch##l +l$s this. Y#$ re %#ll#<in1A T# be D$iet2 sel% rec#llected2 < tchin12 li?in1 D$ietly by y#$rsel%2 t# 1# t# th t r##*. Ri1htA S# th t th t r##* is #nly $sed %#r th t2 nd n#t %#r nythin1 else E n#t d nce r##*2 nd ll the rest #% it. It * y be ?ery s* ll2 b#$t this siGe2 s* ll r##*2 b$t #nly %#r th t. Either y#$ h ?e it in here2 th t is the #nly +#ssibility2 here2 n#t t 'r#c=<##d bec $se it is t## n#isy. S"0 The children2 yes. N#< <h t b#$t this ... K0 )et *e %inish2 let *e %inish. 'e r in *ind <h t I * s yin12 I d#nBt =n#< i% y#$ <ill re*e*ber it2 ri1ht. Th t sh#$ld be li=e %#$nt in th t is %illin1 the <h#le +l ce. Y#$ $nderst nd <h t I * s yin1. Th t sh#$ld be the centr l %l *e2 th t r##*2 %r#* <hich the <h#le thin1 is c#?ered. I <#nder i% y#$ $nderst nd <h t I * s yin1 A Ri1htA Y#$ $nderst nd <h t I * s yin1A S"0 I thin= s#2 Krishn 7i. K0 N#2 d#nBt s y y#$ thin= s#. 'e de%inite. Y#$ see2 sir2 I * 7$st re+e tin1 this. There < s in the he dD$ rters #% the TS2 *y r##* < s $+ there2 Dr 'es ntBs r##* < s $+ there2 nd <h t they c lled the shrine r##* < s here. There2 #nly they <h# <ere re lly de?#ti#n l2 dedic ted2 c#ncerned <ent there. Y#$ $nderst nd <h t I * s yin1A Th t r di ted2 ?ibr ted the <h#le c#*+#$nd. Th t < s the centre. Y#$ $nderst nd <h t I * t l=in1 b#$tA Y#$ h ?e t# h ?e s#*ethin1 li=e th t2 #ther<ise it is 7$st2 y#$ =n#<. Th tBs #ne thin1 I <#$ld s$11est. S# itBs silent2 d#$ble d##r2 <h te?er it is2 bs#l$tely silent2 nd .:

li1ht2 ir2 b$t it is D$iet2 silent. I <#$ldnBt 1# nd sit there %#r t<# *in$tes2 ten *in$tes2 h l% n h#$r nd 1# < y. There y#$ d#nBt st$dy2 y#$ d#nBt %$ss2 disc$ss2 ?ide#2 n#thin12 #% ll th t. Unless y#$ h ?e s#*ethin1 li=e th t it is li=e E y#$ $nderst nd2 sir. It is li=e %$rn ce th t he ts the <h#le +l ce. I% y#$ d#nBt h ?e th t it bec#*es 7$st + ss 1e. 3e#+le c#*in1 nd 1#in12 <#r= nd cti?ity nd ll th t. I <#$ld str#n1ly $r1e th t <e d# th t. I th#$1ht #% it 7$st n#<. Y#$ see th t < s <h t <e < nted in e?ery sch##l. IBll <#r= t it <hen I 1# b c=2 IBll 1# t it. It is 1##d ide . MI0 M y I s=2 Krishn 7i2 is there ny s+eci l D$ lity nd <here the r##* sh#$ld be in rel ti#n t# the rest A K0 It sh#$ld be in the centre. D# y#$ $nderst nd <h t I * s yin1A S"0 I d#2 Krishn 7i. K0 "r#* <hich y#$ r di te <h te?er ... S"0 Krishn 7i2 y#$ s y th t #nly cert in +e#+le c *e t# this +l ce in the TS. K0 C$t #$t ll th t. There < s ch ntin12 * r?ell#$s ch ntin1 <hich I $sed t# d# E I still d#. M r?ell#$s ch ntin1. And %ter ch ntin1 y#$ sit D$iet. I $sed t# 1# t# slee+ s r$le2 <ith *y br#ther2 b$t th t < s the centre %r#* <hich e?erythin1 r di ted. Y#$ $nderst ndA '$t l ter #n <hen Dr 'es nt t##= t# +#litics2 it ll <ent t# +ieces E th tBs n#t *y %% ir2 I * 7$st tellin1 y#$. I sh#$ld * =e th t s the centre #% e?erythin1. MI0 @ell th t <e *$st c#nsider i**edi tely then. K0 J$st *in$te2 7$st *in$te. Th tBs <h t I <#$ld c#nsider s the *#st i*+#rt nt thin1 E n# b##=s2 n# E y#$ *i1ht h ?e li1ht2 di* li1ht2 nd s# #n2 b$t n#thin1 t# be d#ne there2 e4ce+t th t. MI0 Krishn 7i d#es it h ?e t# be s#$nd +r##%A K0 I% y#$ $se d#$ble d##rs it <ill * =e it D$iet. S"0 Krishn 7i2 <h t <#$ld y#$ thin= #% it bein1 b#?e the )ibr ryA K0 I d#nBt =n#< nythin1 b#$t it. Y#$ 1# nd %ind #$t. I d#nBt =n#< <here t# +$t it. S"0 It is centr l2 nd it is b#?e the +l ce <here +e#+le st$dy. It <ill be D$iet2 it <ill be centr l2 nd it <ill be set + rt %r#* #ther thin1s bit. K0 Y#$ $nderst nd2 sir2 there *i1ht be t<enty +e#+le there t ti*eA S"0 Yes. @e <ill * =e it th t siGe. K0 Or %i%ty2 y#$ $nderst nd. S"0 "i%ty <ill be di%%ic$lt. .5

K0 D#nBt li*it it. Th t is <h t I #b7ect t#. Kee+ it in *ind. I d#nBt =n#<2 sir. Sir in the #ld d ys2 nd still in n Indi n te*+le there < s s nct$* s nct#r$*. And there is l#n1 + ss 1e here2 +e#+le entered %r#* here nd s < the s nct$*2 b$t they c#$ldnBt 1# direct. They h d t# < l= se?en ti*es r#$nd it2 e ch ti*e they c *e here they +r#str ted2 <ent d#<n2 se?en ti*es. (##d e4erciseL And y#$ l##=ed t th t2 then y#$ <ent ne r it2 ch ntin12 ll =inds #% thin1s <ent #n. Y#$ c nBt h ?e ll th t2 th t s#$nds t## silly. ItBs ll ri1ht in Indi 2 it < s ri1ht t th t ti*e2 ri1ht %#r the* t# d# ll th t. '$t %#r $s this sh#$ld be the *#st i*+#rt nt +l ce in the <h#le sch##l. Ri1htA And th t 1i?es it %eelin1 #% s#*ethin1 there2 y#$ %#ll#<A I% I li?ed in 'r#c=<##d I <#$ld 1# there D$ietly2 sit D$ietly E I *e n t<# *in$tes2 ten *in$tes. Tr#1#c#2 itBs +l ce s#$th #% )#s An1eles2 b#$t si4ty *iles2 s#*e dist nce %r#* )#s An1eles2 (er ld He r2 Ald#$s H$4ley nd "eli4 (reene b$ilt the +l ce. It < s =ind #%2 n#t *#n stic li%e2 b$t it < s =ind #% *#n stery. MI0 "eli4 (reene < s in th t. K0 Yes2 I *enti#ned th t. And they h d r##* +er%ectly d r=2 <ith bl c= c$rt ins ll r#$nd2 nd n ren 2 ste+s 1#in1 d#<n nd +e#+le s t ll r#$nd. M y be. Thin= it #$t sir. Th t * y be t## rti%ici l2 I h ted th t =ind #% sittin1 there2 it is t## rti%ici l. I <#$ldBnt cert inly h ?e th t. MI0 @#$ld y#$ +re%er it #n the 1r#$nd %l##r. 'ec $se <e *$st decide <here it is 1#in1 t# 1# in the +resent +l n. K0 @here <#$ld it be 1##dA S"0 I <#$ld +$t it b#?e the st$dy2 b#?e the libr ry2 t the *#*ent. K0 N#t t the *#*entL S"0 N#2 I *e n I * 7$st thin=in1 n#<. It <#$ld be b#?e the libr ry + rt. MI0 H#< <#$ld y#$ 1et t# itA S"0 Y#$ h ?e t# c#*e $+ the st irs thr#$1h this centr l c#nser? t#ry2 nd y#$ c#$ld 1# ri1ht t# it bec $se it <#$ld be ri1ht in the centre. D# y#$ %eel it sh#$ld be #n the 1r#$nd %l##r2 Krishn 7iA K0 3l y <ith it2 sir2 +l y <ith it. MI0 @h t is t the *#*ent this side #% the +l nA S"0 This side2 it is ll #+en2 bec $se this is the c#nser? t#ryOdisc$ssi#n re . K0 J$st *in$te2 sir. )et *e s y s#*ethin1. Y#$ h ?e t# 1# t# it. Y#$ $nderst ndA S"0 Yes. K0 Y#$ h ?e t# t =e ti*e t# 1et t# it2 n#t 7$st s y2 #h2 itBs $+st irs2 I * 1#in1 $+. Y#$ $nderst ndA Y#$ *$st h ?e %eelin1 th t y#$ re 1#in1 t# s#*ethin1 s cred2 nd there%#re y#$ *$st t =e ti*e t# 1et t# it. Y#$ =n#< ll th#se Me4ic n te*+les #n t#+ #% ste+s E y#$ c#$ldnBt 7$st < l= $+. It is the ..

s *e thin1 in Indi n te*+les2 y#$ h ?e t# b the be%#re y#$ 1# there2 y#$ h ?e t# < sh y#$r %eet2 < sh y#$r h nds2 < sh y#$r % ce in the te*+leBs t n=2 reser?#ir2 nd then h l% n =ed. Y#$ c nBt 7$st s y2 <ell I * 1#in1 $+st irs. J$st thin= #% it2 l##= t it2 1et the %eelin1 #% it %irst. @e re st rtin1 s#*ethin1 t#t lly ne<. Ri1htA S# letBs thin= #% the ri1ht < y t# d# this. ItBs 1##d t# s y2 I * 1#in1 there. Y#$ %#ll#<A Y#$ re 1ettin1 re dy. I d#nBt =n#< i% y#$ $nderst nd. S"0 It is deliber te cti#n #% s#*e =ind. K0 I *e n2 #% c#$rse. "riedrich (r#he0 )i=e ch +elA K0 N#2 n#. MI0 Y#$ <ere t l=in1 b#$t h ?in1 t# 1# t# it. K0 Y#$ c nBt 1# %r#* the #$tside nd c#*e in. 'ec $se y#$ <#$ld 7$st < l= in. Y#$ *$st c#*e nd then 1#. Y#$ $nderst ndA MI0 Then it isnBt se+ r te ch +el #$tside. K0 It * y be #$tside b$t I h ?e t# 1# t# it. S"0 Y#$ h ?e t# 1# inside ny< y t# 1# t# it. K0 N#t 7$st ste+ %r#* #$tside2 1et in. Y#$ see in the c thedr ls in the #rdin ry Christi n <#rld they < l= ri1ht int# it2 <hich t# *e E they re s*#=in12 7$st thr#< #$t their ci1 rette nd < l= in. S"0 Krishn 7i2 <h t <#$ld y#$ thin= i% it <ere E this is n#< t<# %l##rs2 t<# st#reys2 <h t i% this < s se+ r te third st#rey ll by itsel%A K0 Cli*b $+A N#2 sir. Cli*bin1 $+ y#$ 1et e4h $sted. Cli*bin1 $+. Y#$ %#ll#<A It * y be ll ri1ht2 li=e the #ld Me4ic n AGtecs nd ll th#se +e#+le2 l< ys h dQ the ste+s 1#in1 $+H e?en in E1y+t. !( + in t +e& MI0 The Krishn *$rti St$dy2 'r#c=<##d 3 r=H nd then <e c n h ?e the Krishn *$rti St$dy2 O7 i. K0 I d#nBt li=e th t. 'r#c=<##d is the K Centre2 <hy d# y#$ +$t K thereA MI0 'ec $se th t is <h t the st$dy is. K0 )e ?e th t %#r the *in$te2 n#t t## +ers#n l. S"0 Krishn 7i2 I h ?e s#*e D$esti#ns I < nted t# s= y#$. K0 )et *e %inish. S"0 All ri1ht. .C

K0 @h t is it *e nt %#r2 the <h#le +l ceA "#r +e#+le <h# c#*e t# st$dy K2 b$t they ls# * y < nt t# %ind #$t <h t the '$ddh s id in rel ti#n t# <h t he is st$dyin1. Ri1htA He * y < nt t# %ind #$t <h t the S$%is s id2 #r s#*e #% the enli1htened #nes nd s# #n. I thin= <e sh#$ld h ?e thin1 #% th t =ind there2 strictly restricted t# the #ld thin1s2 n#t R 7neesh. MI0 The cl ssics. K0 The cl ssics. MI0 @e <ere s yin1 yesterd y2 this * n <h# c nBt d# it bec $se he is t## #ld < s 1#in1 t# d# st$dy #% Krishn *$rtiBs s yin1s #n cert in thin1s nd the '$ddh Bs2 s#rt #% + r llel #% the t<#. Th tBs h#< he < s 1#in1 t# d# this. And he h s 7$st <ritten t# s y it is t## *$ch %#r hi*2 he is t## #ld. '$t s$++#sin1 s#*e#ne else < nted t# d# th t2 t# <rite st$dy #% this2 the #b?i#$s +l ce %#r hi* t# c#*e nd d# it <#$ld be here2 <ith the rchi?es2 ccess t# ll #% Krishn *$rti2 b$t he <#$ld ls# need ccess t# '$ddhist te4ts. S# <e <ere t l=in1 b#$t th t nd s yin12 sh#$ld <e restrict it #nly t# Krishn *$rti. K0 @e <#nBt restrict it. MI0 N#2 I thin= it is *ist =e. K0 3l t#2 Arist#tle2 '$ddh . MI0 @e c#$ld 1# int# l ter <h t <e < nted. S"0 @e <ill h ?e t# be c re%$l <h t <e h ?e. K0 O% c#$rse2 #% c#$rse. N#t ;i* l Th = r nd ll th t. MI0 The 1re t cl ssics #% h$* n reli1i#$s2 *ystic l thin=in1. And then <e <ill h ?e t# disc$ss l ter h#< % r <e 1# int# r ti#n l +hil#s#+hy. K0 @e <ill 1# int# ll th t. MI0 @e c n disc$ss th t l ter. K0 N#< the sec#nd +#int is0 h#< l#n1 <ill they st yA And <h# is t# decide <hen +e#+le <h# c#*e nd s y2 this is * r?ell#$s +l ce nd settle d#<n ... S"0 Krishn 7i2 I thin= there re #ther D$esti#ns th t c#*e be%#re th t. K0 J$st *in$te2 sir2 I <#$ld li=e E y#$ $nderst nd2 it *$st n#t bec#*e b#$r1e#is centre. S"0 Abs#l$tely n#t. K0 Ri1htA A =ind #%2 y#$ =n#<2 sl#++y. Ri1htA N#r the hi1h intellect$ l s+inners2 #r the e*#ti#n lH the t<# e4tre*es y#$ d#nBt < nt. And y#$ < nt +e#+le <h# h ?e D$ lity2 y#$ =n#<2 stren1th2 sense #% B'y J#?e2 this is s#*ethin1 terribly seri#$s2 I * +$ttin1 *y li%e int# thisB.

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S"0 Krishn 7i2 I < nted t# s= y#$2 I < nted t# t l= b#$t <h t it *e ns t# st$dy the te chin1s bec $se ... K0 I% I c#*e there %r#* )y#n2 I c#*e there I h ?e t =en the tr#$ble t# tr ?el ll th t < y2 le ?in1 *y % *ily2 r di#2 tele?isi#n2 children2 I c#*e there. "irst #% ll I < nt t# be D$iet2 t# %eel th t I * D$iet2 n#t +r#ble*s2 nd n#t *y <i%e c llin12 *y children yellin12 #r s#*ethin1. I < nt t# be D$iet %irst2 %#r the %irst c#$+le #% d ys2 #r d y2 I 7$st < nt t# be D$iet. Then I <#$ld 1# int# the libr ry nd I s y2 this is st$dy2 n#t 7$st sittin1 D$ietly. Y#$ $nderst nd. This is st$dy2 there%#re y#$ h ?e t# st$dy <h t K is t l=in1 b#$t. S"0 N#< <h t d#es th t *e nA K0 T# *e <h t it *e ns2 i% I <ent there2 I < nt <h t K s ys in *y bl##d. Y#$ $nderst nd <h t I * s yin1A S"0 Yes. K0 Y#$ < nt <h t K s ys s# th t it is entirely + rt #% y#$2 n#t 7$st I h ?e st$died K nd IBll re+e t <h t he s ys. In the ?ery st$dyin1 #% it I * bs#rbin1 it thr#$1h *y +#res2 thr#$1h *y eyes2 thr#$1h *y e rs. S"0 C n <e t l= b#$t h#< th t h ++ens2 Krishn 7iA 'ec $se y#$ see this is <here <e ct$ lly <ill decide2 I %eel2 the n t$re #% the +l ce2 nd the n t$re #% the cti?ities. K0 I * tellin1 y#$2 sir2 7$st listen2 I h ?enBt %inished. I c#*e there t# st$dy K. In the st$dyin1 #% K I * bs#rbin1 ll th t he is s yin12 it is + rt #% *e. It is in *y bl##d2 n#t E 7$st *in$te2 sir2 7$st listen t# <h t I * s yin12 d#nBt resist. S"0 I * n#t resistin1. I * tryin1 t# 1# ?ery sl#<ly bec $se y#$ re t =in1 ?ery bi1 7$*+ here. K0 N#2 I c#*e %r#* '$chill#n2 I h ?e c#*e there. S"0 '$t h#< d#es it 1et int# y#$r bl##dA K0 'y st$dyin1 it. S"0 '$t <h t d# y#$ *e n by th tA K0 'y re din12 by listenin1 t# the t +es2 by seein1 ?ide#s2 I be1in t# bs#rb. S"0 Yes2 b$t n#< i% <e 1# little *#re sl#<ly2 Krishn 7i bec $se there re th#$s nds #% +e#+le <h# d# th t n#<2 nd y#$ =n#< th#$s nds #% the*2 <h# re d2 <h# < tch the ?ide# t +es2 #r d# #ther thin1s2 b$t they d#nBt bs#rb it int# their bl##d. K0 'ec $se there is n# +l ce <here they c n 1# nd be D$iet. MI0 Krishn 7i2 s#*e +e#+le sit in their r##* <ith n#thin12 n#thin1 b#therin1 the*. K0 Thr#< the* #$t2 thr#< the* #$t.

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S"0 Yes2 b$t I < nt t# 1et t# s#*ethin1 ... MI0 '$t these +e#+le h ?e set $+ in their #<n li?es the c#nditi#ns y#$ s+e = #%. K0 '$t n#thin1 ... MI0 I d#nBt +res$*e t# s y <h t 1#es #n inside the*. K0 I =n#< <h t y#$ re s yin1. )##= M ri 2 I h ?e 1#t it. This h#ly +l ce2 <h te?er y#$ c ll it2 th t <ill h ?e in%l$ence. Y#$ $nderst nd <h t I * s yin1A MI0 Yes2 I $nderst nd <h t y#$ re s yin1. K0 Th t is the s#$rce #% K. S#rry2 I * bein1 D$ite i*+ers#n l b#$t this. Th t is the s#$rce #% tr$th2 there2 nd it shines2 li?in1 there. N#t +e#+le. J$st listen2 sir. It is n#t in their h#*e2 it is n#t in (ene? 2 '$chill#n2 #r there2 b$t it is there2 li?in1. It is #$r 7#b t# see th t it is li?in12 y#$r 7#b. And <e <ill <#r= t it t# see th t th t thin1 is li?in1 thin12 n#t 7$st de d r##*. Y#$ $nderst ndA '$t <e <ill <#r= t th t2 I =n#< <h t t# d#2 <e <ill d# it. IBll tell y#$ ll b#$t it little l ter. Ri1htA And th t <ill h ?e in%l$ence %#r * n <h# < nts t# st$dy bec $se he 1#es $+ there t# be D$iet2 he 1#es $+ there t# 1et int# c#nt ct <ith s#*ethin1 *$ch dee+er. S"0 C n <e t l= b#$t th t %#r *in$te2 Krishn 7iA A * n sits nd he ... K0 Sir2 d#nBt t l= b#$t it2 1et %eelin1 #% it. S"0 @ell c n I t l= b#$t *ysel% thenA K0 St#+ t l=in1. (et the %eelin1 #% it. Th t is2 y#$ c#*e %r#* Te4 s2 y#$ h ?e t =en ll the tr#$ble t# c#*e t# this +l ce2 nd %#r the %irst %e< d ys y#$ < nt t# be D$iet2 n t$r lly. And y#$ 1# there2 e?eryb#dy =n#<s y#$ re there2 b$t y#$ 1# there2 h ?e t =en tr#$ble t# 1et there2 nd it is #$r b$siness t# see th t th t h s li?in1 < ters2 n#t 7$st de d r##*. Y#$ see t Tr#1#c# there < s n# %eelin1 there. Y#$ $nderst ndA It < s ll intellect$ lly d#ne. S# <e <ill cre te th t centre. I =n#< <h t t# d#2 <e <ill cre te it. Y#$ d#nBt =n#< it b$t <e <ill cre te it. Ri1htA H#< t# cre te it2 le ?e it t# *e th t + rt. And ls# s <e 1# l#n1 IBll t l= t# y#$ b#$t it. S# I c#*e there nd I re lise there is s#*ethin1 here <hich is t#t lly di%%erent %r#* *y h#*e2 t#t lly di%%erent %r#* 1#in1 t# disc$ssi#n2 t l=2 y#$ %#ll#<. Th t is s#*ethin1 tre*end#$sly li?e there. And I c#*e D$ietly %#r the %irst d y #r t<#2 nd I be1in t# st$dy2 n#t #nly the b##=2 b$t I listen t# ?ide#2 I listen t# the t +es2 nd I * li?in1 there. All #% $s re li?in1 there2 th t cre tes tre*end#$s %eelin1. Ri1htA A sense #%2 y#$ =n#<. S"0 Yes. K0 S# th t is <h t I <#$ld d# i% I < s there %r#* s#*e +l ce2 I <#$ld d# th t. I <#$ld be sensiti?e en#$1h t# recei?e. And I <#$ld li=e t#2 t l$nch2 #r < l=in12 #r sittin1 r#$nd t#1ether in the sittin1 r##*2 disc$ss E s y2 l##=2 I didnBt D$ite $nderst nd <h t the hell he *e nt by th t. )etBs t l= b#$t it. N#t y#$ tell *e2 I =n#< better2 b$t letBs t l= b#$t it. S# it <ill be *#?in1 thin1. And in the %tern##n2 #r in the e?enin12 I 1# #$t2 d# <h te?er I < nt. Or y#$ h ?e 1 rden nd y#$ h ?e s#*ethin12 I c n 1# t# the sch##l nd d# the 1 rden. Y#$ %#ll#<A D#nBt se+ r te th t nd this.

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S"0 ItBs n#t re lly se+ r ted in *y *ind2 Krishn 7i. K0 Y#$ $nderst nd <h t I *e nA S"0 Abs#l$tely2 yes. K0 It * y be th t y#$ *#< the l <n2 it * y be th t y#$ +l nt trees2 l##= %ter trees nd 1# t# the 1r#?e. S"0 Yes. MI0 There is endless <#r= in the 1r#?e. K0 3l nt2 * =e bed #% G le s. 3$t G le s ll #?er the +l ce. MI0 @e <#$ld c#E#rdin te <ith the 1 rdeners. ( ry. K0 O% c#$rse2 #% c#$rse. S"0 I h ?e lre dy s+#=en <ith hi* b#$t th t. S#*eh#< <e h ?e t# inc#r+#r te it. K0 It is li?in1 thin1 then. MI0 It <ill be ?ery 1##d %#r +e#+le <h# re c#*in1 here %#r this +$r+#se t# d# 1 rdenin12 s e4ercise2 %resh ir. K0 Yes2 yes. K0 And the r##*s *$st be $stere2 n#t 7$st l$4$ri#$s2 $stere. '$t c#*%#rt ble2 nice %eelin12 n#t 7$st ny #ld %$rnit$re. MI0 (##d beds. K0 O% c#$rse2 ll th t. S"0 Si*+le2 b$t e?erythin1 nice2 nd 1##d D$ lity. K0 Yes2 the *#*ent y#$ enter y#$ %eel2 by 7#?e I h ?e t# be ... S"0 Yes. K0 I thin= ll this <ill hel+ t# brin1 th t b#$t. K0 The sch##l +e#+le2 the te chers <h# re seri#$s2 sh#$ld c#*e t# th t r##*2 nd n#t the c s$ l ?isit#rs2 n#r the +e#+le <h# c#*e %#r c#$+le #% d ys nd 1# < y. I <#$ldnBt ll#< th#se +e#+le t# 1# $+ there. Ri1htA MI0 Only +erh +s +ers#n <h# h d been there +erh +s n$*ber #% ti*es ... K0 Oh2 yes2 th t is di%%erent * tter. C,

MI0 Yes2 b$t n#t ne< +ers#n. K0 N#. Y#$ see <h t <e re tryin1 t# s y is th t it *$st be =e+t E i% y#$ h ?e y#$ =ee+ #n l##=in1 t it2 it l#ses *e nin1. Y#$ *$st l##= t it #cc si#n lly. MI0 )i=e listenin1 t# * r?ell#$s *$sic. K0 Yes2 * r?ell#$s *$sic2 y#$ c nBt listen d y %ter d y in the s *e < yH it *$st be tre ted th t < y. And there sh#$ld be n# +ict$res in the r##*2 #nly se?er l c$shi#ns2 thin c$shi#ns2 thic= c$shi#ns2 y#$ =n#< ? riety #% c$shi#ns. MI0 @#$ld there be %l#<ers in the r##*2 +l ntsA K0 N#thin1. S"0 @#$ld y#$ h ?e l r1e <ind#<s l##=in1 #$t2 Krishn 7iA K0 N#2 n#. Y#$ see2 c#*in1 b c= t# <h t I < s thin=in12 n# <ind#<s t ll. It *$st be ?entil ted. 'ec $se the *#*ent y#$ h ?e <ind#<2 y#$ re sittin1 there2 y#$r inclin ti#n is t# l##= #$t. It is r##* <here y#$ h ?e t# be <ithdr <n E n#t <ithdr <n2 y#$ $nderst nd <h t I *e nA MI0 T$rn in< rd. K0 T$rn in< rd2 yes. )e ?e th t2 IBll c#*e b c= t# th t. I c#*e there %r#* '$chill#n2 S<iss. I h ?e he rd K t the tent2 nd I < nt t# +$rs$e it %$rther2 ?ery *$ch %$rther. And I < nt t# *eet there ls# +e#+le <h# re ls# in the s *e *#?e*ent2 *#*ent2 *#*ent$*. I c#*e there nd I =n#< y#$ re ll ?ery cle n %irst2 +hysic lly e4tr #rdin rily cle n2 e?erythin1. Ri1htA I c#*e there2 I c#*e +erh +s t l$nch ti*e2 #r +erh +s l te %tern##n2 I *$st h ?e s#*ethin1 t# drin=2 te #r s#*ethin1 E th tBs tri?i l %% ir. Then I 1# t# *y r##*2 nd $n+ c=2 +$t < y *y thin1s. I * bit shy2 ner?#$s2 <h tBs ll this b#$t2 nd ls# I * < tchin1 +e#+le <h# re there2 <hether they re c#n1eni l2 <hether they re ... I <#$ld n#t d*it2 i% I * y +#int #$t2 y#$ * y ll dis 1ree2 nyb#dy <h# is *ent lly dist$rbed. S"0 Abs#l$tely. K0 Ri1htA Ment lly dist$rbed2 ne$r#tic2 +ec$li r h bits2 se4$ lly nd #ther <ise nd n# drin=ers2 s*#=ers2 nd ll the rest #% it. MI0 M y #ne enD$ire2 Krishn 7i2 h#< y#$ <#$ld e4+l in t# +ers#n <h# < nted t# c#*e <hy they c#$ldnBt2 #r c#$ld #nly st y sh#rt ti*eA D# y#$ h ?e t# e4+l in t llA Or d# y#$ h ?e s#*e +#licy by s yin12 <e d#nBt e4+l in2 7$st n#t e4+l in2 s y2 I * s#rry2 n# y#$ c nBt c#*e2 #r d# <e h ?e t# 1i?e s#*e re s#n <hy they c nBt c#*eA Or d# <e s y2 IB* <%$lly s#rry2 it is i*+#ssibleA K0 @#$ld y#$ +$t it $+ in the r##*A S"0 Ab#$t n# s*#=in12 n# drin=in1 nd ll th t. K0 All th t2 * =e ll th t in the r##*. be $ti%$l +ict$re2 i%

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S"0 '$t i% nyb#dy <rites in %#r reser? ti#ns2 there is in%#r* ti#n I <#$ld be sendin1 the*2 nd I <#$ld send the* ll #% th t be%#re they e?en c#*e. MI0 It sh#$ld s y th t it is $nderst##d th t ny st y t this St$dy is li*ited in ti*e. K0 Yes2 yes2 <e re 1#in1 t# s y ll th t. MI0 @e d#nBt h ?e t# s y h#< l#n12 b$t it is est blished th t <e set2 #r y#$ h ?e t# set the ter*s #% len1th. '$t s$++#sin1 s#*eb#dy s ys2 h#< l#n1 c n I st y2 nd y#$ s y2 <ee=2 nd he s ys2 b$t th#se +e#+le re st yin1 t<# <ee=s2 <hyA H#< *$ch e4+l n ti#n d# y#$ h ?e t# 1i?eA K0 I <#$ldnBt 1i?e ny. MI0 I <#$ldnBt either b$t y#$ h ?e t# s y s#*ethin1. S"0 @ell2 I c n l< ys thin= #% s#*ethin1 t# s y2 th tBs n#t the di%%ic$lty. K0 @ it *in$te2 let *e %inish. I c#*e there2 re d this n#tice in the r##*2 nd I c#*e t# dinner2 nd n#thin1 h ++ens2 I 1# t# bed2 #r %#r < l= #r s#*ethin1. The ne4t *#rnin1 d# <e ll *eetA Y#$ $nderst nd <h t I * s yin1A Then it bec#*es %#r* l. S"0 N#2 n#. K0 I c#*e d#<n %#r bre =% st. I hel+ t# < sh dishes2 +r#?ided I h ?e 1l#?es there2 I hel+ t# < sh $+. Then b#$t - #Bcl#c=2 -.86 I 1# t# the st$dy <here I st$dy2 <here I st$dy <h t K is s yin1. I *e n by st$dy2 in?esti1 te it2 s I re d it I D$esti#n it2 d#$bt it2 s= E y#$ %#ll#< E I * bs#rbin1 it2 n#t 7$st re d nd then 1# #%%. S"0 I still h ?e s#*e D$esti#ns #n th t. @e c n d# th t l ter. K0 I < nt t# be cle r <h t the st$dy *e ns. As I re d I * be1innin1 t# D$esti#n2 I * be1innin1 t# s= <hy he s ys th t2 nd <hy he d#esnBt s y the #++#site nd s# #n. I * re lly st$dyin1 it s I <#$ld st$dy * the* tics. I h ?e t# bs#rb it. S"0 Yes2 b$t there is ls# s#*ethin1 else2 Krishn 7i. @ell I c n st$dy s#*ethin1 li=e * chinery #r * the* tics2 #r hist#ry. It is D$esti#n #% *e*#risin12 nd ls# D$esti#n #% +$ttin1 it int# +ers+ecti?e <ith #ther thin1s th t it is rel ted t#2 nd itBs ls# D$esti#n #% $nderst ndin1 h#< it %its int# *$ch l r1er +ict$re2 the i*+lic ti#ns #% the thin1. '$t <hen I * st$dyin1 the te chin1s2 there is s#*ethin1 else. N#< #ne c n st$dy2 I <#$ld h ?e s$11ested th t #ne c n st$dy the te chin1s2 #nce y#$ bec#*e % *ili r <ith the 1r#$nd<#r=2 y#$ h ?e re d b##=s2 y#$ h ?e < tched ?ide# t +es2 y#$ re % *ili r lre dy. K0 Y#$ see2 sir2 I * c#*in1 t# th t. )et *e %inish <h t I < nt t# s y. I re d. I * re din1 n#t t# *e*#rise2 b$t I * re din1 t# le rn. I * re din1 t# le rn2 I * re din1 t# see <h t he is s yin1 nd *y rel ti#nshi+ t# <h t he is s yin12 s# th t it c#rres+#nds2 it c#ntr dicts. I% it c#ntr dicts I D$esti#n it2 <hether he is ri1ht2 #r I * ri1ht. S"0 There is n#ther + rt t# it2 Krishn 7i. K0 @ it2 sir2 let *e %inish. S# th t there is c#nst nt c#**$nic ti#n2 interch n1e2 e4ch n1e2 bet<een C8

<h t I * re din1 nd <h t I * %eelin1. @ it sir2 nd <h t I %eel2 <hether *y %eelin12 *y in?esti1 ti#n int# *y sel% is cc$r te cc#rdin1 t# th t2 #r I * <r#n1 nd he is ri1ht2 #r he is <r#n12 I * ri1ht. S# I * c#nst ntly in this rel ti#nshi+ #% enD$iry. EnD$iry int# <h t he is s yin12 enD$iry int# *ysel%2 s# th t there is l< ys this inter%l#<2 interrel ti#nshi+ 1#in1 #n bet<een <h t I re d nd <h t I $nderst nd2 <h t I 1 thered in *ysel%. N#t 7$st *e*#rise <h t he s ys2 th tBs t## silly. S"0 N#. N#< <h t h ++ens2 Krishn 7i2 <hen s#*e#ne re ds s#*ethin1 nd they c n see th t itBs ri1ht2 nd itBs n e4tr #rdin ry thin1 they h ?e 7$st +ic=ed $+. K0 Then i% it is ri1ht I <#$ld s=2 <hy d# I %eel it is ri1ht. I <#$ld enD$ire. Y#$ see I ne?er ll#< *ysel% t# be tr ++ed by <h t is bein1 s id. I * enD$irin1 ll the ti*e2 I %eel by J#?e this is ri1ht2 <hy2 is it. I h ?e ls# enD$ired2 I * #+en t# th t s# th t in re din1 I * e4+ ndin1 *y #<n insi1ht E n#t insi1ht #nly E the intelli1ence <hich is be1innin1 t# be < =ened. S"0 Yes. K0 @ it2 < it2 < it. IBll le ?e th t. In the %tern##n2 +erh +s b#$t ,92 I d#nBt =n#< <h t ti*e2 it d#esnBt * tter2 I listen t# t +e nd t# ?ide# d$rin1 the d y2 s# y#$ $nderst nd <h t is h ++enin1 t# *eA I n#t #nly re d <ith the eyes2 n t$r lly2 b$t * est blishin1 rel ti#nshi+ bet<een <h t I re d nd *ysel%2 nd I see2 I he r the t +e E let *e %inish2 sir2 d#nBt 7$*+ #n *e E =ee+ D$iet. S"0 Yes2 I <ill. K0 I * n#t bein1 r$de. S"0 N#2 #% c#$rse n#t2 Krishn 7i. K0 I he r the t +e2 nd ls# I est blish rel ti#nshi+ there. Ri1htA I * < tchin1 *ysel%2 h#< I listen2 h#< I %eel2 <hether I * listenin1 +r#+erly2 <hether I * listenin1 c s$ lly. All th t I * d#in1 ll the ti*e. Then I see ?ide#2 I see the * n2 nd I re lise I *$stnBt be +ers$ ded by hi*2 I *$st be n#t i*+ressed by hi*2 n#r cce+t <h t he s ys2 I * < tchin1. Y#$ %#ll#<A I * est blishin1 rel ti#nshi+ ll the ti*e2 b#th +#siti?ely nd ne1 ti?ely2 s$b7ecti?ely. )istenL S$b7ecti?ely nd #b7ecti?ely ll the ti*e. Re din12 t +e2 ?ide#. S# t the end #% the d y I * e4h $sted. This is tre*end#$s <#r=. Y#$ $nderst ndA S# in the e?enin12 i% y#$ h ?e *$sic IBd l#?e t# he r it. One #% the ne< * chines. IBd l#?e t# 1# nd he r it D$ietly. A%ter dinner I 1# t# bed e rly. N#< < it I h ?enBt %inished. I% it is t## +enetr tin12 it < nts t# be little ... MI0 Then e?eryb#dy is c +ti?e $dience t# s#*eb#dyBs ch#ice #% *$sic. I% s#*e#ne s$ddenly +l yed2 I d#nBt =n#< <h t... K0 N# 7 GG. MI0 ... M hler t *e t the <r#n1 *#*ent I <#$ld 1# * d. S"0 I% it < s in s+eci l r##*. MI0 @ell then #ne +ers#n 1ets the $se #% the r##*. Y#$ see <h t I *e n. K0 I $nderst nd <h t y#$ *e n ?ery <ell. This is <h t c#*in1 %r#* ' rcel#n E this is <h t I C:

<#$ld li=e. I <#$ld d# the 1 rden2 1# r#$nd the #%%ice2 1# r#$nd nd ll th t2 b$t in the e?enin1 I d#nBt < nt t# be dist$rbed %ter l#n1 d y #% re l st$dyH y#$ $nderst nd2 <hich de* nds ttenti#n2 I d#nBt < nt t the end #% th t s#*eb#dy t# t l= <ith *e2 t# disc$ss <ith *e. MI0 N# b$t e?eryb#dy c n < l= < y %r#* th t. Y#$ c n < l= < y %r#* th t. K0 @ it2 I s y < it. I * % irly intelli1ent * n. I h ?e re d '$ddhis*2 I h ?e re d ... I h ?e tr ?elled2 I * n#t 7$st d$*b +ers#n c#*in1 there. S# <e *$st +r#?ide %#r *e %r#* ' rcel#n 2 #r %r#* '$chill#n2 I *$st h ?e th t D$ lity #% +e#+le r#$nd *e. I * y n#t h ?e it2 s# I s y IBll listen. IBll =ee+ t# *ysel%. I *eet Mrs S*ith2 there is ... S"0 n#thin1 there. Ri1ht. K0 ... there is n#thin1 in th t * n nd he +l ys2 <h t2 M hler. I * n#t interested2 I *i1ht listen t# it b$t I <#$ld li=e s#*ethin1 else. S# h#< * I 1#in1 E h#< re y#$ 1#in1 t# +r#?ide *e <ith *$sic <hich I < nt2 n#t... MI0 Th t is <h t I 7$st s id. K0 N#2 M ri 2 t# *e t +e is s#*ethin1 ... I < nt t# %ill the r##*. S"0 Yes. There is s#*ethin1 l#?ely b#$t %illin1 the r##* <ith 1##d *$sic. K0 I < nt t# see the < lls ?ibr te <ith it. MI0 @ell then e?eryb#dy in the h#$se h s t# listen t##. S"0 N#2 e?eryb#dy in the r##*. MI0 @ell2 i% it ?ibr tes the < lls ... S"0 I thin= <e c n d# s#*ethin1 li=e th t2 Krishn 7i. And h#< * ny +e#+le listen nd h#< * ny E th tBs technic l =ind #% +r#ble* th#$1h. I *e n <e c n s#l?e th t. K0 I d#nBt =n#< <h# <ill s#l?e it. S"0 N#2 <e c n c#*e $+ <ith s$11esti#ns nd t#ss the* r#$nd. K0 This is <h t I <#$ld li=e0 I * 1entle* n2 n#t 7$st ... b$t I c#*e t# th t +l ce2 <ell dressed2 y#$ =n#<2 1##d cl#thes nd ll the rest #% it2 nd I < nt t# be in +l ce #% 1##d t ste. MI0 Krishn 7i2 y#$ re bein1 t## de* ndin12 y#$ re bein1 r ther de* ndin1. In y#$r $diences I h ?e yet t# see nyb#dy2 +resent c#*+ ny e4ce+ted2 <ell dressed. K0 I de* nd th t. MI0 Y#$ *e n Sc#tt nd K thy re ... K0 N#2 %#r *ysel% I * s yin1. I * de* ndin1 #% *ysel%. I * n#t c#ncerned b#$t #thers.

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MI0 @e re t l=in1 b#$t the +e#+le <h# c#*e. K0 I h ?e re d l#t2 nd t l=ed l#t nd ... nd th tBs *y d y. Th t *e ns t the end #% <ee=2 y#$ =n#< <h t h s h ++ened t# *eA Ri1htA I h ?e bec#*e tre*end#$sly sensiti?e2 li?e nd I s y2 by J#?e2 I <ill st y here %#r *#nth. I <ill st y %#r three <ee=s nd see <h t h ++ens t# *e. S$ddenly I * y bec#*e <riter2 I *i1ht bec#*e s#*ethin1 e4+l#si?e. S# 1i?e *e ch nce #% three <ee=s2 y#$ %#ll#< E let *e st y there2 ll#< *e t# st y there %#r cert in n$*ber #% d ys2 d#nBt s y t the end #% three <ee=s2 y#$ 1# E ri1htA I * y 1# t the end #% %#rtni1ht. MI0 I d#nBt thin= there is ny +r#ble* <ith this ide l +ers#n <h# y#$ re describin12 c#*in1 E they c#$ld st y there si4 *#nths <ith#$t ... K0 I *i1ht. MI0 '$t itBs the +ers#n <h# is n#t... K0 AhL Then y#$ h ?e t# tell hi*2 s#rry ... MI0 N#< <h# * =es th t 7$d1e*entA K0 The c#**ittee2 the +e#+le there. MI0 @h t d# y#$ *e n2 e4ce+t J ne nd M ryA c#**itteeA K thy nd Sc#tt re there2 resident2 nd <h# else h ?e <e

S"0 '$t I thin= <e c n 7$st s y it2 I thin= <e c n ... MI0 '$t <h# * =es the 7$d1e*entA Y#$ c nBt e4+ect J ne t# r$sh #?er nd l##=. .. S"0 N#2 I thin= th t is <h t K thy nd I <ill h ?e t# d#. C#$ldnBt <e st rt #%% <ith +e#+le c#*in1 %#r s y #ne <ee=2 nd then it c n be e4tended2 y#$ =n#<2 by enD$iry2 #r s#*ethin1 li=e th t. One c n s y t# the <r#n1 =ind #% +e#+le2 n# I * s#rry. MI0 Y#$ see y#$ h ?e t# d# s#*e screenin1 be%#reh nd bec $se i% th t * d <#* n <h# < s <ith her s#n the #ther d y c *e2 y#$ <#$ld i**edi tely =n#< th t this < snBt the ri1ht +ers#n be%#re she s id t<# <#rds. S# there <#$ld be screenin1 be%#re. '$t s y s#*e#ne <rites %r#* Y$1#sl ?i 2 <h# < nts t# c#*e. S# they <#$ld c#*e %#r <h t2 h#< l#n1 <#$ld they be ll#<edA K0 A <ee=. MI0 A <ee=. K0 Th t <#$ld be deD$ te. S"0 Yes2 yes. K0 '$t they *$st be E %#r th#se +e#+le I <#$ld s y strict. N#< y#$ see sir2 I d#nBt < nt t# < sh *y shirts. I *i1ht cle n *y sh#es nd * =e *y r##*. '$t I h ?e c#*e there %#r s+eci l +$r+#se2 y#$ %#ll#<2 I <ill hel+ in the 1 rden2 I <ill < sh dishes2 I <ill d# ll th#se thin1s. '$t I d#nBt < nt t# s+end *y ti*e ir#nin1 nd shirts nd ... C.

MI0 Krishn 7i2 t#d y +e#+le re n#t % Ged by this. I% y#$ h ?e 1#t ti*e t# < sh dishes nd <#r= in the 1 rden2 t# < sh y#$r shirts is n#t +r#ble*2 bec $se y#$ h ?e l $ndry ser?ice. S"0 @e <ill h ?e the eD$i+*ent there b$t i% s#*e#ne d#esnBt < nt t#2 there is l $ndry ser?ice. MI0 @h t d# y#$ *e n2 there is l $ndry ser?iceA S"0 Y#$ =n#<2 @inchester ) $ndry. MI0 It t =es <ee=. S"0 Or Alres%#rd ) $ndry. @ell I thin= it c n be d#ne s##ner. They c n 1i?e it t# c#**erci l cle ners nd ... MI0 They *$st be res+#nsible %#r their #<n2 <e c nBt be. S"0 N#2 <e c n hel+ #r1 nise it. @e c n hel+ #r1 nise it s# th t the cle ners <ill c#*e there t<ice <ee= #r s#*ethin1 li=e th t. @e c n d# s#*ethin1. K0 "irst #% ll here re t<# thin1s0 +ers#n lly I d#nBt < nt t# be l Gy. I < nt t# <#r= <ith *y h nds in the 1 rden2 s#<in12 +l ntin1 #r <eedin12 s#*ethin12 b$t I d#nBt < nt t# be ll the ti*e b#thered b#$t *y s#c=s2 *y shirts nd ll th t. MI0 @ell Krishn 7i th t is the n#r* l... K0 @ it2 < it. MI0 ... li=e br$shin1 y#$r teeth these d ys. One d#es #neBs #<n l $ndry. I thin= this *$stnBt be the RitG H#tel. K0 N#2 n#. O% c#$rse n#t. I s id the r##* *$st be $stere2 e?erythin1 *$st c#rres+#nd nd %eel %r#* th t Centre E ri1htA There%#re it is n#t l$4$ry. On the c#ntr ry it is de* ndin12 tre*end#$sly. MI0 I 1ree. '$t t# +$t y#$r cl#thes #r y#$r s#c=s in * chine ... K0 @e <ill see. Th t is $ni*+#rt nt. S"0 @e c n de l <ith th t. I *e n D$ite h#nestly I2 i% K thy d#esnBt h ?e ti*e t# d# *y l $ndry2 y#$ =n#< inste d #% *y ir#nin1 <e + y #ne #% the st$dents t# d# it2 <h# is thrilled t# d# ir#nin1 %#r little bit #% *#ney bec $se they 1et n# *#ney. S# there is l< ys the +#ssibility #% s#*e#ne d#in1 it2 d#in1 ir#nin1. K0 )e ?e th t %#r the *#*ent. S"0 @e c n de l <ith th t. It is n#t the technic l +r#ble*s I * <#rried b#$t. @e c n d# the #r1 nisin1 + rt. K0 @ith re1 rd t# the 1 rden2 y#$ nd ( ry s y t# *e2 1# nd d# th t.

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MI0 They sh#$ld be enc#$r 1ed t# d# the 1 rden. K0 Y#$ c n * =e the 1 rden * r?ell#$s. S"0 Yes2 yes. K0 "l#<ers nd ll th t. MI0 It <ill 1et +e#+le #$t in the %resh ir nd intensi?e st$dy. bit #% e4ercise nd it <ill be 1##d b l nce t#

K0 And th t %#rest2 n#t %#rest2 <##d <here y#$ h ?e +l nted ... S"0 The +l nt ti#n. K0 The +l nt ti#n2 <eedin1 E y#$ %#ll#<. I d#nBt *ind d#in1 ll th t. Ri1htA '$t I *$st h ?e the ri1ht sh#es. S"0 @ell <e h ?e b##ts2 <e e?en h ?e <ellin1t#ns t the sch##l. @e h ?e y#$ =n#< t<enty di%%erent <ellin1t#ns nd ... K0 Th tBs ll ri1ht. I h ?e c#*e there %#r #ne +$r+#se E ri1htA @hich is t# st$dy K nd est blish rel ti#nshi+ <ith <h t I * re din12 *y #<n re cti#n t# <h t I * re din12 *y re cti#n t# <h t I he r2 t +e2 *y re cti#ns nd interErel ti#nshi+ <ith the ?ide#. S# I * ll the ti*e E I h ?e le rnt t# be in this +r#cess e4tr #rdin rily < tch%$l. Ri1htA Attenti?e. In th t r##* in the $+st irs2 #r d#<nst irs in the c#rrid#r2 I <ill 1# there <hen I < nt t# E ri1htA I sh#$ld =ee+ it l#c=ed. MI0 Then y#$ d#nBt 1# <hen y#$ < nt t#A K0 N#. I <#$ld s= the* i% I * y h ?e the =eys2 #r <here re the =eys. S# it isnBt 7$st I < l= in. I * thin=in1 l#$d2 I * n#t s yin1 it sh#$ld be l#c=ed2 +r#b bly. It * y be =e+t #+en. '$t the d n1er #% th t is2 y#$ =n#< ... S"0 It bec#*es de? l$ed s#*eh#<. K0 I h ?e n#thin1 t# d# s# I 7$st 1# nd sit there. Or I * n#t %eelin1 <ell2 I h#+e by 1#in1 $+ there I <ill %eel <ell. Y#$ =n#<2 th t terrible *ent lity th t is 1#in1 t# de?el#+ $nless <e re ?ery < tch%$l. Ri1htA I h#+e y#$ <ill 1et l#ts #% +e#+le %r#* ' rcel#n #r '$chill#n. S"0 I d# t##2 Krishn 7i. K0 I d#nBt =n#< h#< y#$ re 1#in1 t# =ee+ #$t #ld l dies2 senti*ent l... S"0 @e <ill. K0 ... < it2 sir2 < it sir2 d#nMt2 it <#nMt be s# e sy. S"0 N#2 it <#nBt be e sy. K0 They s y I h ?e li?ed2 st$died2 been t# 'r#c=<##d2 S nen %#r ye rs nd I < nt t# be + rt #% C/

this. S"0 Yes2 #h yes. K0 I h ?e 1i?en *#ney2 y#$ c nBt =ee+ E y#$ %#ll#<A Y#$ c nBt s y #nly +e#+le c n c#*e here <h# re $nder thirty %i?e. MI0 I h#+e n#t. S"0 I h#+e n#t2 I <#$ldnBt be ble t# 1# *ysel%. K0 It is n#t 1e li*it. S# y#$ *$st be2 <h tA Ch r cter li*itA @h tA H#< <#$ld y#$ e? l$ te +e#+le2 n#t 7$d1e. H#< <#$ld y#$A Y#$ +r#b bly <ill be there. Y#$ nd y#$r <i%e2 +erh +s y#$ +r#b bly *#re th n y#$r <i%e. I * n#t s yin1 y#$ sh#$ld #r sh#$ld n#t. And h#< <ill y#$ 7$d1e itA I% <ith#$t r#$sin1 nt 1#nis*2 th t is the l st thin1 y#$ < nt in this +l ce2 dissensi#n2 they s y2 <hy the hell sh#$ldnBt I be there2 <hile he is there. I <ill t l= t# hi* nd he s ys t# *e he h s been here %#r *#nth. Th t is n#t secret2 he h s t#ld *e2 nd I h ?e been t$rned #$t %ter <ee=2 <h t the hell is <r#n1 <ith this +l ceA @h# re y#$ t# tell *eA S# ll th#se thin1s re 1#in1 t# rise. S# y#$ h ?e t# h ?e s#*e =ind #% E i% it is ll le%t t# y#$2 <hich is n#t +le s nt2 listen t# this2 it is n#t ri1ht either. Y#$ *i1ht li=e *y % ce2 #r y#$ *i1ht h ?e %eelin12 %riendshi+ nd y#$ s y2 c#*e in2 b$t t# n#ther * n y#$ *i1ht s y2 s#rry2 y#$ c nBt c#*e in. S# y#$ $nderst nd2 sirA N#< c#*e b c= t# s#*ethin1 else. I * 1#in1 t# s= y#$ s#*ethin1. I h#+e y#$ d#nBt *ind. @hy re y#$ thereA S"0 @hy * I thereA MI0 Are y#$ the * n %r#* ' rcel#n s=in1 the D$esti#nA

K0 N#2 I * n#t %r#* ' rcel#n . I * s=in1. S"0 Y#$ re s=in1 <hy * I there. K0 @hy h ?e y#$ cce+ted the res+#nsibility <hich K h s +$t $+#n y#$2 #r the "#$nd ti#n h s +$t $+#n y#$2 <hy h ?e y#$ cce+ted itA S"0 'ec $se it see*s t# *e th t it is bs#l$tely ri1ht nd th t it is i*+#rt nt2 nd it is s#*ethin1 th t needs t# be d#ne. K0 I =n#<2 sir. Yes2 I $nderst nd. N#< 1# %$rther. S"0 And e?en *#re2 in sense Krishn 7i ... K0 N#2 +le se2 sir2 listen c re%$lly2 y#$ re t## D$ic= t# ns<er. Y#$ A*eric nsL )isten c re%$lly2 sir. I * s=in1 y#$2 K is the +resident #% the "#$nd ti#n2 he s ys2 Sc#tt2 <ill y#$ nd y#$r <i%e r$n the sh#<A And y#$ s y2 deli1hted. Is it y#$ li=e t# b$ildA )isten. '$ildin1. T l=in1 t# the rchitect2 t l=in1 t# A(... Is it AhGh y #r Ay(eeA S"0 A* I 7$st d#in1 this bec $se I li=e t# b$ild nd t l= t# rchitects nd t l= t# A(. A

C-

K0 Y#$2 bein1 n A*eric n2 %#r1i?e *e2 y#$ re cti?e +hysic lly. All A*eric ns h ?e tre*end#$s ener1y i% they ... S# is th t <hy y#$ re t =in1 itA @ it2 sir2 1# c re%$lly2 I h ?enBt %inished yet. Or h ?in1 th t ener1y2 th t $r1e t# b$ild2 t# t l=2 t# brin1 s#*ethin1 int# bein12 th t b$ildin12 <ith the hel+ #% A(. nd s# #n2 +l$s s#*ethin1 else. N#< I * 1#in1 t# t l= b#$t th t. 3le se2 I * n#t bein1 i*+$dent2 I * n#t bein1 i*+#lite. I * n#t bein1 de* ndin12 +ressin1. D#nBt thin= #% ny #% th#se thin1s. S"0 I <#$ldnBt dre * #% it. K0 Are y#$ *erely c ret =erA @ itin1 %#r s#*eb#dy better th n y#$ t# t =e y#$r +l ceA J$st *in$te. I < nt t# 1# int# it c re%$lly. Or y#$ s y2 I <ill t =e c re #% this +l ce <ith the hel+ #% #thers2 b$t th t is n#t *y +ri* ry interest. My +ri* ry interest is the te chin1s E ri1htA And there%#re y#$ re ls# st$dyin1. Y#$ re ls# 1#in1 thr#$1h the s *e +r#cess s the * n %r#* ' rcel#n #r '$chill#n. S# y#$ h ?e t# h ?e ti*e %#r th t. Y#$ $nderst nd2 sirA N#t s y2 I h ?e 1#t.. I h ?e 1#t... And y#$ ls# h ?e t# h ?e E I * n#t bein1 i*+$dent E y#$ h ?e t# h ?e 1re t sensiti?ity. I c#*e %r#* % *ily2 I * tre*end#$sly sensiti?e2 I c nBt *eet s#*eb#dy <h# is insensiti?e. D# y#$ $nderst ndA "irst +ers#n I *eet is y#$. I s y2 *y 1#d2 <h t h ?e I c#*e t#A Ri1htA Y#$ *$st... s# I * 7$st s$11estin12 sir2 th t y#$ h ?e t# be e?en *#re sensiti?e th n *e2 *#re h ?in1 1 thered '$ddhis*2 I * n#t 7#=in12 sir2 this is tre*end#$s thin1 y#$ re $ndert =in12 d#nBt %##l r#$nd <ith it. Y#$ *$st =n#< '$ddhis*2 y#$ *$st be ble t# t l= b#$t Christi nity2 little bit2 y#$ *$st be ble t# s= b#$t S$%is* E y#$ %#ll#<A Y#$ *$st *eet *y *ind. S# y#$ h ?e t# be1in %r#* n#< n#t #nly t# h ?e rchitects b$t ti*e t# <#r= t this s# th t <hen the b$ildin1 is $+ y#$ re there. Y#$ see s l#n1 s I * in 'r#c=<##d I <ill be <ith y#$. Y#$ c n c#*e t# *y r##* nd t l= b#$t it. IBll +#lish y#$r sh#es2 be <ith *e s *$ch s y#$ c n. Th t is n#t +ers#n l. It is n#t E I li=e y#$2 I h ?e n %%ecti#n %#r y#$2 nd ll the rest #% it2 b$t n# +ers#n l E y#$ %#ll#<A He tells *e2 there%#re I *$st2 I * de?#ted. All th t is #$t. It *$st be b#th #b7ecti?e nd s$b7ecti?e. And y#$r *ind *$st be th t < y t##2 br in2 y#$ $nderst ndA @ill y#$ d# thisA S"0 Yes2 Krishn 7i. I ns<er D$ic=ly bec $se I h ?e th#$1ht b#$t this Krishn 7i2 nd this is + rt #% <h t I < nted t# c#*e nd t l= <ith y#$ b#$t. K0 Y#$ re t l=in1 n#<. S"0 @ell I < nt t# t l= b#$t <h t it *e ns t# st$dy the te chin1s +r#%#$ndly. K0 I h ?e * de it cle r. S"0 Yes. '$t there re *#re + rts t# it bec $se I * t l=in1 ls# b#$t *y #<n st$dyin1. I re lise th t i% I d#nBt d# it the <h#le +l ce % lls + rt. I h ?e n# b$siness d#in1 it i% I * n#t d#in1 it E ri1htA K0 Th t is $nderst##d. Th t is <hy 'r#c=<##d h s c#ll +sed. S"0 Yes2 I 1ree. I 1ree c#*+letely. And it is this D$esti#n #% the te chin1s s#*eh#< 1#in1 int# the bl##d. K0 @e <ill 1et it2 sir2 I * s$re <e <ill 1et it. As l#n1 s <e re t l=in1 t#1ether li=e this2 #%% nd #n2 t<# #r three d ys2 =ee+ t it. /6

S"0 Yes2 yes. K0 As l#n1 s <e re in 'r#c=<##d. S"0 Yes2 b$t Krishn 7i2 ls# I %eel th t it h s t# be s#*ethin1 th t d#es n#t de+end #n y#$. K0 It de+ends #n the te chin1s. S"0 On the te chin1s. And #n h#< I rel te t# the te chin1s. K0 >$ite. He h s e4+l ined ?ery c re%$lly h#< y#$ rel te t# it. S"0 Yes2 he h s s id l#t b$t %r#* *y #<n rel ti#nshi+ <ith the te chin1s there re s#*e #ther thin1s I < nt t# s= b#$t bec $se there re s#*e #ther + rts t# it <hich I %eel2 %r#* *y #<n rel ti#nshi+2 re i*+#rt nt. K0 @h t is th t2 brie%lyA S"0 It h s t# d# <ith bein1 ble t# E s#*eti*es I st$dy the te chin1s e?eryd y. I h ?e %#r ye rs. K0 C#*e2 <h t re y#$ s yin1 sirA S"0 S#*eti*es st$dyin1 the te chin1s %#r *e *e ns e?en 7$st re din1 #ne +hr se. K0 >$ite ri1ht. Th tBs $+ t# y#$. S"0 '$t n#< < it. This is the #ther + rt Krishn 7i. Th t #ne +hr se s#*eh#< h#ldin1 it d$rin1 the d y bec $se it is in cti#n nd in rel ti#nshi+2 h#ldin1 it. K0 >$ite ri1ht. S"0 N#< I < nt t# ... K0 Y#$ re c rryin1 7e<el <ith y#$. Y#$ re < tchin1 ll the ti*e #r it <ill 1et l#st. S"0 N#< I < nted t# t l= b#$t th t h#ldin1 bec $se2 t# *e there is secret in th t h#ldin12 there is s#*ethin1 ?ery s+eci l b#$t th t h#ldin1 th t *#st +e#+le d#nBt =n#< nd th t I #%ten %#r1et. K0 Yes sir. )isten c re%$lly0 M ri #r A.(. 1i?es *e * r?ell#$s < tch. I d#nBt < nt y#$ t#2 I h ?e 1#t #ne. A * r?ell#$s < tch2 s$+er. And it is s$ch +reci#$s thin1 I * ?ery c re%$l. I < tch it ll d y. S"0 Yes. K0 The thin1 E I d#nBt h ?e t# h#ld it2 it is there in *y h nds. Y#$ %#ll#<A I < tch it. I li?e <ith it. S"0 Yes. I% I c n c#*e b c= t# this Krishn 7i. It is there in y#$r h nds. N#< i% I c#*e $+ t# y#$2 7$st t# c#ntin$e the *et +h#r2 nd s y2 l##=2 <#$ld y#$ +le se d# the dishes2 hereBs the t<# 1l#?es2 y#$ re n#t 1#in1 t# =ee+ the < tch in y#$r h nd. Y#$ re 1#in1 t# +$t it in y#$r +#c=et2 #r y#$ re /,

1#in1 t# d# s#*ethin1 else <ith it. K0 N#H the < tch is still tic=in1 < y. S"0 E4 ctly. N#< this is + rtly2 y#$ see in this st$dy2 s#*eh#< I %eel <e < nt t# set $+2 nd I < nt t# set $+ ls# %#r *ysel% .... K0 Th t is the thin1 he is s yin1. S"0 ... s#*e cti?ities th t hel+ +e#+le h#ld this thin1 ll d y l#n1. K0 'e c re%$l. D#nBt d# th t. N# cti?ity is h#ldin1 it. N# #$tside hel+. S"0 N#2 n# #$tside hel+2 b$t s#*eh#< n#t 1i?e +e#+le s# * ny thin1s t# d#. K0 Th t is <h t I s id t# y#$ sir. Y#$ d# ll the thin1s y#$ h ?e t# d#. Y#$ *$st ll#< %#r y#$rsel% %#$r #r %i?e h#$rs2 #r t<# h#$rs2 <h te?er y#$ < nt. S y2 l##= I sh$t *y d##r %ter t<# #Bcl#c= #r <h te?er ti*e. N#b#dy dist$rbs *e. I t#ld this t# Mrs D ri1ht t the be1innin12 I s id2 +le se d# this. She ne?er c#$ld d# it. She did it s#*eti*es. '$t y#$ *$st h ?e ti*e t# st$dy2 t# listen2 ll th t2 bs#rb2 bs#rb2 s# th t it is in y#$r bl##d. S"0 Yes. K0 It is li=e re lly h ?in1 l< ys E y#$ %#ll#<AQ * r?ell#$s set #% +e rls. Y#$ +$t the* r#$nd y#$r nec= b$t y#$ re +ers#n re ds

S"0 C n y#$ s y2 c n y#$ describe *#re cl#sely Krishn 7i2 <ith#$t *et +h#r2 <hen s#*ethin1 e4tr #rdin ry2 h#< d# they h#ld th tA

K0 Sir2 y#$ d#nBt h#ld it. The *#*ent y#$ h ?e re d th t nd y#$ see the tr$th #% it2 it is y#$rs2 y#$ d#nBt h ?e t# d# it. Y#$ l##= t th#se *#$nt ins2 y#$ d#nBt h#ld it2 it is there. Unless y#$ li?e in cell. Y#$ re l< ys c#nsci#$s #% th t. Y#$ re l< ys l##=in1 t it2 <hen y#$ re < shin1 dishes2 th t... S"0 Th t is there. K0 ... th t is there. S"0 Yes K0 Kee+ it2 sir. D#nBt... l##= t... =ee+ it. D#nBt t l= ny *#re b#$t it. Kee+ it. Y#$ h ?e $nderst##d <h t it *e ns. (# int# it %#r y#$rsel%. Y#$ re 1#in1 t# t l= t# the #thers b#$t this. They re there. S# y#$ h ?e t# be ?ery cle r. I *i1ht c#*e %r#* ' rcel#n nd s y2 l##= Mr "#rbes2 Mr Sc#tt2 <h t d# y#$ thin= b#$t ll thisA @here d# y#$ st ndA I <#$ld li=e t# disc$ss <ith y#$2 <h t he *e ns by *edit ti#n2 <h t he *e ns by E y#$ =n#< ll the rest #% it. I <#$ld li=e t# disc$ss <ith s#*eb#dy. And y#$ *$st *eet *e. Y#$ re 1#in1 t# h ?e d *n h rd ti*e sirL S"0 Yes2 I =n#< sir. K0 S# itBs ll ri1ht2 rchitects2 y#$ %#ll#< E th t h s t# be d#ne. The b$ildin1 *$st be *#st be $ti%$l2 /9

$stere2 the *#*ent y#$ c#*e there y#$ s y2 *y 1#d. Ri1htA It is 1#in1 t# be <%$lly di%%ic$lt sir t# =ee+ #$t the #ld l dies2 #ld +e#+le <h# < nt s#*eb#dy t# +r#tect the*2 s#*eb#dy in +l ce th t is D$iet. Y#$ %#ll#<A 3##r +e#+le. I * n#t bein1 1 inst the*. They < nt s#*ethin1 #% this =ind nd y#$ c#$ld %ill th t +l ce the d y %ter t#*#rr#<. S# y#$ h ?e tre*end#$s res+#nsibility. D#nBt *ini*iGe it. And d#nBt be %ri1htened. Y#$ %#ll#<A Y#$ h ?e 1#t t# d# it. Y#$ le rnt2 <h t d# y#$ c ll it2 th t t +e b$siness. S"0 Yes2 th t < s e sy by c#*+ ris#n. K0 It is n#t. It is n#t e sy. Th t is n#t e sy. This is s di%%ic$lt s th t i% y#$ 1# int# it. Y#$ <ent int# th t. S"0 Yes. Here Krishn 7i <e re t l=in1 b#$t the s cred2 cre tin1 s#*ethin1 #% the s cred. K0 It <ill c#*e. It <ill c#*e. Y#$ c nBt 7$st +$t #$t y#$r h nd nd < it. S"0 N#. K0 It c#*es <hen y#$ ++ly. MI0 M y I s+e =A As y#$ <#$ld h ?e *$sic2 <#$ld y#$ ls# ll#< s y b##=s #% +#etry. Y#$ see +e#+le c nBt2 s y#$ +#inted #$t y#$rsel%2 st$dy *#re th n s# * ny h#$rs d y. K0 3r#b bly n h#$r2 #r h l% n h#$r. MI0 M ybe. And y#$ need s#*ethin1 t# t$rn t#2 th t < shes < y % ti1$e. K0 Oh2 the +#et Ke ts2 h ?e s#*e b##=s #% +#e*s. I c n re d. Th t is *in#r. MI0 '$t I *e n #ther b##=s2 n#t detecti?e st#ries2 #b?i#$sly2 b$t s#*ethin1. K0 Yes2 yes2 Sh =es+e re2 Ke ts. S"0 Yes2 I *e n t# c#*e b c= t# this2 I * s#rry. K0 (er rd ... <h t is his n *eA (er rd ... MI0 (er rdA S"0 (er ld D$rrellA MI0 N#2 n#2 the +#et. K0 H#+=ins. MI0 (er rd M nley H#+=ins. K0 "rench2 y#$ =n#<.

/8

S"0 Yes. K0 (##d 1ener l +#ets2 * r?ell#$s. S#*e #% th#se. T# *e %ter re din12 listenin12 t l=in12 disc$ssin1 nd es+eci lly <hen I * listenin1 t# th t * n2 the < y he s ys it2 is this ri1ht2 I * disc$ssin1. At the end #% n h#$r2 I c nBt d# *#re th n th t +r#b bly2 #r h l% n h#$r2 nd I s y <h t * I 1#in1 t# d#A Ri1htA "#r the rest #% the d y2 I c nBt 1# t# the libr ry nd re d nd re d. S"0 This is <hy I < s s yin12 Krishn 7i2 y#$ s id th t e?en th#$1h y#$ +$t the < tch in y#$r +#c=et y#$ c n still =ind #% %eel it. S# th tBs 7$st it. Anythin1 th t ll#<s #ne t# c#ntin$e =ind #% %eelin1 it is %ine. S# little bit #% 1 rdenin12 little bit #% re din1 +#etry. @h te?er it is it d#esnBt * =e ny di%%erence s l#n1 s #ne c n =ee+ he rin1 this < tch. K0 And I <#$ld < nt t# he r *$sic in the e?enin1. @h t I < nt2 n#t y#$ #r s#*eb#dy else < nts2 I < nt *$sic <hich I li=e t# listen t#. I% y#$ c#$ld cre te it li=e th t it <#$ld be * r?ell#$s thin1. I ss$re y#$ i% it is there +e#+le <ill c#*e2 7$st t# be ne rby. ItBs li=e n ncient te*+le2 y#$ =n#< <h t I *e n2 I <#$ld 7$st 1# ne r it. )i=e 1#in1 t# Ch tres2 it is s+#iled by ?isit#rs. There is le?el entr nce2 there re n# ste+s2 nd y#$ see it li=e this E nd there re h$ndreds #% the*2 n#b#dy cle ns it nd they 7$st < l= in <ith their %#$l s*ellin1 bre th nd < l= r#$nd. And <here <ill <e 1et the *#ney %#r ll thisA S"0 @e h ?e the *#ney %#r this n#<2 Krishn 7i. @ell <e c nBt %it this in the b$d1et2 this s+eci l r##*. And the *#ney is c#*in1 in 1r d$ l d#ses. MI0 @e sh#$ld be%#re <e ll 1# b c= t# 'r#c=<##d2 tent ti?ely thin= <here this r##* sh#$ld be bec $se Sc#tt <ill be t l=in1 t# the rchitect2 nd he <ill < nt t# =n#<. @e sh#$ld settle it. S"0 N#2 t#*#rr#<2 #r t#ni1ht <hen I 1et b c=2 i% I c n2 I h ?e lre dy * de s#*e dr <in1s2 nd I h ?e thr#<n the* in the < ste + +er b s=et2 <hen y#$ <ere 1ettin1 dressed %#r l$nch. I h ?e s#*e ide s h#< it c n %it in2 IBll dr < $+ s#*e +r#+#s ls nd IBll brin1 the* b c=2 #r IBll send the* t# y#$2 nd y#$ c n t =e l##= t the*. And letBs try nd 1et s#*e r#$1h ide s #% <h t <e c n d# be%#re I see the rchitect. MI0 M y I s= D$esti#n b#$t the r##* <hich h s n# <ind#<A K0 I * D$esti#nin1 th t. MI0 M y I * =e #nly see the s=y. s$11esti#n <hich y#$ c n thr#< #$t. S#*e s#rt #% s=yli1ht2 #ne <here y#$ c n

K0 Yes2 th tBs 1##d ide . S"0 I% I c n 7$st +$t in <#rd #ther<ise0 <hen I * l##=in1 #$t t distr ct *e %r#* he rin1 the < tch. K0 >$ite ri1ht2 sir. S"0 S# i% there is be $ti%$l ?ie<2 i% there is be $ti%$l <ind#< nd be $ti%$l ?ie<2 th t d#es n#t detr ct t ll %r#* the #ther2 nd in % ct I e?en thin= it hel+s bec $se #% the be $ty #% th t. ?ie< li=e th t2 it d#es n#t

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K0 '$t there is n#t 1re t be $ty there. S"0 Oh2 there is. There is 1re t be $ty there. K0 N#t li=e this. S"0 It is n#t li=e this2 b$t there is 1re t be $ty. K. J$st *in$te2 sir2 it < s M ri Bs s$11esti#n2 s=yli1ht2 s$n c#*in1 in. MI0 And y#$ <#$ld see s=y nd cl#$ds nd li1ht. There is s#*ethin1 b#$t r##* th t... K0 .. .is t## #++ressi?e. MI0 Y#$ < nt s#*e sense #% the $ni?erse nd n t$re. S"0 Yes2 th tBs <hy I <#$ld h ?e <ind#<. Th t *i1ht 7$st be *e b$t... K0 J$st see sir2 I c nBt see ny hills. S"0 'ec $se #% the be $ty #% it. K0 I *i1ht li=e t# 1# in the e?enin1 in the d r=ness2 the s$nli1ht2 I <#$ld sit there nd l##= t the s=y. MI0 The be $ty #% *##nli1ht. S"0 @#nder%$l. K0 @e *$st try t# c#*bine it0 #ne #r t<# <ind#<s2 n#t t## * ny2 then it distr cts2 #ne #r t<# <ind#<s nd s=yli1ht. MI0 Als# n#t s# th t it is s# bl Gin12 blindin12 i% the s$n c#*es in t## *$ch2 it <#$ld be $nend$r ble. 3erh +s the rchitects <ill c#*e $+ <ith s$11esti#ns. K0 Th tBs en#$1h %#r t#d y. They sh#$ld t =e #%% their sh#es be%#re they 1# in there. I h#+e they <ill h ?e cle n s#c=s. MI0 @ell <e c#$ld +r#?ide the* <ith li=e y#$ h ?e #n er#+l nes. S"0 I < s thin=in1 #% little er#+l ne sli++ers E t le st #n the +rete4t th t +e#+leBs %eet *i1ht 1et c#ld #r s#*ethin1. K0 , d#nBt < nt t# <e r #ther +e#+leBs sh#es. , <#$ld <e r *y s#c=s2 they re D$ite cle n. ItBs li=e 1#in1 int# *#sD$e2 they 1i?e y#$ sli++ers. MI0 M#sD$es re in h#t c#$ntries2 Krishn 7i. K0 And I <#$ld 1# int# the r##* <hen IB* cle n. /5 c#*+letely encl#sed

S"0 @#$ld y#$ h ?e the r##* b#$t this siGe2 Krishn 7iA K0 Yes. There * y be ten +e#+le in the r##*2 #r t<enty +e#+le. , <#$ld h ?e this siGe2 <#$ld y#$A MI0 I thin= i% there <ere t<enty +e#+le I <#$ldnBt 1# in. K0 I li=e 1#in1 in2 <hy sh#$ldnBt IA MI0 , didnBt s y B#thersB2 b$t t<enty is n <%$l l#t #% +e#+le in #ne r##*. S"0 This r##* is b#$t : *etres by . *etres. K0 Y#$ see t Tr#1#c# there <ere b#$t #?er t<enty +e#+le there2 *#re. "#rty. @e ll <ere there. MI0 '$t th t < s #r1 niGed. At se?en #Bcl#c= e?eryb#dy <ent. K0 Yes2 #% c#$rse. Th t < s re lly be $ti%$l r##*. S"0 Y#$ <ere <#nderin1 <h t c#l#$r it <#$ld be. K0 @hite2 I * n#t s$re. @#$ldnBt it be <%$lly nice2 b$t it <#$ld be tre*end#$sly e4+ensi?e2 <##d + nels. Ri1htA The ri1ht =ind #% <##d. S"0 S#*ethin1 li=e beech <##d2 <hich is ?ery li1ht. K0 , <#$ld li=e t# l##= t it2 th t 1i?es E y#$ =n#<. @##d is * r?ell#$s i% it is +r#+erly ... MI0 Es+eci lly i% th t < s the #nly r##* in the h#$se th t h d th t. K0 Yes. MI0 The #ther r##*s <#$ld be +l ster <ith be *s. '$t th t r##* <#$ld be $niD$e2 di%%erent %r#* ll the rest. K0 'e $ti%$l <##d2 y#$ =n#<. S"0 , < s l##=in1 t h#< this < s * deH this is e sy t# d#. '$t this =ind #% c#nstr$cti#n2 this l ttice <#r= #n the %l t b c=1r#$nd2 it is ?ery e sy t# d#. K0 I <#$ldnBt h ?e it li=e this. S"0 Yes2 <e c n * =e it nicer b$t it c n be t le st th t. K0 This c#l#$r y#$ *e nA S"0 N#2 n# n#t th t c#l#$r2 7$st th t =ind #% <#r=. K0 N#2 t## br#=en $+. @e c n t l= b#$t it. N# %ili1rees. Y#$ =n#< the #ld En1lish h#$ses <hen I $sed t# li?e in th#se h#$ses2 * r?ell#$s #ld % *ily h#$se. @e <ill t l= b#$t it. I thin= th t is /.

1##d ide 2 <##d. Sh#$ld be % irly d r= <##d2 ri1htA S"0 Y#$ <#$ld h ?e it d r=A K0 D r=2 n#t t## li1ht2 n#t t##... I <#$ld h ?e it2 y#$ =n#<2 bec $se y#$ < nt <hen y#$ sh$t y#$r eyes nd be D$iet y#$ < nt e?erythin12 y#$ =n#<. !In $dible interch n1e& K0 Sir2 y#$ =n#< the %#rest2 y#$ 1# r#$nd ?ery sh r+ c#rner2 the 3 l ce behind y#$2 y#$ 1# d#<n ?ery sh r+ t$rn nd then y#$ c#*e t# ch let. Y#$ 1# l#n12 there is sh r+ t$rn2 there is h#$se here <here they re b$ildin1 E I $sed t# 1# there ?ery #%ten E he < s It li n. @##d %r#* A%ric 2 di%%erent + rts #% the <#rld. MI0 Cert in Sc ndin ?i n <##d. S"0 I c n e sily 1et s *+les #% di%%erent =inds #% <##ds. It is <#nder%$l2 there is s#*ethin1 li=e beech nd there is +e r2 thereBs sh nd thereBs +#+l rs2 thereBs ll di%%erent =inds #% c#l#$rs nd 1r ins. K0 It *$st ll be #ne +iece2 n#t br#=en $+. MI0 @ell2 it c nBt be #ne +iece. K0 N#2 #% the s *e <##d I *e n. S"0 Oh2 yes. !In $dible interch n1e& MI0 And the %eelin1 %#r <##d in J + nese h#$se. S"0 Yes. K0 M ri 2 7$st l##=2 in th t r##*2 <#$ld y#$ h ?e in the centre t ble nd %l#<ersA MI0 @ell2 th tBs <h t I h d in *ind e rlier. K0 I * thin=in1. J$st b$nch #% %l#<ers. MI0 I li=e t# h ?e s#*ethin1 #% n t$re. K0 @eBll t l= b#$t this. MI0 And i% y#$ li1ht it t ll2 it sh#$ld be + nel li1hts. K0 Yes. N#< th t y#$ *enti#n it2 t Ady r they h d c#++er2 be $ti%$l. Ab#$t t<el?e <ic=s2 s+eci l 1r#$+s2 nd y#$ +$t #il in th t nd <ic=s2 t<el?e #r thirty2 I h ?e %#r1#tten2 it *$st be the ri1ht n$*ber. And the #il < s sli1htly scented2 #ther<ise the s*ell #% the #il b$rnin1 E y#$ %#ll#<A I $sed t# h ?e s$ch l *+ in *y r##*2 I <#nder <h t h s h ++ened t# it. /C

S"0 S#$nds l#?ely. K0 3erh +s ... sh ll <e 1et #neA S"0 @hy d#nBt y#$ s= R dh i% it is still t Ady rA K0 I <ill s=. (# int# the entr nce2 h ?e it by the side. S"0 I <#$ld s= R dh i% it is still there. Krishn 7i. MI0 N#t in his r##*. S"0 N#2 itMs n#t there b$t it *i1ht be s#*e<here else. MI0 @h t =ind #% #il d# y#$ b$rn in itA K0 D#nBt s= *e. S"0 @e <ill h ?e t# 1et s#*ethin1 th t d#esnBt s*#=e2 <e c n d# th t. K0 S#*e scents in it #ther<ise the <ic= b$rns <ith s*ell2 y#$ see. '$t <e <ill t l= b#$t th t. Th tBs nice ide 2 h ?in1 s#*ethin12 c ndle2 #r2 y#$ =n#<. S"0 S$bd$ed. K0 S$bd$ed li1ht. S"0 At C stle Eerde2 Krishn 7i2 #ne ni1ht <e h d disc$ssi#n in the dinin1 r##* <ith #nly c ndles2 it < s be $ti%$l. 'e $ti%$l in there. K0 D#nMt b#ther2 <e <ill h ?e ll th t. !)#n1 1 +& S"0 I < nted be%#re y#$ <ent t# Indi this ti*e2 Krishn 7i2 I < nted $s t# be s# % r l#n1 th t <e c#$ld t le st di1 #ne %#$nd ti#n h#le nd h ?e y#$ +$t d#<n #ne %#$nd ti#n st#ne be%#re y#$ 1# #%% t# Indi . K0 @h tA MI0 3erh +s y#$ c#$ld d# 7$st li=e +l ntin1 tree #r ... S"0 Yes. K0 Y#$ see2 they <#$ld ll sit #n the %l##r .. Ri1htA Y#$ *$st h ?e % irly s#%t %l##r. S"0 Yes. K0 N#t h rd ce*ent %l##r. //

S"0 S#*ethin1. MI0 Te nd bisc$its.

S"0 Y#$ c n h ?e2 y#$ =n#<2 little c =es. K0 C$c$*ber nd < tercressL MI0 The ide #% En1lish te s s *e l 1#es <ith ... K0 Yes. MI0 It * =es cert in... S"0 An ele1 nce. MI0 @ell2 n#2 n#t ele1 nce2 cert in... K0 (r ce. MI0 A cert in c#$ntry ... K0 J$st *in$te2 st#+ it. @eBll h ?e te . @h t ti*e is itA IBd li=e t# 1# %#r < l=.

JA c#n?ers ti#n bet<een ,. Krishn *$rti2 Sc#tt "#rbes2 M ry Ii*b list nd "riedrich (r#he b#$t the st$dy. Sch#nreid2 S<itGerl nd2 Cth A$1$st ,-/: Tr nscribed nd chec=ed by J ne H **#nd2 9/.6C.-5K

/-

What -a*es a .#a$e Re#igious?

!be1ins br$+tly& K0 .... the #rth#d#4 nd ll th t n#nsense2 b$t b#dy <h# is c#ncerned <ith KBs te chin1 E they re tryin1 t# li?e it nd cre te this int# reli1i#$s !D$#te Breli1i#$sB& centre. I *e n by reli1i#$s centre... I <r#te $+ s#*ethin1. @#$ld y#$ li=e s#*eb#dy t# re d itA Y#$ re d it l#$d. They re brie% n#tesH IBll e4+l in e?erythin1 th t is <ritten there. They re 7$st sh#rt n#tes. 30 !re din1& A reli1i#$s ... br in h s n# shelter. It is n#t sc tteredH it is $nsh c=led. It h s n# sched$le. It is n#nEc#*+ r ti?e2 $tterly %ree %r#* ll rit$ l2 d#1* 2 % ith .. It is <h#lly %ree in inde+endence .... K0 In its #<n inde+endence. And I <#$ld li=e t# dd t# th t2 it is th t D$ lity #% l#?e nd c#*+ ssi#n <hich h s intelli1ence. ItBs th tH th t c#*+letes it. N#<2 IBll e4+l in <h t I *e n by th t0 I s id the reli1i#$s br in h s n# shelter. Y#$ =n#< <h t th t *e ns E n# shelter. It d#esnBt t =e re%$1e behind ny e4c$se2 behind ny 7$d1e*ent.. it h s n# shelter in itsel%. I <#nder i% y#$ $nderst nd <h t IB* t l=in1 b#$t0 @e h ?e shelters in #$r br in2 <hich is s#*e =ind #% ill$si#n2 s#*e =ind #% e4c$se2 #r s#*e belie% behind <hich <e l$r=2 hide E it * y be ? nity2 * y be h$rt2 it * y be s#*e =ind #% c#ncl$si#n2 nd s# #n. '$t the reli1i#$s br in h s c#*+letely n# shelter2 <hich is n e4tr #rdin ry thin1 i% y#$ ll 1# int# it. Ri1htA N#<2 sec#nd it is n#t sc ttered. Th t d#esnBt need e4+l inin1 ?ery *$ch bec $se *#st #% #$r br ins re sc ttered ll #?er the +l ce E either senti*ent2 senti*ent lity2 r#* nticis*2 #r s#*e =ind #% e*#ti#n l #$tb$rst. Y#$ %#ll#<A It is n#t e?er sc ttered. And it is $nsh c=led. Y#$ =n#< the <#rd Bsh c=ledB *e ns t# be tt ched t# s#*ethin1. 3le se2 this is seri#$sH this is n#t s#*ethin1 y#$ 1ree #r dis 1ree. )##= t it. It is n#t sh c=led t# nythin12 t# ny tt ch*ent2 t# ny +ers#n l e4+erience2 t# #neBs #<n belie%s E y#$ =n#< ll th t. It is c#*+letely $nsh c=led. And ls#2 it d#esnBt %$ncti#n #n sched$le2 #n r$les ... it is $stere. Y#$ $nderst nd2 the <#rd there E Fsched$leFA It *e ns2 FIBll % st t# be ... t# h ?e e4+erience.F FIBll 1i?e $+ the <#rldF. Th tBs ll %#r* #% sched$le2 y#$ $nderst nd re1i*e E <hich *e ns ls# br in th t is $stere. N#< the <#rd B $stereB c#*es %r#* (ree=2 <hich *e ns B dry *#$thB2 y#$ $nderst ndA A$sterity in (ree=2 the #ri1in #%2 ety*#l#1ic l *e nin1 #%2 th t <#rd B $stereB c#*es %r#* the (ree=2 <hich *e ns Bh ?in1 dry *#$thB. "r#* th t E shes2 h rd2 r#$1h .... Y#$ $nderst nd <h t IB* s yin1A Ri1ht SirA And sense #% h rshness. S# it is n#t sched$led t ll. I <#nder i% I c +t$re llE d#esnBt * tter2 IBll le ?e this. And ls#2 #% c#$rse2 it is essenti lly n#nEc#*+ r ti?e. Th t is2 it d#esnBt c#*+ re E IB* better th n this... It h s n# sense #% c#*+ ris#n. It d#esnBt 1et better #r *#re2 y#$ $nderst nd2 <hich is ll c#*+ r ti?e2 c#*+ rin1 #nesel% <ith <h t sh#$ld be nd s# #n2 ri1htA O% c#$rse2 th tBs #b?i#$s2 rit$ ls2 d#1* s2 % ith nd ll th t b$siness is c#*+letely #$t #% it. And ls# sense #% t#t l %reed#*0 The <#rd B%reed#*B ls#2 the #ri1in #% th t <#rd2 h s the *e nin1 #% l#?e2 ri1ht2 c#*+ ssi#nH nd <here there is l#?e2 c#*+ ssi#n2 there is re l intelli1ence. This is -6

reli1i#$s *ind2 s I c#nsider it. Y#$ * y s y th tBs n#nsense. Y#$Bre D$ite ri1htH s# disc$ss it. This is entirely di%%erent %r#* ny ide #% reli1i#n. There is n# %#ll#<in1H there is n# $th#rityH there is ... sense #% t#t l inte1rity. This is <h t <e disc$ssed E n#t this2 b$t <h t <e s id is reli1i#$s *ind2 b#dy. And th#se %i?e s id2 F@eBll <#r= t itF. And t# be1in <ith2 st rt <ith h ?in1 in this r##* E <h t d# y#$ c ll these thin1s E t +es2 nd ll the rest #% it. They 1reed t# th t E h2 n#t B 1reedB they s < it is i*+#rt nt2 there%#re they s id2 F@eBll d# itF. And then2 %r#* th t r#se E sh#$ld <e h ?e the centre here t ll2 here2 in this c#*+#$nd2 in this c *+$sA Or cr#ss the ri?er nd 1# t# the s$nset... y#$ =n#< <here th t isA Y#$ =n#< <here the rch e#l#1ists d$12 #?erl##=in1 the +l yin1 %ield2 nd the ; r$n c#*in1 d#<n ... y#$ c n see the ( n1 t## %r#* there. E?ent$ lly2 s thin1s *#?e2 IB* n#t s yin1 E h ?e the <h#le thin1 *#?ed there E n#t the sch##l2 b$t this. @eBd li=e t# h ?e #ne li=e the reli1i#$s 1r#$+H +le se d#nBt *is$nderst nd <h t I *e n by Breli1i#$s 1r#$+BH ri1htA N#thin1 t# d# <ith sect ri n ... th t h#rr#r. In Rishi ; lley nd ; s nt ;ih r. FAdi Sh n= r <ent r#$nd2 ll #?er Indi . IBll be the l test Adi Sh n= r 2 ;ishn$2 3 r * t* ... F E n#t ll th t ... H b$t <eBll h ?e t# h ?e +l ces2 ri1htA D# y#$2 s the ?iceE+resident E IB* s=in1 y#$2 seri#$sly2 nd <hich <eBll ll disc$ss E d# <e < nt this =ind #% thin1A @ith#$t * =in1 it int# shrine2 ll th t $1ly b$siness2 +riests2 the <h#le set $+. @e * y be1in <ith this ... h#nestly2 <ith 1re t sense #% h$*ility b#$t this2 s#*e cr##= <ill 1et it2 nd st rt *essin1 it $+. Y#$ $nderst nd <h t IB* s yin1A Is it ri1ht t# h ?e s$ch thin1 t llA 'ec $se IB* D$esti#nin1 <h t <e ... y#$ $nderst nd sirA Is it ri1ht t# h ?e s$ch thin1A There <ill be * ny #b7ecti#ns t# it2 th t it <ill bec#*e n#ther te*+le2 nd y#$ <ill be the +riests2 y#$ <ill be the $th#rity <h# =n#<2 nd there%#re the #thers d#nBt =n#<. S# 1r d$ lly y#$ b$ild $+ BKBs s+irit$ l hier rchyB. And it <ill bec#*e +il1ri* 1e. I li=e the <#rd +il1ri* 1e2 th tBs di%%erent * tter. The +il1ri* E B +il1ri*B *e ns * n <h# is 1#in12 se rchin1 %#r tr$th2 *#?in12 n#t t# s+eci l +l ce. @h t d# y#$ s y t# thisA @h tBs y#$r #b7ecti#nA 30 Sir2 the #nly <#rds2 I d#nBt thin= y#$ c n c ll it rit$ l2 b$t I t#$ch y#$r %eet %#r th#se <#rds. !K0 @h tA& th#se <#rds. !K0 D rlin1 3$+$l2 <h t re y#$ t l=in1 b#$tA& )isten2 sir2 IBll s= y#$ t# listen. !K0 IBll listen ... & ThereBs #nly #ne thin1 I < nt t# s=2 sir. !K0 @h t is itA& )et *e +$t it int#... I *e n n# #ne <h# <#$ld ... y#$ c#$ld #nly t =e %r#*... !K0 @h t re y#$ tryin1 t# s yA& N# sir2 there is s#*ethin1 IB* tryin1 t# s y. The +#tenti l #% the *ind t# ... t# cre te this int# the ide l nd there%#re destr#y it. K0 Ah n#2 itBs n#t n ide l. 30 @h t is the b sic c#ncern #% %i?e +e#+le #r ten +e#+le #r %i?e +e#+le in Rishi ; lley #r %i?e +e#+le hereA IB* n#t t l=in1 b#$t ny indi?id$ l 1r#$+. !K0 n#2 n#2 n#2 *#?e.& @h t is the b sic c#ncern #% s#*e#ne <h# < nts t# enter th t se A @h# < nts t# enter the se #% th t2 the se 2 the #ce n. !K0 Yes int# th t stre *.& @h t is the b sic c#ncernA @h t h s t# be the b sic c#ncernA !K0 Th tBs cle rH IBll tell y#$.& N#2 this is <here the 1 + rises. !K0 N#2 l##=2 l##=2 y#$Bre *#?in1 < y %r#* ... & N#2 sir2 IB* n#t *#?in1 < y bec $se y#$ * y h ?e $sed these <#rds t#d y. !K0 @eBll ch n1e the* t#*#rr#<.& Y#$ * y h ?e $sed #ther <#rds l st ye r. !K0 I <ill. I <ill.& And y#$ * y h ?e $sed n#ther <#rd %i?e ye rs 1#. !K0 Yes.& '$t it h s n#t h ++ened. !K0 @hyA& IB* 7$st tryin1 t# 1et t# th t bec $se the b sic c#ncerns h ?e t# be $nderst##d. @h t is the b sic c#ncern #% e?ery -,

h$* n bein1 <h# c#*es int# thisA !K0 As= the*. As= the*.& T# te chA !K0 J$st l##= t it..& N#2 let *e s= y#$ s#*e D$esti#ns. Is the b sic c#ncern t# te chA K0 N#2 the b sic c#ncern is t# le rn nd there%#re in le rnin1 y#$ bec#*e the te cher. 30 In le rnin1 y#$ c#**$nic te. K0 Y#$ c#**$nic teH. y#$ re b#th the disci+le nd the te cher. 30 '$t the b sic c#ncern is t# le rn. !K0 Yes.& nd n#t t# te ch2 n#t t# st rt <ith the ... K0 Underst##d2 the b sic c#ncern is t# le rn. !30 In le rnin1 ... & @ it c#rrect th t E le rnin12 ri1htA I d#nBt thin= there is nythin1 t# le rn. *in$te2 I <#$ld li=e t#

30 Y#$ see2 y#$ +$t #$t this =ind #% Ien st te*ent2 then <e *i1ht s <ell ... N# sir. K0 N#2 n#2 n#2 itBs n#t Ien st te*ent. )isten t# it c re%$lly. 30 N#2 sir2 i% y#$ re in the se 2 there is n#thin1 t# le rn. K0 N#2 n#2 n#2 ri1ht %r#* the be1innin1. 30 Then <h t d# y#$ d#A Y#$ 7$st tell *e2 !K0 IBll tell y#$.& @h t d#es n indi?id$ l d#A K0 "irst #% ll2 heBs ... this bec#*es ... All ri1ht E His br in is c#nditi#ned t# le rn nd t# *e*#riGe. @ it2 < it2 1# sl#<ly. Me*#riGin1 E th t is *#st destr$cti?e t# the br in. And there is le rnin1 <hich the ri?er E *#?in12 *#?in12 *#?in12 *#?in1H ri1htA Ne?er cc$*$l tin12 ne?er sedi*ent2 ne?er le ?in1 s#*ethin1 #n the b n=. ItBs *#?in12 ri1htA N#<2 <hen itBs *#?in1 there is n#thin1 t# le rn. 30 H#< d#es this *#?in1 h ++enA K0 It h ++ens <hen y#$ see the tr$th th t *ere *e*#riGin1 is destr$cti?e ele*ent t# the br in2 destr$cti?e % ct#r t# the br in. Y#$ see the % ct #% th t2 nd then y#$ be1in the #ther. ItBs n#t E this is #$r +r#ble* E itBs n#t ti*e D$ lity. I see the br in <hich h s 1#t * Gin1 c + city. @hen it is *erely *e*#riGin12 it bec#*es *ech nic l. Th t is % ct. I see th t. And <hen y#$ re lly see th t y#$B?e lre dy entered int# the stre * #% le rnin12 *#?in12 *#?in1. Ri1htA Th tBs ll. !30 Th tBs <hy I < nted t# e4+l#re int# it.& Yes2 yes2 s#2 s y#$ re *#?in12 thereBs n#thin1 E itBs li=e ri?erH it d#esnBt le rn2 itBs *#?in1. ItBs still < ter. I d#nBt... ... !30 Yes2 sir2 I $nderst nd&. Sir2 d# y#$ $nderst nd <h t IB* ... Sir2 disc$ss this. S# E 7$st *in$te E is this ri1ht #r <r#n1A Ri1ht2 in the sense2 ri1ht $nder ll circ$*st nces. @hether itBs in 'en res2 <hether in M dr s2 nd s# #n2 <hether itBs 'r#c=<##d #r O7 i2 is this the ri1ht thin1 t# d#A @e h ?e c de*ics #n #ne side2 nd <e re e*+h sisin1 th t t the ti*e. @e re ne1lectin1 the #ther side c#*+letely2 ri1htA !30 N#2 sir2 i% I * y s y ... & @ it2 < it2 let *e %inishH let *e %inish. '$t2 s it is 1#in1 #n n#< E % ctsH IB?e t l=ed t# the st$dentsH they =n#< n#thin1 #% the #ther side. It is n#t th t R 71h t is c#ncerned c#*+letely2 n#t #nly <ith the c de*ics2 b$t % r 1re ter thin12 <hich is the #ther. )i=e Rishi ; lley2 M dr s2 itBs ll bec#*in1 +r#%essi#n l. "#r *e2 the #ther thin1 is % r *#re i*+#rt nt th n the c de*ics. '$t e?en i% y#$ s y th t then the + rents <#nBt let their children2 <e s te chers re c#ncerned <ith b#th.

-9

30 IB* n#t... it is s#2 b$t let *e +$t #ne thin1 t# y#$. @e h ?e been t l=in1 E y#$ h ?e been t l=in1 in the s *e stre *2 in the s *e < y. !K0 Yes2 yes.& Y#$ h ?e been t l=in1 b#$t this. @e h ?e h d +e#+le <h# h ?e c#ncerned the*sel?es <ith #nly the te chin1s2 yet this d#es n#t h ++en. !K0 I =n#<2 I =n#< this ?ery <ell&. S# <h t is it2 th t in their c#ncern %#r the te chin12 is c#*in1 in the < y #% this n#t h ++enin1A Y#$ see2 they re c#ncerned <ith the te chin1H they re n#t c#ncerned <ith the c de*icsH yet this s#*ethin1 <hich is ... K0 @hy d#esnBt it2 y#$Bre s=in12 <hy d#esnBt it h ++enA 30 N#2 <h t is the ... * ybe there is <r#n1 t$rnin1 in the *ind2 * ybe <hen they he r y#$r <#rds2 they l##= t# see the* in directi#n <here there is bl#c= 1e. K0 I d#nBt D$ite $nderst nd <h t y#$Bre s yin12 s#rry. 30 Y#$B?e been t l=in1 #% this %#r b#$t ten #r %i%teen ye rs2 !K0 H$hA Si4ty ye rs.& es+eci lly this2 #% the c de*ic nd the #ther. There re %e< +e#+le <h# re c#ncerned #nly <ith the #therH theyB?e t l=ed b#$t it. !K0 @ it2 < it2 I 1ree. I =n#< th t.& Yet2 th t #ther d#es n#t c#*e in e4cl$si?e. It d#es n#t bec#*e this. !K0 @h tA& ItBs n#t this. !K0 ItBs n#t this2 n#.& @h t is the bl#c= 1eA K0 Y#$ $nderst nd th t D$esti#nA @h t is the bl#c= 1eA Sirs nd l dies2 <hy d#esnBt it t =e +l ceA >0 It see*s t# *e2 3$+$l7i2 <e l< ys brin1 the #ther int# this %ield #% =n#<led1e nd ti*e. K0 N#2 n#2 n#2 n#2 y#$Bre *issin1 ... < it2 let *eH y#$Bre *issin1 the <h#le D$esti#n. K h s t l=ed %#r si4ty ye rs. 'e c re%$l2 IB* 1#in1 t# 1# int# it ?ery c re%$lly E si4ty ye rs2 nd this thin1 h snBt t =en +l ce. This !sh =es + +er& E n#t the <#rds2 b$t this c#ntent #% th t <#rd h snBt t =en +l ce2 nd sheBs s=in12 <hy2 %ter si4ty ye rs2 this h s n#t h ++enedA D#nBt brin1 in ti*e nd ll th t. >0 IB* s yin12 <hy is this n#t h ++enin1. !K0 Yes.& This + rtic$l r bl#c= 1e %#r *e is #?erH this + rtic$l r bl#c= 1eH IB* s yin1 ... 30 N#2 n#2 itBs n# $se s yin12 #ne bl#c= 1e is #?er2 n#ther bl#c= 1e rises. The % ct is th t this h s n#t h ++ened2 nd there re +e#+le <h# re here n#t %#r the c de*ics2 b$t %#r this. !K0 I =n#< this 3$+$lH IB* s=in1 y#$.& @h t is itA @h t is itA >0 Only2 #ne h s n#t $nderst##d +r#b bly2 <here it is t# h ++en. K0 Sir2 h ?e y#$ $nderst##d the D$esti#nA C re%$l2 sir2 $nderst nd the D$esti#n %irst. K #r N h s t l=ed %#r si4ty ye rs b#$t this2 nd there re +e#+le <h# s y <e re terribly interestedH <e re <#r=in12 <#r=in1. '$t the ct$ lity #% this !sh =es + +er& d#esnBt t =e +l ce. The ct$ lity2 li=e the *icr#+h#ne2 d#esnBt t =e +l ce2 nd 3$+$l7i is s=in12 <h tBs the bl#c= 1eA Sir2 +$t it r#$nd the #ther < y2 y#$ re d this. Y#$ c n h n1 it $+ #n the < llH +$t it $nder the +ill#<H re+e t it $*+teen ti*es. '$t the re l ct$ lity2 t =in1 +l ce in the br in2 #% this is n#t h ++enin1. I% y#$ re d th t E Sir2 t =e it E Sir2 t =e it E is it h ++enin1 t# y#$A Th tBs <h t sheBs s=in12 th t y#$ ct$ lly re th t. Then her D$esti#n <#$ld be2 i% y#$ re th t2 y#$ <#$ld d# s#*ethin1 #r n#t d#. Y#$ %#ll#<A Y#$ h ?e d#ne it. Then <here?er y#$ re2 th t <#$ld be the reli1i#$s centre. Ri1ht2 SirA A* I * =in1 *ysel% cle rA D#nBt 1ree <ith *e sir2 +le se d#nBt s y yes. See0 Are y#$ li=e th tA

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And 3$+$l 1ener#$sly s=s #r critic lly s=s #r is D$esti#nin1 hersel%2 <hy is it th t %ter si4ty ye rs... <h t the hell is <r#n1A Either the <h#le thin1 is <r#n12 K is t#t lly <r#n1H #r itBs n#t *e nt t# be th t < y. IB* re lly2 y#$ $nderst nd sir2 IB* re lly D$ite seri#$s b#$t this. @eB?e disc$ssed this t O7 i2 'r#c=<##d2 d n $se$*. S# 3$+$lBs +#int is2 i% I $nderst nd her c#rrectly2 the reli1i#$s centre is <here this is t =in1 +l ce2 nd i% y#$ %i?e re cre tin12 re li?in1 th t2 th t is the centre2 <hether y#$ ... y#$ %#ll#<A Ri1htA @e t l=ed b#$t this yesterd y. I didnBt re d it2 b$t <e t l=ed b#$t it. Unless th t is there2 <e cre te te*+le2 th tBs the end #% it. Y#$ $nderst nd2 sirA Th tBs <h t 3$+$l is tryin1 t# e4+l inH she s id the s *e thin1 t 'r#c=<##d2 *#re #r less2 in di%%erent <#rds E The +e#+le <h# re c#ncerned <ith the te chin1s E h ?e they 1#t s$ch br inA Y#$ $nderst ndA Or is it ll b c= t# 1ettin1 h$rt2 nd *y +l ce ... A Y#$ =n#< ll th t silly st$%% th t 1#es #n. S#2 I d#nBt thin= this is * tter #% de+ressi#n #r el ti#nH It is seein1 <h t is bl#c=in12 <h t is the thin1 th t is n#t #+er tin1. 30 M y I s= y#$ #ne D$esti#nA Is it ttenti#n ... D$esti#n #% Bre%ine*entB !in D$#tes& !K0 ... in the %ireA& #%

K0 Yes2 bs#l$tely2 %ire #% ttenti#n. Th tBs ri1ht2 3$+$l2 th tBs it. Y#$B?e s id it si*+ly E in the %ire #% ttenti#n. Sir2 I <#nBt let #ne th#$1ht esc +e <ith#$t $nderst ndin1 <hy it e4ists. Y#$ $nderst ndA One %eelin12 #ne senti*ent2 #ne ... s#*ethin12 I d#nBt < nt t# esc +e #ne thin12 y#$ $nderst nd2 th t *e ns < tchin1 <hich is ttenti#n. S# 3$+$l2 <e *$st c#*e b c=. These %i?e s y <e <ill tte*+t it. They d#nBt +r#*ise. They s y this is #$r dee+2 h#nest2 cle r dri?e. And <e <#nBt let nythin1 inter%ere <ith th t. They s y th t2 1# sl#<ly2 it <ill. 30 M y I s y s#*ethin12 sirA D# y#$ s y th t #r d# they s y th tA K0 They s y th t. I <#nBt... y#$ see2 t# *e ... IBll +$t it di%%erently. I% I see s#*ethin1 ri1ht2 I d# it inst ntlyH <hether itBs h bit... inst ntly itBs #?er. And I d#nBt =n#< i% they %eel th t < y2 i% they l##= t li%e th t < y... y#$ $nderst ndA Th t ny *#?e*ent... yesterd y2 they s n1 %#r n h#$r nd h l%H ri1ht2 sirA S#*ethin1 li=e th t E ch nted %#r n h#$r nd h l%. I %#$nd *ysel% sittin1 bs#l$tely still0 n# th#$1ht t# s#$r th t e4tr #rdin ry ... th t < s in the ir. And I < s < tchin1 ?ery c re%$lly the * n <h# < s sin1in12 < tchin1 their 1est$res !y#$ $nderst nd <h t IB* s yin1A& s# th t there is n# *#?e*ent <hich y#$ re n#t < re #%. N#<2 th tBs *e2 th tBs t#t lly irrele? nt. N#<2 c n <e d# thisA C n <e %i?e <h# re here2 <h# re res+#nsible %#r R 71h t2 %#r the <h#le +l ce d# thisA Res+#nsible %#r this side #% the c *+$s2 the #ther side #% the c *+$s2 %#r the b$ildin1s2 %#r the st$dents2 %#r e?ery tree2 e?ery b$sh ... they re res+#nsible. I d#nBt li=e t# $se the <#rd Bres+#nsibleBH they re + yin1 ttenti#n t# ll this. And n#t E FIn %e< *#nths <eBll be li=e th tF. N#t ll#<in1 ti*e t# inter%ere t# be th t. I <#nder i% y#$ $nderst nd it. A* I * =in1 *y ... n#t ll#<in1 ti*e2 #ne sec#nd t# + ss <ith#$t th t. Then y#$ re #$t #% ll this2 y#$ $nderst ndA S# letBs c#*e b c=. Th tBs <h t <e disc$ssed yesterd y %tern##n. And theyB?e $ndert =en t# d# this2 nd itBs $+ t# the*. The %i?e s y2 F@e re t#t lly #ne $nit2 #ne b#dy2 li=e 1re t r#c= in the -:

*iddle #% ? st ri?erF. I <ent int# ll th t. And they s < the ct$ lity2 nd they < nt t# d# th t. Ri1ht2 sirA A* I s yin1 c#rrectly <h t y#$ ... A !>0 Yes2 sir.& N#<2 they c n $se this r##* #r th t... they <ill settle ll th t. @ill y#$2 sir2 cre te s#*ethin1 * r?ell#$s hereA A%ter ll2 y#$Bre in K shi2 ri1htA Y#$ =n#<2 l st ni1ht <hen they ch nted2 <e <ent b c= t# the cent$ries #ld *ind2 th t *ind th t cre ted ll this E s#lid2 str#n1. @ell2 I <#nBt 1# int# it. T#t lly $ne*#ti#n l2 t#t lly E th t sense #% ... S#2 IB?e s id <h t IB?e t# s y2 n#< <eBll t$rn it #?er. !+$shes *icr#+h#ne& IB* 1#in1 t# t =e +il1ri* 1eH IB* 1#in1 t# R 71h t2 Rishi ; lley2 M dr s ... y#$ %#ll#<A S# #ne h s t# <#r= t this. @hen IB* in M dr s2 IB* 1#in1 t# thr sh it #$t E +il1ri* 1$est2 ri1htA Sir0 %inished.
JTr nscri+t #% t +e #% s* ll 1r#$+ disc$ssi#n <ith ,. Krishn *$rti held t R 71h t "#rt2 ; r n si2 N#?e*ber 9-th ,-/:K

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Re#igious Centre
A st te*ent dict ted by Krishn *$rti t# J n$ ry ,-/:0 Tr$stee #% the "#$nd ti#n2 t ; s nt ;ih r #n 9.E9C

It *$st l st th#$s nd ye rs2 $n+#ll$ted2 li=e ri?er th t h s the c + city t# cle nse itsel%2 <hich *e ns n# $th#rity <h ts#e?er %#r the inh bit nts. And the te chin1s in the*sel?es h ?e the $th#rity #% the Tr$th. It is +l ce %#r the %l#<erin1 #% 1##dnessH c#**$nic ti#n nd c##+er ti#n n#t b sed #n <#r=2 ide l #r +ers#n l $th#rityH b$t c##+er ti#n i*+lies n#t r#$nd s#*e s$b7ect #r +rinci+le2 belie% nd s# #n. As #ne c#*es t# the +l ce2 e ch #ne in his <#r= E <#r=in1 in the 1 rden #r d#in1 s#*ethin1 E * y disc#?er s#*ethin1 s he is <#r=in12 nd he c#**$nic tes nd h s di l#1$e <ith the #ther inh bit nts E t# be D$esti#ned2 d#$bted nd t# see the <ei1ht #% the tr$th #% his disc#?ery. S# there is c#nst nt c#**$nic ti#n nd n#t s#lit ry chie?e*ent2 s#lit ry enli1hten*ent #r $nderst ndin1. It is the res+#nsibility #% e ch #ne t# brin1 this b#$t. E ch #ne #% $s2 i% he disc#?ers s#*ethin1 b sic2 ne< E it is n#t +ers#n l b$t it is %#r ll the +e#+le <h# re there. It is n#t c#**$nity. The ?ery <#rd Bc#**$nityB #r Bc#**$neB is n 11ressi?e #r se+ r te *#?e*ent %r#* the <h#le #% h$* nity. '$t it d#es n#t *e n th t the <h#le h$* nity c#*es int# this +l ce. It is essenti lly reli1i#$s centre cc#rdin1 t# <h t K h s s id b#$t reli1i#n. It is +l ce <here #ne is n#t #nly +hysic lly cti?e2 s$st ined nd c#ntin$#$sH Jthere is ls#K *#?e*ent #% le rnin1 nd s# e ch #ne bec#*es the te cher nd the disci+le. It is n#t +l ce %#r #neBs #<n ill$*in ti#n #r #neBs #<n 1# l #% %$l%il*ent2 rtistic lly2 reli1i#$sly2 #r in ny < y2 b$t r ther J%#rK s$st inin1 e ch #ther nd n#$rishin1 e ch #ther in %l#<erin1 in 1##dness. There *$st be bs#l$te %reed#* %r#* #rth#d#4 #r tr diti#n l *#?e*entsH b$t r ther there *$st be t#t l %reed#*2 bs#l$te %reed#* %r#* ll sense #% n ti#n lities2 r ci l +re7$dices2 reli1i#$s belie%s nd % iths. I% #ne is n#t c + ble #% d#in1 this <ith h#nesty nd inte1rity2 he h d better =ee+ < y %r#* this +l ce. Essenti lly #ne h s the insi1ht t# see th t =n#<led1e is the ene*y #% * n. This is n#t +l ce %#r r#* nticists2 senti*ent lists2 #r %#r e*#ti#n. This reD$ires 1##d br in2 <hich d#es n#t *e n intellect$ l b$t r ther br in th t is #b7ecti?e2 %$nd *ent lly h#nest t# itsel% nd h s inte1rity in <#rd nd deed. A di l#1$e is ?ery i*+#rt nt. It is %#r* #% c#**$nic ti#n in <hich D$esti#n nd ns<er c#ntin$es $ntil D$esti#n is le%t <ith#$t n ns<er. Th$s the D$esti#n is s$s+ended bet<een t<# +ers#ns in?#l?ed in this ns<er nd D$esti#n. It is li=e b$d <hich $nt#$ched bl#ss#*s ... I% the D$esti#n is le%t t#t lly $nt#$ched by th#$1ht2 it then h s its #<n ns<er bec $se the D$esti#ner nd ns<erer2 s +ers#ns2 h ?e dis ++e red. This is %#r* #% di l#1$e in <hich in?esti1 ti#n re ches cert in +#int #% intensity nd de+th2 <hich then h s D$ lity <hich th#$1ht c n ne?er re ch. It is n#t di lectic l in?esti1 ti#n #% #+ini#ns2 ide s2 b$t r ther e4+l#r ti#n by t<# #r * ny seri#$s2 1##d br ins. This +l ce *$st be #% 1re t be $ty <ith trees2 birds nd D$ietness2 %#r be $ty is tr$th nd tr$th is 1##dness nd l#?e. The e4tern l be $ty2 e4tern l tr nD$ility2 silence2 * y %%ect the inner tr nD$ility2 b$t the en?ir#n*ent *$st in n# < y in%l$ence the inner be $ty. 'e $ty c n #nly be <hen the sel% is n#tH the en?ir#n*ent2 <hich *$st h ?e 1re t <#nder2 *$st in n# < y be n bs#rbin1 % ct#r2 li=e t#y is <ith child. Here2 there re n# t#ys b$t inner de+th2 s$bst nce nd inte1rity th t is n#t +$t t#1ether by th#$1ht... -.

The %irst st#ne <e l y sh#$ld be reli1i#$s.

J; s nt ;ih r Ne<sletter2 92 Krishn *$rti "#$nd ti#n Indi 2 N#?e*ber ,--5K

-C

What are those serious peop#e going to do there?

S0 Krishn 7i2 * y I s= D$esti#n #% n#t #nly %e< b$t #% #thers. There is 1#in1 t# be Centre set $+ <here seri#$s +e#+le2 re 1#in1 t# c#*e. K0 I h#+e s#. S0 @h t re th#se seri#$s +e#+le 1#in1 t# be d#in1A S0 They re 1#in1 t# be there %#r *#nth #r t<# *#nths #r three *#nths2 <h t re they 1#in1 t# be d#in1A K0 IBll tell y#$. @eB?e t l=ed b#$t it. @e h ?enBt2 t le st itBs n#t cle rly c$t nd dried yet2 <e re t l=in1 b#$t it. @e s y c#*e. I c#*e %r#* ) h#re. I c#*e %r#* R#*e letBs s y. IB* n It li n. I c#*e there. @h t * I t# d#A N#b#dy s ys t# *e0 d#nBt d# this2 d# th t. N# set +eri#d t# *edit te #r n#t t# *edit te2 ri1htA S# I c#*e there nd <h t is it.... <hy d# I c#*e there %irstA @h tBs *y intenti#nA J$st t# sit there nd 1 +e2 sit there nd s y <ell2 itBs nice +l ce2 c#n?enient2 thereBs nice b thr##*2 nice sittin1 r##*2 #r nice bedr##*2 itBs ?ery c#n?enientA Or I c#*e there t# re lly $nderst nd2 1r s+2 li?e <h t th t * n h s been s yin1. I c#*e %#r th t. I% I c#*e %#r th t there2 I * seri#$s .... I < nt t# %ind #$t. I c nBt d# this ll d y l#n1. S# I s y2 ll ri1ht2 IBll d# it %#r n h#$r bec $se I c nBt d# *#re th n th t2 ri1htA S# <h t sh ll I d# the rest #% the d yA ThereBs sch##l2 there is 1 rden2 thereBs =itchen 1 rden2 thereBs ... +l ntin1 trees2 s# IBll see i% I c nBt hel+. Or I < nt t# hel+ in the sch##l2 n#t inter%ere <ith the te chers. '$t I < nt t# hel+2 s# I 1# t# Sc#tt #r s#*eb#dy nd s y +le se hel+ *e2 I < nt t# d# s#*ethin1. S# I n#t #nly see2 st$dy2 le rn2 $nderst nd <h t the te chin1s re2 <hich is *ysel%2 I c n d# th t <ith di l#1$e2 <ith the #thers <h# re there2 #r he r the t +e nd ll the rest #% it2 #r I < tch2 I sit nd < tch *ysel% %#r h l% n h#$r #r +ic= it $+ l ter in n %tern##n. S# I * *#re #r less t it2 ri1htA M#re #r less2 e?en th#$1h IB* 1 rdenin12 I * di11in1 ditch t# +l nt trees <hich I h ?e d#ne +ers#n lly2 the br in is < tchin1 ll the ti*e. @e h ?enBt 1#ne int# the det ils #% ll this E <e <ill2 <e h ?e. s id t# Sc#tt nd #thers2 I s id <hen y#$ 1et b c= t# 'r#c=<##d2 <hen the 1 therin1 is #?er2 letBs sit d#<n nd see h#< t# <#r= this #$t. N#t l y it d#<n. Ob?i#$sly y#$ c nBt 1# there nd s*#=e. ThereBs n# *e t #r %ish #r %#<l2 n# dr$1s. I% y#$ < nt se42 =ee+ it t# y#$rsel%2 d#nBt * =e d# b#$t it2 ri1htA I% I * * rried2 there it is. S# I * there n#t #nly t# $nderst nd the te chin1s2 b$t ls# t# < tch *ysel% in rel ti#nshi+ t# the te chin1s nd in th t rel ti#nshi+ I disc#?er I * the te chin1s2 y#$ $nderst ndA It is *e th t is .... th t he is t l=in1 b#$t. S0 '$t #ne d#esnBt h ?e t# 1# t# St$dy Centre t# d# th t. K 0 N#2 IBll tell y#$ <hy. I * * rried. There is tele?isi#n2 children2 <i%e2 b$siness. S# I c n 1# there %#r <hile t# be D$iet <ith #thers <h# h ?e si*il r %eelin12 s# th t I c n disc$ss <ith the*. I c nBt 1# t# cl$b nd disc$ss this. I bel#n1 t# cl$b I c nBt disc$ss these * tters bec $se they re n#t interested. S# I see there is 1r#$+ #% +e#+le t 'r#c=<##d <hich they c ll St$dy Centre #r <ith di%%erent n *e. A++ rently there is 1r#$+ there +erh +s I c n disc$ss2 e4+l#re t#1ether. Or n #++#rt$nity E I c n st$dy *ysel% D$ietly in the c#rner. 'ec $se I * s$rr#$nded by children nd <i%e nd b$siness2 tele?isi#n nd ll the n#n......... re lly <#$ld li=e t# %ind +l ce li=e th t. S0 M y I s=....... K 0 I * n#t 7$sti%yin1 it2 y#$ $nderst ndA I thin= th tBs the #nly thin1 t# d#. Yes2 SirA -/ St$dy

S0 M y I s=2 Sir2 <hether the n *e St$dy h s been %in lly decided $+#nA K0 @h tA S0 ... <hether the n *e St$dy h s been ... K0 Oh2 ch n1e the n *e2 th tBs ... sir2 <e c lled it Ad$lt Centre. Th t s#$nds t## ... <e c lled it di%%erent n *es. (i?e *e 1##d n *e. It d#esnBt * tter2 <ill ch n1e it. (i?e $s 1##d n *e. The +$r+#se #% th t centre is n#t #nly t# le rn2 t# #bser?e2 t# < tch #nesel%2 b$t ls# y#$ c nBt d# th t ll d y l#n1. ItBs i*+#ssible. '$t <hile y#$ re d#in1 s#*ethin1 in the =itchen #r in the 1 rden #r s#*ethin1 else y#$ re ... the thin1 is #+er tin1 i% y#$ re seri#$s2 y#$ %#ll#<A "$ll st#+. S0 Krishn 7i ... A S0 "$ll st#+. S0 !S+e =s in It li n& I < nt t# +$t c nn#t be <#r= #% +re+ r ti#nA K0 O% c#$rse n#t. S0 Th t ends the * tter nd the disc$ssi#n. S0 M y I dd s#*ethin1 hereA K0 Add. D#nMt s=. S0 Y#$ h ?e t# re d ... s y2 y#$ re d s#*ethin12 y#$ re d the s yin1s #% Krishn 7i. Y#$ need y#$r intellect$ l +r#cess t# re d2 d#nBt y#$A K0 O% c#$rse. S0 Th tMs ri1ht. K0 Sir2 < it *in$te...... S0 Y#$ h ?e t# re d. K0 @ it *in$te2 < it *in$te. S0 Y#$r br in *$st <#r=. K0 @ it *in$te2 < it bit. S0 Ye h. K0 Y#$ h ?e t# be c re%$l. S0 I < nted t# +$t s#*ethin1 str i1ht. -si*+le D$esti#n. "#r this 1li*+se #% c#*+lete c#*+rehensi#n

K0 A* I re lly re din1 #r * I re din1 behind the <#rdA S0 . @ell2 th tBs the D$esti#n I < nt t# ... K0 @ it2 @ it2 < it2 < it. !) $1hter&. A* I re din12 7$st + 1e %ter .. .I re d detecti?e st#ries2 I *e n 1##d #nes !) $1hter&. I re d D$ic=ly2 y#$ =n#< <h t I *e n2 itBs ll b#y2 1irl2 tr it#rs2 y#$ =n#<2 the 1##d #ld 1 *e. A l#t #% se4. I s=i+. S# I re d n#?el #r s#*ethin1. '$t here I * re din1. I * re din1 <h t lies behind the <#rd. I ls# * listenin1 t# the s#$nd #% the <#rds2 t# the s#$nd #% the <#rd. And ls# *y br in is tr nsl tin1 <h t is bein1 s id t# s$it itsel%. S# I s y2 l##= t <h t y#$ re d#in1. Y#$ re n#t listenin12 y#$ re n#t le rnin1 b$t cc#**#d tin12 d7$stin1 t# <h t is bein1 s id. I st#+ i**edi tely2 I <#nBt re d. S#2 I +enetr te th t. S0 Th t is ?ery i*+#rt nt. K0 IB?e st#++ed re din1. S# I 1#2 I < tch2 I see <h t IB* d#in1 E tr nsl tin1 s#*ethin1 <hich IB?e re d cc#rdin1 t# <h t s$its *e. S# I * b c= t# *ysel%. Sel%Einterest is in?#l?ed in this. S# I s y2 by J#?e l##= <h t I * d#in1. I ne?er st#+ < tchin1.
J"r#*0 Tr nscri+t2 C#n$nittee Meetin1s2 Sch#nried2 ,-th J$ly2 ,-/5K

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/out the Stud(

>$esti#ner0 I %eel there is cert in e4+ect ti#n th t * ybe <e c n he r s#*ethin1 th t <#$ld intensi%y #$r li?in1 #% the te chin1 in #$r d ily li?es. Krishn *$rti0 I <ill e4+l in2 i% y#$ < nt *e t#2 brie%ly. K0 I 1# t# libr ry nd +ic= $+ b##=2 he r t +e #r see ?ide#. I +ic= $+ b##= nd re d it. Either I s=i* thr#$1h it2 t$rn the + 1es ?ery D$ic=ly nd s y0 BYes2 this is lri1htB #r I re d it ?ery c re%$lly. I < nt t# $nderst nd %irst i% <h t he is s yin1 is nythin1 ne<2 n#t re+e tin1 tr diti#ns2 <#rshi+2 +r yer. I h ?e been ed$c ted % irly <ell nd I re d this b##=. In the b##= it s ys0 BY#$ nd the te chin1s re in?#l?ed in thisH the te chin1s re n#t se+ r te %r#* y#$. Y#$ re the te cher nd the +$+ilB. 'ec $se I * interested in th t2 I * le rnin12 I * disc#?erin12 I * e4+l#rin1. There%#re the te chin1 is n#t s#*ethin1 there2 it is here. Ri1htA S# in the +r#cess #% $nderst ndin12 #r it * y be in sec#nd2 IBll see the <h#le thin1. Y#$ $nderst ndA EithUr it is F sl#< di1esti#n2 #r inst nt 1r s+. I% it is c#*+lete insi1ht2 then I d#nBt h ?e t# d# nythin12 it is there. '$t i% it is *erely +r#cess #% cc$*$l tin1 the =n#<led1e <hich is in the b##=2 1 therin1 the =n#<led1e nd s yin1 I h ?e $nderst##d2 it h s ?ery little si1ni%ic nce. It is li=e *e*#riGin1 Is i h2 #r the S#n1 #% S#n1s. '$t i% I be1in t# listen t# the <#rds2 $nderst nd2 1r s+2 h ?e n insi1ht2 then I * the te cher bec $se I * le rnin1. Then I * ls# the +$+il <h# is +ic=in1 $+. S# I * b#th the te cher nd the +$+il. I% y#$ c n $nderst nd this2 then it bec#*es ?ery si*+le. I * le rnin1 ll the ti*eH there is ne?er *#*ent <hen I * n#t seein1 s#*ethin1 ne<. >0 C#$ld #ne ls# s y th t it is n#t l< ys necess ry t# re%er t# the b##=A K0 Oh2 n#2 it is n#t. I% I h ?e re d the <h#le b##= ?ery c re%$lly2 I $nderst nd <h t he is tryin1 t# c#n?ey nd I disc#?er it is *e th t he is t l=in1 b#$tH the b##= is *e. I% th t is % ct2 then I * re lly +$+il2 n#t #% the b##=2 b$t #% *ysel%. There%#re2 I * the te cher. There is n# di?isi#n in the te chin1s bet<een the +$+il nd the te chin1sH it is ll #ne *#?e*ent. S# I li?e th t < yH <hether it is se4 #r e rnin1 *#ney2 it is + rt #% li%e. Y#$ $nderst nd2 sirA >0 Krishn 7i2 y#$ 7$st s+#=e #% t<# +r#cesses0 either the inst nt insi1ht2 #r the sl#< di1esti#n. K0 Yes2 it is 1ener lly sl#< di1esti#n. >0 @ell2 th tBs it. Y#$ d#nBt deny the i*+#rt nce #% sl#< di1esti#nA K0 I d#nBt deny nythin1. It de+ends #n #neBs c + city2 #n #neBs 1#in1 int# it seri#$sly. I% #ne is dee+ly c#ncerned <ith h$* nity2 <hich is *e2 <hether they re b$tcherin1 in )eb n#n2 #r in )iby 2 #r in N#rthern Irel nd2 #r in A%1h nist n2 it is *y2 b$sinessH I * + rt #% ll th t. >0 '$t this sl#< di1esti#n <e re s+e =in1 b#$t is n#t +r#cess #% ti*e +sych#l#1ic llyA K0 N#. A * n <h# re lly $nderst nds the n t$re #% ti*e is #$t #% it. >0 It is n#t *#*ent t# *#*entA K0 N#. Th t is terrible. Th t is the scienti%ic ttit$de <ith re1 rd t# ti*eH series #% *#?e*ents. I h ?e disc$ssed this * tter <ith se?er l scientists. T# *e2 ti*e is the ene*y #% * n. ,6,

>0 His +r#7ecti#ns thenA K0 Yes. Then y#$ e?#l?e2 1r#<2 *$lti+ly. T# *e2 th t is s# c#ntr ry t# ct$ lity +sych#l#1ic lly. O% c#$rse I < s b by2 nd then * n2 nd s# #nH th t is n t$r l. '$t in< rdly2 +sych#l#1ic lly2 s$b7ecti?ely2 t# bec#*e s#*ethin1 t =es ti*e2 there%#re2 I s y d#nBt... >0 Th tBs ri1ht2 b$t there * y be c#n%$si#n. One h s t# be ?ery c re%$l there. K0 Y#$ =n#< the <#rd B* ntr BH it h s bec#*e + rt #% the En1lish l n1$ 1e2 li=e B1$r$B. BM ntr B *e ns E I h ?e been t#ld E t<# <#rds0 B* nB nd Btr B. BM nB h s se?er l *e nin1s2 b$t the * in *e nin1 is0 +#nder2 thin= #?er2 *edit te #n n#t bec#*in1. Y#$ $nderst nd2 sirA N#t bec#*in1 s#*ethin1. Medit te b#$t itH thin= b#$t itH l##= t itH en7#y itH see <h t is in?#l?ed in it. BTr B *e ns0 b#lish sel%Einterest lt#1ether2 the *e nd its cti?ity. Th t is the re l *e nin1 #% th t <#rd0 thin= #?er n#t bec#*in1. @e re l< ys bec#*in10 I * this2 I <ill be th t. Thin= it #?er. D#nBt ste+ #n it. D#nBt deny it. D#nBt =ill itH b$t l##= t it. @h t is in?#l?edA Th t is <h t K is s yin1 in di%%erent < y. And Btr B ls# *e ns0 destr#y ny %#r* #% sel%Ei*+#rt nce2 sel%E cti#n2 ll th t. '$t n#< they h ?e * de it s#*ethin1 bs$rdH y#$ re+e t * ntr 0 r * r *2 #r c#c c#l 2 #r s#*ethin1 #r #therH it bec#*es childish. >0 S# this l#n1 di1esti#n is +r#cess #% bec#*in1A K0 O% c#$rse. >0 It * y n#t be. K0 J$st l##= t it2 sir0 the sl#< +r#cess #% bec#*in1H +r#cess #% di1esti#n #% the te chin1sH <hy d#es *y *ind cce+t th tA @hy d#es *y *ind cce+t this ide #% sl#<ly le rnin1A >0 It * y n#t be ble t# 1r s+ thin1s. K0 There%#re2 <hyA >0 'ec $se it is sl#< *ind. K0 There%#re2 <hy sl#< *indA I <#nBt cce+t sl#< *ind. @hy is *y *ind sl#<A Is it E < it *in$te E is it drin=A @ it2 < it2 I * 1#in1 int# it. Is it se4A Is it this tre*end#$s ++etite t# =n#<2 t# =n#<2 t# =n#<A Y#$ $nderst ndA T# bs#rb =n#<led1eA >0 @ell there re +e#+le in li%e <h# re D$ic= nd #thers <h# re ... K0 @hy d# I cce+t this +r#cess #% sl#<ly 1r#<in12 di1estin1A @hy d# I cce+t itA >0 The *#*ent y#$ +$t the <#rd B+r#cessB #n it2 #% c#$rse2 it ch n1es the <h#le thin1. K0 Th t is <hy I * s yin10 B@hy d# I cce+t +r#cessAB It * y n#t beE >0 I% <e re l##=in1 %#r this % st +r#cess2 <e * y ne?er h ?e it. As y#$ s y2 <e re +$ttin1 ti*e there.

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K0 Sir2 +r#cess h s been * nBs c#nditi#nin1. >0 Yes. K0 "#r *ysel%2 I <#nBt cce+t the ide #% +r#cess. I *$st be c re%$l here. K h s h d s#Ec lled +sych#l#1ic l e4+eriences2 it h s ll been <ritten b#$t E I <#nBt 1# int# it. I h ?e re lly l#st *e*#ry #% ll th tH I * n#t e4 11er tin1H it d#esnBt interest *e. N#< #ne re ds s#*ethin12 s y2 Bthe endin1 #% s#rr#<B2 %#r e4 *+le2 #r2 B=n#<in1 y#$rsel% is the 1re test <isd#* in the <#rldB E ri1htA He s ys s#*ethin1 li=e th t. @hy d#nBt I 1r s+ it i**edi telyA Is *y *ind d$llA Is *y *ind s# %$ll #% =n#<led1e2 b#$t ;ed nt 2 b#$t '$ddhis*2 b#$t Christi nity2 b#$t science th t I d#nBt =n#< i% I c n e?er e4+erience the #ri1in l thin1A @hy sh#$ld I2 n #rdin ry * n2 h ?in1 he rd s#*ethin1 li=e this2 <hy sh#$ld I cce+t 1r d$ l2 + 1e %ter + 1e2 + 1e %ter + 1e2 $nderst ndin1A >0 Yes2 b$t d#es th t *e n then th t either y#$ $nderst nd e?erythin1 t $nderst##d n#thin1A K0 Yes2 sirH th tBs the hell #% it. >0 It is either e?erythin1 #r n#thin1A K0 N#H 7$st see2 sir2 the i*+#rt nce. >0 Either bl c= #r <hiteA K0 N#. There is neither bl c= n#r <hite. J$st l##= t it. I * n #rdin ry * n. I h ?e been c#nditi#ned2 br#$1ht $+ s C th#lic. And y#$ c#*e l#n1 nd s y0 B)##=2 there is Hind$ %i1htin1 M$sli*B. Y#$ +#int ll this #$t t# *e. @hy d#nBt I 1r s+ it D$ic=lyA >0 @ell... K0 @ it *in$te. >0 Th tMs e sy. K0 N. >0 "#r *e it is e sy. K0 N#. @ it. @ it. @hy is it e syA >0 @ell2 bec $se it is #b?i#$s. K0 C re%$l. C re%$l. C re%$l. @hy isnBt the #ther eD$ lly #b?i#$sA I * s yin10 B@hyAB B@hy d#nBt y#$ s=A @hy d#es *y br in n#t see the <h#le thin1 t 1l nceA I h ?e 1#t * + #% E$r#+e. I < nt t# 1# t# R#$en2 nd the rest d#esnBt * tter. I d#nBt re lly t =e interest in the rest2 <here Ai4E E Ch +elle is2 #r ny #ther +l ce2 I < nt t# 1# t# R#$en. There%#re *y br in is directed nd disc rds the #thers. Ri1htA @hy d#es it d# itA 'ec $se I h ?e 1#t n i*2 I h ?e 1#t +$r+#se2 I h ?e 1#t s#*ethin1 t# 1et. S# I * n#t b#thered b#$t the * +. @h t is it I < nt t# 1etA @h t is it I < nt t# cD$ireA S# I in?esti1 te th t. '$t I in?esti1 te it sl#<ly2 d y %ter d y2 +ic= $+ little bits here nd there bec $se *y *ind is #cc$+ied <ith *y <i%e2 #r <ith *y h$sb nd2 #r <ith s#*e #ther thin1s. ,68 1l nce2 #r y#$ h ?e

S# I s y0 BI h ?e n# ti*e %#r thisH I h ?e 1#t res+#nsibilitiesB . '$t this is #+er tin12 t##2 ll the ti*e. This is <hy I * l< ys s=in10 B@hy is *y br in s# terribly sl#<A @hy d#nBt I see s#*ethin1 cle rly2 inst ntly2 n#t #nly #$t< rdly2 < r nd ll th t =ind #% st$%%2 b$t in< rdlyBA >0 I see %#r *ysel% th t the centr l di%%ic$lty is the %#rce #% the + st. I% I h ?e +r#ble*2 %#r e4 *+le2 the + st c#*es in. As l#n1 s I %#c$s #n it2 * < re #% it2 there is cert in rele se2 there is s+ ce in *ysel%. '$t s s##n s I 1et b$sy <ith s#*ethin1 else2 th t +r#cess t =es #?er nd then e?ent$ lly I %ind *ysel% in the *iddle #% bi1 *ess. I d#nBt =n#< <h t t# d#. K0 Yes2 sir. M y I e4+l inA There is n# BIB l##=in1 b c=. Y#$ re2 the BIB is2 the + stH there is n# di?isi#n. I d#nBt =n#< i% I * * =in1 *ysel% cle r. Sir2 * =e it ?ery si*+le0 * I di%%erent %r#* *y n1erA A* I di%%erentA I * n1ry. She is *y <i%e2 I * n1ry <ith her. Is th t n1er di%%erent %r#* *eA >0 N#. K0 S# n1er is *e. >0 Yes. K0 I% I #nce 1r s+ th t2 the di?isi#n c#*es t# n end. >0 I see. And then #ne d#esnBt h ?e t# * =e the e%%#rt ll the ti*eA K0 N#. N#<2 i% I re lly see #nce nd %#r ll th t n1er is *e2 then there is n# di?isi#n2 it is *e. I *e n2 i% I re lly $nderst nd h$* nity is *e2 I * n#t se+ r te %r#* h$* nity2 it is tre*end#$s re?#l$ti#n. Ri1htA H$* nity is *e2 bec $se I * n1ry2 I * ?i#lent2 nd s# is the * n in the ?ill 1e in Indi y#$ $nderst ndA I * h$* nity. >0 It is n#t s# e sy t# s y n1er is *e bec $se n1er 1#es nd c#*es nd I * l< ys there. S# I h ?e the i*+ressi#n th t ... K0 N#2 I * ls# 1#in1 nd c#*in1. >0 I * ls# 1#in1 <ith the n1erA K0 O% c#$rse. One d y I * n1ry2 the ne4t d y I * +e ce%$l. It is the s *e thin1. >0 And there is n#thin1 else th t st ys l< ys in *eA K0 @hen y#$ 1# bey#nd ll this2 there is s#*ethin1 th t is n#t *#? ble. Th t is2 it d#esnBt c#*e bec $se y#$ re in %l$4. I d#nBt =n#< i% y#$ $nderst nd <h t I *e n. One d y I * cheer%$l2 the ne4t d y I D$ rrel. >0 Sir2 I still d#nBt $nderst nd the di%%erence bet<een bec#*in1 s#*ethin1 nd sl#< di1esti#n th t th t 1entle* n s+#=e b#$t. I *e n2 sl#< $nderst ndin1 nd bec#*in1 s#*ethin1 b#th t =e ti*e. S# * ny +e#+le need t<# #r three ye rs2 * ybe <h#le li%eti*e2 %#r the $nderst ndin1 #% the te chin1s. K0 Sir2 I need ti*e t# le rn E s y l n1$ 1e E ri1htA I d#nBt =n#< It li n2 b$t I h ?e t =en ti*e2 ,6:

listenin1 ?ery c re%$lly2 nd s# #n. Th t t =es ti*e. Th t is +r#cess #% sl#< 1 therin12 #% ? ri#$s ?erbs2 nd ll the rest #% itH t the end #% it2 I h ?e cc$*$l ted l#t #% It li n <#rds nd I s+e = It li n. N#< is th t s *e +r#cess 1#in1 #n <ithinA Y#$ $nderst nd <h t I * s yin1A I sl#<ly 1 ther <h# I *. I sl#<ly $nderst nd <h t l#?e is. I sl#<ly be1in t# c +t$re the be $ty #% s#*ethin1. Ri1ht2 sirA Is th t s#A I D$esti#n th t. I d#nBt cce+t th t. '$t <e h ?e cce+ted th t. @e h ?e cce+ted e?#l$ti#n s *e ns t# chie?e*ent. >0 '$t I #%ten 1et the i*+ressi#n th t intellect$ lly I $nderst nd <h t y#$ s y. K0 Ah2 th tBs it. S# c n I listen <ith#$t the #+er ti#n #% intellect l< ys inter%erin1A C n I listen t# <h t y#$ h ?e 7$st n#< s idA Th t is2 y#$ s id 7$st n#<0 BIntellect$ lly I $nderst ndB. @hyA @hy d# y#$ s y0 BIntellect$ lly I $nderst ndBA @h t d# y#$ *e n by intellect$ lA >0 I see the l#1ic #% it. K0 S# <hy d# y#$ see #nly the l#1ic #% itA Y#$ see the l#1ic #% itH <hy d#nBt y#$ 1# bey#nd itA >F0 Th tBs ri1ht. Th tBs the inst nt *#*ent. K0 Yes2 sir. I * s=in10 <hy is it I $nderst nd I *$stnBt D$ rrel <ith *y <i%e2 b$t I D$ rrelA @hyA Is it h bitA Is it t#t l indi%%erenceA Is it th t I * #cc$+ied <ith s# * ny thin1s th t I 1et irrit ted <ith herA S# the br in2 in?esti1 tin1 itsel%2 s=s0 B@hy is the br in cce+tin1 cert in thin1s nd denyin1 cert in thin1sAB @hyA @hy d#esnBt the br in +$t side lt#1ether this ide #% cce+tin1 nd denyin1A I% y#$ cce+t s#*ethin12 y#$ re resistin1 s#*ethin1 else. I% y#$ deny s#*ethin12 then y#$ re cce+tin1 s#*ethin1 else. >0 I < nt t# +$t si*+le D$esti#n0 %#r this 1li*+se #% c#*+lete c#*+rehensi#n2 c n there n#t be <#r= #% +re+ r ti#nA K0 O% c#$rse n#t. >0 S y y#$ re d s#*ethin12 y#$ re d s#*e s yin1s #% KH y#$ need y#$r intellect$ l +r#cess t# re d2 d#nBt y#$A K0 O% c#$rse2 sir2 < it behind the <#rdA *in$te2 < it bitH c re%$l. I re dH * I re lly re din1H #r * I re din1

>0 @ell2 th t is the D$esti#n I < nted t# s=. K0 @ it2 < it. )isten2 listen. I c n re d detecti?e st#ry2 I *e n 1##d #ne2 D$ic=lyH it is ll b#y2 1irl2 tr it#rs2 y#$ =n#< the 1##d #ld 1 *e2 l#t #% se4 t# s=i+. '$t here I * re din1 <h t lies behind the <#rdH I * ls# listenin1 t# the s#$nd #% the <#rdH nd ls# t# *y br in tr nsl tin1 <h t is bein1 s id t# s$it itsel%. S# I s y0 B)##= <h t y#$ re d#in1. Y#$ re n#t listenin12 y#$ re n#t le rnin12 b$t cc#**#d tin12 d7$stin1 t# <h t is bein1 s idB. I st#+ i**edi tely. I <#nBt re d. S# I +enetr te th t. I st#+ re din1H I 1# nd < tch nd s y0 B@h t * I d#in1A I * tr nsl tin1 s#*ethin1 <hich I h ?e re d cc#rdin1 t# <h t s$its *eB. S# I * b c= t# *ysel%. Sel%Einterest is in #+er ti#n. S# I s y0 B)##= <h t I * d#in1B. I ne?er st#+ < tchin1. >0 I h ?e sens ti#n b#$t the *ind. It see*s t# *e th t *ind is li=e <ind#<. I see s#*ethin1 #$tside nd I see #ne thin1 %ter n#ther. And s# it see*s t# *e th t there is ti*e. '$t i% I c n see ,65

i**edi tely2 i% I c n %eel th t e?erythin1 is si*$lt ne#$s ... K0 N#2 sir. This is r ther c#*+lic ted s$b7ect. Is the br in di%%erent %r#* the *indA N#2 n#2 d#nBt s y. I * s=in1 y#$ D$esti#n0 Is the br in di%%erent %r#* the *indA Or re they b#th t#1etherA Is th t s#A Or E letBs le ?e the *ind %#r the *#*ent E <h t is the cti?ity #% the br inA Senses2 res+#nses ... >0 T# see #ne thin1 %ter n#ther. K0 N#2 n#. )##= t the br in2 sir. I * n#t br in s+eci list2 b$t l##= t it. The br in is the centre #% ll #$r ner?#$s re cti#ns2 $t#* tic2 *ech nic l2 the b#dily res+#nses2 the 1l nd$l r res+#nses. It is the centre #% ll e*#ti#ns. It is the centre #% ll #$r res+#nses nd re cti#ns. It is the centre #% ll th#$1ht. It is the centre #% ll #$r cti?ity E b$siness2 tr nsl tin12 t l=in12 1#ssi+in12 se4. It is the centre #% ll #$r e4istence2 +hysic l e4istence. Ri1htA D# y#$ cce+t th t the br in is the centre #% ll #$r cti?ity2 <hether e*#ti#n l2 #r +sych#l#1ic lA It see*s s#. I * y be <r#n1. S# is the *ind li=e th t t##H #r is it t#t lly di%%erentA I% it is th t2 then it is 7$st +hysic l2 e*#ti#n l re cti#n2 centre #% ll th t. I #bser?e tree2 #r * nH I li=e hi*2 b$t I d#nBt li=e hi*H I * 1#in1 t# bec#*e bi1 b$siness * nH n#2 n#2 I <ill be h$*ble. It is #+er tin1 ll the ti*e. I% the *ind is + rt #% th t2 then <h t is the di%%erenceA There%#re2 it *$st be s#*ethin1 di%%erent E ri1htA Is it di%%erentA I c nBt ss$*e. S# I h ?e t# %ind #$t i% the br in c n e?er be D$iet. C n the br in e?er be silent D$iet2 tr nD$ilH n#t %$ll #% *$sic #r 1#ssi+H c $1ht in <#rds2 <#rdsH b$t D$iet2 bs#l$tely D$iet. Th t is the %irst thin1 I <#$ld s= *ysel%H %#r1et b#$t the *ind nd ll the rest #% it. Seein1 <h t is h ++enin1 r#$nd *e2 in *e2 th t is the %irst thin1 I <#$ld s=0 BC n this thin1 <hich is s# cti?e2 < tchin12 le rnin12 he rin12 ll the rest #% it2 c n th t be D$ietAB N#t %#rced D$iet2 $sin1 e%%#rt2 c#ntr#lH th#se re ll childish thin1s. >$iet by itsel%. And y#$ s y.E BN#2 it c nBtH there%#re I *$st h ?e ti*eH there%#re it is +r#cess #% 1r d$ lly bec#*in1 D$ietB. It is n#t h#+eless2 sir. D#nBt red$ce it t# h#+eless. @hen #nce y#$ see th t2 then it is #?er.

JSch#nried2 S<itGerl nd J$ly ,-th2 ,-/5 Krishn *$rti "#$nd ti#n2 '$lletin :- A$t$*nO@inter2 ,-/5K

,6.

The Krishnamurti Centre

A small grou% dis&ussed the Study with '( Krishnamurti( !he following is an e)tra&t from that dis&ussion* >$esti#ner0 Sir2 I < nted t# s= y#$ b#$t the +r#+#sed St$dy nd <h t it *e ns t# st$dy the Te chin1s. Krishn *$rti0 I% I <ent t# the St$dy2 %irst #% ll I <#$ld < nt t# be D$iet2 n#t brin1 +r#ble*s thereH n#t *y h#$seh#ld +r#ble*s2 b$siness +re#cc$+ ti#ns2 nd s# #n. And ls# I thin= I <#$ld < nt <h t K s ys t# be entirely + rt #% *y li%e2 n#t 7$st th t I h ?e st$died K nd I re+e t <h t he s ys. R ther2 in the ?ery st$dyin1 #% it I * re lly bs#rbin1 itH n#t bits #% it here nd there2 n#t #nly 7$st <h t s$its *e. >0 C n <e t l= b#$t h#< th t h ++ens bec $se I %eel this is <here <e <ill decide the n t$re #% the +l ce nd its cti?ities. K0 I% I <ent there t# st$dy <h t K is s yin12 I <#$ld < nt t# in?esti1 te it2 D$esti#n it2 d#$bt itH n#t 7$st re d s#*ethin1 nd then 1# < y. I <#$ld be re din1 n#t 7$st t# *e*#riGe2 I <#$ld be re din1 t# le rnH t# see <h t he is s yin1 nd *y re cti#ns t# it2 <hether it c#rres+#nds #r c#ntr dicts2 <hether he is ri1ht #r I * ri1ht2 s# th t there is c#nst nt c#**$nic ti#n nd interch n1e bet<een <h t I * re din1 nd <h t I * %eelin1. I <#$ld < nt t# est blish rel ti#nshi+ bet<een <h t I * re din12 seein12 he rin1 nd *ysel% <ith *y re cti#ns2 c#nditi#nin12 nd s# #nH di l#1$e bet<een hi* nd *e. S$ch di l#1$e *$st ine?it bly brin1 b#$t %$nd *ent l ch n1e. )et $s s y th t * n li=e y#$ c#*es t# this ne< St$dy. Y#$ t =e ll the tr#$ble t# c#*e t# this +l ce2 nd %#r the %irst %e< d ys y#$ * y < nt t# be D$iet. I% y#$ re sensiti?e y#$ re liGe there is s#*ethin1 here <hich is di%%erent %r#* y#$r h#*e2 t#t lly di%%erent %r#* 1#in1 t# disc$ssi#n s#*e<here. Then y#$ be1in t# st$dy2 nd n#t #nly y#$ b$t ll the +e#+le li?in1 here re st$dyin12 seein12 D$esti#nin1. And e?ery#ne ct$ lly listenin1 <ith their <h#le bein1 <ill n t$r lly brin1 b#$t reli1i#$s t*#s+here. Th t is <h t I <#$ld < nt i% I <ent there. I <#$ld be sensiti?e en#$1h t# D$ic=ly c +t$re <h t K is s yin1. And t l$nch2 #r < l=in1 #r sittin1 r#$nd t#1ether in the sittin1 r##*2 I *i1ht li=e t# disc$ss. I *i1ht s y2 F)##=2 I didnBt $nderst nd <h t he *e nt by th t2 letBs t l= b#$t itF E n#t2 y#$ tell *e b#$t it2 #r I =n#< better E FletBs 1# int# itFH s# it <ill be li?in1 thin1. And in the %tern##n I *i1ht 1# #$t %#r < l=2 #r d# s#*e #ther +hysic l cti?ity. The St$dy <ill be +l ce %#r ll seri#$s +e#+le <h# h ?e le%t behind the* ll their n ti#n lity2 their sect ri n belie%s nd ll the #ther thin1s th t di?ide h$* n bein1s. >0 C n <e s y *#re b#$t <h t it *e ns t# st$dy the te chin1s +r#%#$ndlyA K0 I h ?e * de it cle r. >0 Yes. '$t there is *#re t# it. In #r1 niGin1 the Centre I ls# h ?e t# s= b#$t *y #<n st$dyin1. I re liGe th t i% I d#nBt d# this seri#$sly ... I h ?e n# b$siness <#r=in1 there i% I * n#t d#in1 it E ri1htA

,6C

K0 Th t is $nderst##d. >0 It is this D$esti#n #% the te chin1s s#*eh#< 1#in1 int# the bl##d. K0 @e <ill 1et it sir2 I * s$re <e <ill 1et it. As l#n1 s <e re t l=in1 t#1ether li=e this2 nd =ee+ t it. >0 '$t Krishn 7i I ls# %eel th t it h s t# be s#*ethin1 th t d#es n#t de+end #n y#$. K0 It de+ends #n the te chin1s. >0 And #n h#< I rel te t# the te chin1s. '$t %r#* *y #<n rel ti#nshi+ <ith the te chin1s there re s#*e #ther thin1s I < nt t# s= b#$t2 bec $se there is s#*ethin1 else <hich I %eel is i*+#rt nt. K0 @h t is th t2 brie%lyA >0 I h ?e st$died the te chin1s e?ery d y %#r s#*e ye rs. K0 C#*e2 <h t re y#$ s yin1 sirA >0 S#*eti*es st$dyin1 the te chin1s %#r *e *e ns e?en 7$st re din1 #ne +hr se. K0 >$ite ri1ht. Th tBs $+ t# y#$. >0 '$t n#< < it. This is it Krishn 7i. Th t #ne +hr se E s#*eh#< h#ldin1 it d$rin1 the d y E in cti#n nd in rel ti#nshi+2 h#ldin1 it. K0 >$ite ri1ht. Y#$ re c rryin1 7e<el <ith y#$. Y#$ re < tchin1 ll the ti*e #r it <ill 1et l#st. >0 N#< I < nted t# t l= b#$t th t h#ldin12 bec $se t# *e there is secret in th t h#ldin12 there is s#*ethin1 ?ery s+eci l b#$t th t h#ldin1 th t *#st +e#+le d#nBt =n#< nd th t I #%ten %#r1et. K0 Yes sir. )isten c re%$lly. S#*e#ne 1i?es *e * r?ell#$s < tch. A * r?ell#$s < tch2 s$+erb. And it is s$ch +reci#$s thin1 E I < tch it ll d y. >0 Yes. K0 The thin1 E I d#nBt h ?e t# h#ld it2 it is there in *y h nd. I < tch. I li?e <ith it. >0 Yes. I% I c n c#*e b c= t# this Krishn 7i. It is there in y#$r h nds. N#<2 t# c#ntin$e the *et +h#r letBs s y0 )##=2 <#$ld y#$ +le se d# the dishes0 here re the t<# 1l#?es2 y#$ re n#t 1#in1 t# =ee+ the < tch in y#$r h nd2 y#$ re 1#in1 t# +$t it in y#$r +#c=et2 #r y#$ re 1#in1 t# d# s#*ethin1 else <ith it. K0 '$t the < tch is still tic=in1 < y. >0 E4 ctly. S#2 in this Centre s#*eh#< I %eel <e < nt t# set $+ s#*e cti?ities th t hel+ +e#+le h#ld this thin1 ll d y l#n1. K0 'e c re%$l. D#nBt d# th t. N# cti?ity is h#ldin1 it. N# #$tside hel+. ,6/

>0 N# #$tside hel+. S# +erh +s <e sh#$ld n#t 1i?e +e#+le s# * ny thin1s t# d#. K0 Yes. Y#$ d# ll the thin1s y#$ h ?e t# d#. Y#$ *$st ll#< %#r y#$rsel% %#$r #r %i?e h#$rs2 #r t<# h#$rs2 <h te?er y#$ < nt. S y2 l##=2 I sh$t *y d##r %ter t<# #Bcl#c= #r s#*e #ther ti*e. Then n#b#dy dist$rbs *e. Y#$ *$st h ?e ti*e t# st$dy2 t# listen2 bs#rb E bs#rb2 s# th t it is in y#$r bl##d. >0 Yes. K0 It is re lly li=e h ?in1 * r?ell#$s set #% +e rls. Y#$ +$t the* r#$nd y#$r nec= nd they re l< ys there. Y#$ %#ll#<A >0 C n y#$ describe *#re cl#sely2 Krishn 7i2 <ith#$t *et +h#r2 <hen e4tr #rdin ry2 h#< d# they h#ld th tA +ers#n re ds s#*ethin1

K0 Sir2 y#$ d#nBt h#ld it. The *#*ent y#$ h ?e re d th t nd y#$ see the tr$th #% it2 it is y#$rs2 y#$ d#nBt h ?e t# h#ld it. Y#$ l##= t th#se *#$nt ins2 y#$ d#nBt h#ld the*2 they re there. Y#$ re l< ys c#nsci#$s #% th t. Y#$ re l< ys l##=in1 t it. E?en <hen y#$ re < shin1 dishes2 th t is there. K0 Kee+ it Sir. D#nBt t l= ny *#re b#$t it. Kee+ it. Y#$ h ?e $nderst##d <h t it *e ns. (# int# it %#r y#$rsel%. Y#$ re 1#in1 t# h ?e t# t l= t# the +e#+le <h# c#*e t# the Centre b#$t this. S# y#$ h ?e t# be ?ery cle r. I *i1ht c#*e %r#* ' rcel#n nd s y2 <h t d# y#$ thin= b#$t ll thisA I <#$ld li=e t# disc$ss <ith y#$ <h t K *e ns by *edit ti#n2 <h t he *e ns by E y#$ =n#< ll the rest #% it. And y#$ *$st be ble t# disc$ss this. >0 Yes2 I =n#< sir. K0 ItBs ll ri1ht <ith +r ctic l 7#bs th t h ?e t# be d#ne %#r the b$ildin12 <hich *$st be *#st be $ti%$l2 $stere. '$t the #ther E y#$ h ?e tre*end#$s res+#nsibility. D#nBt *ini*iGe it. And d#nBt be %ri1htened. Y#$ h ?e 1#t t# d# it. It is n#t e sy. >0 'ec $se here2 Krishn 7i2 <e re t l=in1 b#$t the s cred2 cre tin1 s#*ethin1 #% the s cred. K0 It <ill c#*e. Y#$ c nBt 7$st +$t #$t y#$r h nd nd < it. K0 It c#*es <hen y#$ li?e the te chin1s.

JThe Krishn *$rti "#$nd ti#n Tr$st )i*ited2 The Krishn *$rti Centre2 'r#c=<##d 3 r=2 'r *de n2 H *+shire2 En1l nd2 $nd ted.K

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The 0dea o& the Stud( Centre

K 0 Y#$ st rt it Sir. @h t y#$ re 1#in1 t# d#2 Sc#tt2 th t is2 t 'r#c=<##d <ith the St$dy Centre2 bec $se y#$ h ?e <#r=ed2 <e h ?e ll <#r=ed it #$t2 <e h ?e th#$1ht 1re t de l b#$t it. S"0 Yes Sir. K0 )#ts #% $s. N#< <h t is the %in l c#ncl$si#n2 <h t the rchitect is 1#in1 t# d# nd s# #n. S"0 Ri1ht. @ell in 1ener l Sir <e re b$ildin1 +l ce <hich is dedic ted nd desi1ned e4cl$si?ely %#r +e#+le t# st$dy the te chin1s. And s# <e h ?e incl$ded e?erythin1 th t <e see s necess ry %#r th t2 nd e4cl$ded nythin1 th t is n#t necess ry. S# <e h ?e ... K0 @h t h ?e y#$ incl$ded nd e4cl$dedA S"0 Ri1ht. @e h ?e indi?id$ l bedr##*s2 <hich <ill be c#*%#rt ble b$t $stere2 <ith +ri? te b thr##*s2 nd <e h ?e t<enty #% th#se. K0 And y#$ ls# h ?e d#$ble r##*s %#r * rried. Oh2 n#. S"0 N#. N# <e d#nBt. @e <ill h ?e s#*e c#nnectin1 d##rs %#r +e#+le <h# re * rried. '$t e?eryb#dy there <ill h ?e their #<n indi?id$ l sin1le s+ ce. Then there <ill be libr ry #% ll #% y#$r <#r=s2 s <ell s the rchi?es2 nd <e <ill h ?e s+eci lly cre ted rchi?es s# th t e?erythin1 is there2 e?en $n+$blished thin1s2 e?erythin1 is there. A cert in *#$nt #b?i#$sly <hich <ill be ? il ble t# rese rch +e#+le nd seri#$s sch#l rs. There is dinin1 % cilities2 there is =itchen2 nd then there is sittin1 r##*. And then ls# the "#$nd ti#n #%%ices <ill *#?e there2 s# there re +l ces %#r * =in1 ?ide# t +es nd $di# t +es nd the "#$nd ti#n #%%ices. K0 And n#thin1 elseA S"0 And libr ry %#r re din1 nd ?ide# t +e ?ie<in1 r##*. A +l ce <here +e#+le c n 1# in nd < tch indi?id$ l ?ide# t +es. And D$iet r##*. K0 @h tA S"0 A D$iet r##*. K0 Oh yes. S"0 And y#$ h ?e s id2 nd the rchitect h s t =en it ?ery seri#$sly2 th t e?erythin1 is 1ener ted #$t #% th t D$iet r##*. K0 >$ite2 D$ite. S"0 S# <hen <e 1et t# M dr s I c n sh#< +e#+le the dr <in1s there bec $se the rchitect < s 1#in1 t# send *e *#di%ied dr <in1s in M dr s. '$t it < s %elt Sir th t y#$r need t# h ?e +l ce <hich is e4cl$si?ely *e nt %#r +e#+le t# c#*e nd st$dy the te chin1s2 +l ce <here they c n c#*e nd be s D$iet s they <ish t# be2 h ?e e?erythin1 ? il ble t# the*2 nd yet ls# h ?e n #++#rt$nity #% t l=in1 <ith #thers <h# re ls# interested in the te chin1s. ,,6

K0 @h t <ill they d# ... < it. Th t is the 1ener l ide . S"0 Yes Sir. K0 @e <ill 1# int# det ils <h t they <ill d#2 ll d y2 nd ll th t. R dhi= 2 <h t d# y#$ s y t# ll this hereA @h t is y#$r intenti#nA I * n#t the ch ir* n. RH0 Sir *y %eelin1 is th t St$dy Centre sh#$ld be +l ce <here +e#+le interested in Krishn 7iBs <#r= sh#$ld c#*e nd *eet nd disc$ss2 nd I <#$ld li=e it t# bec#*e E * y be I * *biti#$s E b$t I <#$ld li=e it t# bec#*e2 Krishn 7iBs te chin1s2 bec#*e the 1r#$nd #% cert in ci?iliG ti#n l c$lt$re2 <hich I thin= is +#ssible. I thin= it is +#ssible. K0 I d#nBt D$ite %#ll#<. S#rry. RH0 Sir2 I <#$ld li=e it t# bec#*e the 1r#$nd #% c$lt$re in this c#$ntry2 i% it is +#ssible2 s# th t S ns=rit2 <e c#$ld h ?e sch#l rs <h# <#$ld d# S ns=rit c#nnected <ith y#$r thin=in12 see h#< y#$r <#r= c n ill$*in te th t. And 1ener lly h#< y#$r th#$1ht c n ill$*in te2 c n +r#d$ce < y #% li%e %#r the +e#+le2 <hich is *#dern2 nd rele? nt t# the ti*es. K0 It <ill be entirely di%%erent %r#* y#$rs. "r#* y#$r ide #% St$dy Centre. S"0 N#t necess rily. K0 "r#* y#$r ide s b#$t it. S"0 N#t necess rily. I %eel th t in E I 1ree <ith R dhi= in th t I thin= th t the +e#+le <ill re lise th t the thin1s y#$ re t l=in1 b#$t re the b sis %#r ne< ci?iliG ti#n2 nd ?ery needed #ne. I <#$ld e?en s y th t they re l##=in1 t the +r#ble*s th t the c#*+$ter 1e is 1#in1 t# cre te %#r s#ciety. Y#$ re the #nly #ne I =n#< <h# is ddressin1 th#se +r#ble*s t their %#$nd ti#n. S# I thin= th t +e#+le <ill c#*e nd <ill be interested in seein1 <h t y#$ h ?e t# s y s it rel tes t# #ther +hil#s#+hies2 b$t it is +l ce <here +e#+le c#*e t# st$dy Krishn 7iBs te chin1s... K0 ... nd n#thin1 else. S"0 ... nd n#thin1 else. E?en th#$1h there * y be b##=s #n '$ddhis*2 there * y be b##=s #n #ther thin1s2 b$t they c#*e there %#r the te chin1s. K0 I $nderst nd. Sir2 <h t d# y#$ s y t# thisA Y#$ h ?e ide s t## %#r 'en res. >0 I < s thin=in1 in ter*s #% this +l indi?id$ l <#r=. O% c#$rse2 libr ry2 +e#+le <ill be st yin1 s residents2 s#*eti*es t# disc$ss2 +e#+le <h# * ce bein1 +ri* rily %#r the st$dy #% KBs te chin1s. 3ri* rily %#r <e <ill +$t there ... ? ri#$s c$lt$res nd <here +e#+le2 s#*e * y be t<# t ti*e ... b$t #ther li=e *inded +e#+le c#*e y n#t be in residence there b$t re l##=in1 %#r s#*e +l ce ...

K0 D#es <h t y#$ s y di%%er %r#* <h t Sc#tt is s yin1A >0 N#t b sic lly. K0 Y#$ t##A ,,,

S"0 I d#nBt thin= s# Sir2 I *e n in the b sis #% it I thin= <e ll 1ree2 h#< the b sis * ni%ests itsel%. '$t I thin= in the b sis <e re ll s yin1 the s *e thin1. K0 Are <e2 I * n#t s$re. As % r s I $nderst nd Sir2 here in Rishi ; lley2 nd I * y h ?e c#ntrib$ted t# th t2 <h t the rchitects re dr <in12 h ll2 se+ r te r##*s nd ll the rest #% it2 b$t it is ls# t# be $sed %#r #ther +e#+le %r#* br# d t# c#*e here2 st y in their #<n r##*s2 etc. etc.2 s 1ener l str$ct$re2 <hich <ill hel+ the sch##l. RH0 Enh nce the sch##l2 th tBs the <#rd y#$ $sed. @hen <e t l=ed b#$t it l st ti*e <e $sed the <#rd enh nce. S"0 @h t d# y#$ *e n by th t SirA @h t =ind #% *e nin1. K0 'rin1 ne< ele*ent int# the sch##l2 brin1 ne< < y #% li%e2 ne< < y #% thin=in1 nd s# #n. S"0 Y#$ *e n +e#+le interested in #ther thin1sA K0 J$st listen2 listen2 %irst 1et <h t <e ... Rishi ; lley sch##l n#< isQ <ell =n#<n. It is %#ll#<in1 cert in c#$rse2 cert in line. And th t line * y bec#*e t## c n liGed2 t## %ir*2 t## st nd rdiGed2 t## i**#? ble. And this St$dy Centre2 i% it is the +r#+er thin12 the ri1ht thin12 <ill enh nce2 <ill enrich2 <ill * =e the sch##l s#*ethin1 *#re th n *erely en1ineers2 nd bl 2 bl 2 bl . Th t <ill be the s#$rce t# the sch##l2 th t <ill be the %#$nt in he d t# the sch##l. Y#$ c nBt se+ r te the* here. The sch##l nd the St$dy Centre E ri1htA RH0 I <#$ldnBt li=e t# se+ r te the St$dy Centre %r#* nythin1. K0 I =n#<. Y#$ %#ll#< <h t she s ysA @e E I * y h ?e 1reed t# this. I h ?e %#r1#tten. My br in d#esnBt <#r= th t < y. @h t R dhi= is s yin1 is0 th t <ill be the %#$nt in he d %#r this <h#le +l ce. RH0 And bey#nd. K0 And bey#nd. I% it <#r=s #$t +r#+erly2 ' n1 l#re2 bec $se they re 1#in1 t# h ?e st$dy centre in 'en res. 'en res2 this2 Rishi ; lley2 <ill be the reli1i#$s centres2 letBs $se th t <#rd. And n#t ; s nt ;ih r. This +l ce nd 'en res <ill be the reli1i#$s ... nd the st$dy centres in e ch +l ce <ill enh nce2 enrich2 brin1 ne< c#l#$r2 ne< +er%$*e t# the sch##l E ri1htA RH0 Yes Sir. K0 Th t is 1ener lly <h t I h ?e $nderst##d. And y#$ h ?e $nderst##d th t t##. S"0 Yes Sir. K0 The St$dy Centre t 'r#c=<##d <ill enh nce2 n t$r lly. S"0 Abs#l$tely2 yes Sir. M y I s= <hich is 1#in1 t# enh nceA D$esti#n t this +#int SirA @h t is it in these St$dy Centres

K0 Th t is <h t <e h ?e t# disc$ss ?ery c re%$lly. ,,9

S"0 Yes Sir. K0 The +e#+le th t c#*e there2 the D$ lity #% the +l ce2 <hether it is h ll2 1ener l E 7$st + ss by nd c#*e2 c#*e nd 1# E ri1htA RH0 Sir s#*e +e#+le * y st y l#n1er de+endin1 #n the =ind #% <#r=. K0 S#*eb#dy c n st y l#n1er2 <e 1ree. S# there <ill be c#**ittee s t 'r#c=<##d <h# 1$ide E n#t 1$ide2 s#rry E <h# <ill in?ite nd see <h# is re lly <#rth<hile t# st y there nd enc#$r 1e the* t# st y there2 nd #thers <h# re n#t2 1r d$ lly e se the* #$t. And there%#re c#**ittee is ?ery i*+#rt nt. They h ?e ch#sen c#**ittee t 'r#c=<##d2 i% I re*e*ber ri1htly. Here y#$ <ill h ?e t# h ?e c#**ittee. RH0 S# <e <ill h ?e the s *e c#**ittee2 the * n 1in1 c#**ittee2 s#*e *e*bers #% the * n 1in1 c#**ittee <ill be cti?e #n th t. K0 Yes y#$ h ?e the s *e thin1. Here y#$ c ll it the * n 1e*ent c#**ittee. Y#$ <ill ch##se #$t #% th#se %#$rteen #r %i%teen E ri1htA S"0 @e lre dy h ?e s* ll 1r#$+2 Sir. K0 All ri1ht. I h ?e %#r1#tten ll th t. Th tBs <hy I s=ed Dr. 3 rch$re t# be here bec $se *y br in d#esnBt <#r= l#n1 these lines. S# d# <e tell the rchitects2 <h tA S"0 Sir2 <e h ?e s=i++ed s#*ethin1. S=i++ed s#*ethin1. @e still h ?enBt s id <h t it is th t is 1#in1 t# d# the enh ncin1. N#< t# *y < y #% thin=in1 Sir there is #ne thin1 nd #nly #ne thin1 <hich h s enh nced ll #% the sch##ls s# % r2 nd th t is the te chin1s. S#2 %#r inst nce2 <e <#$ld n#t $se the St$dy t 'r#c=<##d2 the Centre t 'r#c=<##d %#r se*in r #n ed$c ti#n2 #r se*in r %#r te chers #r nythin1 else. @e <#$ld $se it e4cl$si?ely %#r +e#+le <h# re interested in the te chin1s nd %#r +e#+le <h# re 1#in1 t# 1# int# the te chin1s. 'ec $se th t is <h t <ill enh nce in *y ... K0 @h t d# y#$ s yA RH0 C#$ld <e +$t it in di%%erent < yA C n <e s y th t <e <ill #nly h ?e *eetin1s2 ll#< s cred thin1s t# h ++en there. @e 1i?e n $ndert =in1 th t #nly thin1s th t h ?e s cred2 <e %eel2 %ter ll the decisi#n <ill h ?e t# be ... t# h ?e s cred sense. S"0 It is t## l##se. It is t## l##se. At le st %#r 'r#c=<##d it is t## l##se bec $se I %eel th t there is tendency E I thin= th t the tendency t#< rds c#rr$+ti#n is en#r*#$s nd +e#+le re li=ely t# s y2 FOh2 <ell this is s cred2 nd th t is s cred nd the #ther thin1 is s credF E nd there h s #nly been #ne thin1 <hich h s ct$ lly enh nced the sch##ls2 t# *y < y #% thin=in1. And it is n#t <h t #ther +e#+le thin= is s cred. It is the te chin1s. RH0 '$t th t h s 1#t the s *e D$esti#n0 <h t is the te chin1sA S# * ny di%%erent +e#+le h ?e s# * ny di%%erent ide s b#$t the te chin1s. S"0 @ell +e#+le * y h ?e di%%erent ide s b#$t the te chin1s b$t it is the te chin1s th t they h ?e di%%erent ide s b#$t t this +l ce. It is n#t th t they thin= <ell yes2 ls# I =n#<2 R 7neesh is s cred2 ,,8 1ener l sse*bly2 1ener l

#r ls# s#*ethin1 else is s cred2 #r the Ancient ;ed s2 #r the Old Test *ent2 #r this #r th t. There is #ne thin1 <hich I =ee+ c#*in1 b c= t# th t bec $se I thin= this is 1#in1 t# be stic=in1 +#int #n E t le st #n the St$dy t 'r#c=<##d nd +#ssible #ther +l ces2 th t <h t re these +l ces %#rA And i% he < nts t# c#*e there bec $se it is <#nder%$l en?ir#n*ent nd he is ct$ lly interested in Christi nity nd he %eels th t th t is s cred nd Krishn 7i is s yin1 the s *e thin1 th t Jes$s < s s yin12 s# <hy c nBt he c#*e there nd st$dy Jes$sA I <#$ld s y2 FI * s#rry2 * ybe Jes$s nd Krishn *$rti re s yin1 e4 ctly the s *e thin1 b$t this +l ce is #nly %#r st$dyin1 Krishn *$rti2 nd st$dyin1 his te chin1s. 3erh +s it rel tes t# #ther thin1s b$t it is %#r the te chin1s.F Other<ise I thin= the thin1 <ill $t#* tic lly bec#*e < tered d#<n nd <ill bec#*e c#rr$+t. At le st in the @est this is2 <h t <e h ?e t# c#ntend <ith. >0 I thin= <e 1ener lly2 br# dly 1ree b$t there c#$ld be n e4ce+ti#n2 s#*eb#dy <h# is interested in '$ddhis*2 s y2 <ill < nt t# st$dy Krishn *$rti here b$t he * y h ?e b c=1r#$nd #% '$ddhis*. S"0 Th tBs %ine. '$t he c#*es here t# st$dy Krishn *$rti. He d#esnBt c#*e here t# st$dy s#*ethin1 else he thin=s is s cred. >0 N#2 n#. S"0 Th tBs %ine. K0 Are y#$ s yin12 i% I * y +$t it *#re c#ncretely2 th t b$ildin12 <ith ll the thin1s in?#l?ed in it2 is c#*+letely ... is t# be s#lely $sed %#r KB s te chin1A S"0 Yes. K0 Y#$ * y h ?e '$ddhist libr ry ... S"0 @e *i1ht h ?e '$ddhist b##=s2 <e <ill h ?e s#*e #ther thin1s there2 b$t yes it is e4cl$si?ely2 #ther<ise it <#nBt be ble t# 1ener te the +$rity #% the thin1 th t 'r#c=<##d <ill need. K0 >$ite ri1ht Sir. S"0 Needs n#<. K0 @h t d# y#$ s yA RH0 I 1ree <ith the s+irit #% it b$t I d#nBt < nt t# de%ine it. And I thin= the s+irit #% it is re+#sed in the +e#+le #% the * n 1e*ent c#**ittee <h# <ill decide. And i% <e re 1#in1 t# ll#< it t# bec#*e c#rr$+ted. I %eel th t #ne sh#$ldnBt be t## ri1id b#$t it2 t## sh r+ly de%ined b#$t it. Th t is *y %eelin1. S"0 '$t y#$ see e4+erience sh#<s $s th t n# * tter h#< +$re the #ri1in l *e*bers #% ny #r1 niG ti#n re2 either thr#$1h ti*e they bec#*e distr cted nd int# #ther thin1s2 #r they die nd + ss it #n t# s#*e#ne else <h# is c#*+letely #n the <r#n1 tr c=. I *e n in #$r #<n #r1 niG ti#ns <e h ?e en#$1h e?idence t# see this2 s# th t * ybe y#$2 R dhi= 2 re bs#l$tely cle r nd <ill =ee+ it 1#in12 nd * ybe y#$ <ill ne?er s< y %r#* the #ri1in l intenti#n2 b$t y#$ c nBt li?e %#r e?er nd the +ers#n y#$ + ss it t# * y %ind th t there is s#*e#ne he %eels <h# is s yin1 <h t Krishn 7i s ys #nly little bit better2 nd s# it <ill be E nd i% it is n#t strictly de%ined2 I %eel th t the tendency ,,:

t#< rds entr#+y nd thin1s slidin1 int# the l#<est c#**#n den#*in t#r2 the %#rce #% th t is s# h$1e th t y#$ <#nBt be ble t# <ithst nd it2 the +l ce <#nBt be ble t# <ithst nd it. RH0 Yes2 I 1ree <ith y#$. '$t the de%initi#ns d#nBt +re?ent th t. Th tBs ll I * tryin1 t# s y. S"0 They c n hel+. >0 '$t de%initi#ns re ls# li=ely t# 1et ch n1ed2 <hen the +e#+le ch n1e. S"0 Yes2 i% the de%initi#n ch n1es then ... >0 (i?in1 de%initi#n n#< is n# 1$ r ntee t# ens$re th t. S"0 It is n# 1$ r ntee. RH0 '$t y#$ =n#< <h t *y %e r is th t y#$ re r$lin1 #$t +e#+le2 s y he is n rdent '$ddhist b$t I li=e hi*2 there is s#*ethin1 b#$t hi*2 he < nts t# st$dy '$ddhis*2 +erh +s he is interested in Krishn 7i. I in?ite hi*. And <hen I t l= t# hi* nd I in%l$ence hi*. These =ind #% b#rder line c ses <here s#*eb#dy h s cert in +#int #% ?ie< b$t y#$ see s#*ethin1 in th t +ers#n. S"0 Th t2 I <#$ld s y2 t le st %#r 'r#c=<##d2 <#$ld n#t be s#*ethin1 I <#$ld incl$de. RH0 I <#$ld h te t# e4cl$de th t. S"0 I <#$ld n#t incl$de s#*e#ne <h# < s n rdent '$ddhist nd I < s 1#in1 t# try nd in%l$ence hi*. I <#$ld s y i% s#*e#ne is n rdent '$ddhist nd they re interested in Krishn *$rti then this is +l ce <here they c n c#*e nd they c n +$rs$e th t interest. '$t i% they re interested in '$ddhis* nd they re interested in +$rs$in1 th t interest2 then the res#$rces <hich <e h ?e 1 thered in Krishn 7iBs n *e2 %#r Krishn 7iBs <#r=2 sh#$ld n#t be $sed %#r the +$r+#se #% +$rs$in1 '$ddhis*. They sh#$ld be $sed %#r... RH0 My intenti#n <#$ldnBt be t# +$rs$e '$ddhis*. '$t *y intenti#n <#$ld be t# t l= t# hi*2 t# +l y <ith hi*2 sh#< hi* s#*ethin1 #% #ther +#ssibilities. K0 Sir2 re y#$ l##=in1 t it %r#* ?ery n rr#< +#int #% ?ie<A Or li=e s y %#r inst nce there is %riend here %r#* 'en res2 3$ndit7i2 he is 1re t sch#l r in '$ddhis* ... nd ll th t. And he is terribly interested in <h t <e re t l=in1 b#$t2 s % r s I $nderst nd. S"0 Yes Sir. K0 I * y be *ist =en in his interest. N#< <e disc$ss. He c#*es t# disc$ssi#n <ith $s in 'en resH he is ls# c#*in1 d#<n t# M dr s. He < nts t# c#*e E 7$st *in$te2 listen t# the ?ery end #% it E he < nts t# c#*e t# 'r#c=<##d2 s$++#se2 nd s ys I * re lly c#ncerned E the te chin1s #% the '$ddh see* s#*e<h t si*il r t# KBs2 I <#$ld li=e t# c#*e nd st$dy there2 t y#$r +l ce. N#t st$dy2 s# *$ch2 be E I < nt t# =n#< %$lly <h t K t l=s b#$t2 *$ch *#re. S"0 Yes. K0 And +erh +s I c n tr nsl te nd 1# br# d2 t l=in1 b#$t it. @#$ld y#$ ll#< hi*A

,,5

S"0 Abs#l$tely Sir. I <#$ld <elc#*e hi* <ith #+en r*s Sir. K0 @hyA S"0 'ec $se he is interested in K. He is interested in %indin1 #$t *#re #% <h t K s ys. Th tBs ll. K0 N#2 7$st h#ld it. N#t #nly <h t K s ys2 b$t in c#*+ ris#n t# the '$ddh . S"0 Th tMs %ine Sir. Th tMs %ine. RH0 M y I s y s#*ethin1 elseA S"0 He c#$ld c#*+ re it <ith nythin1 he < nts b$t he c#*es t# 'r#c=<##d bec $se he is interested in %indin1 #$t *#re b#$t Krishn 7iBs te chin1s. He c n c#*+ re it <ith this2 #r th t2 he c n rel te it t# nythin1 he < nts. It * =es n# di%%erence. RH0 M y I s y s#*ethin1 elseA I * de st$dy #% '$ddhist +hil#s#+her <h#se <#r= < s inter+reted #n the b sis #% c#**ent t#r. I l##=ed t the #ri1in l ser*#ns nd I s id *y 1#d2 this *$st be2 %ter h ?in1 listened t# Krishn 7i2 this c nBt *e n this2 it *$st *e n s#*ethin1 c#*+letely di%%erent2 nd <h t it *e ns h s s#*ethin1 t# d# <ith s#*e #% the thin1s I le rnt %r#* Krishn 7i. And <ith#$t *enti#nin1 Krishn 7i #nce the st$dy tried t# +$t it t#1ether *#re in the lines #% his te chin1s. N#< I h ?e n#t $sed Krishn 7i2 I h ?e n#t *enti#ned hi*2 nd yet *y <h#le %#c$s h s been re ched by ten2 t<enty ye rs th t I h ?e listened t# Krishn 7i. S"0 Y#$ *i1ht n#t h ?e *enti#ned Krishn 7i2 b$t it h s been %#c$sed by the ten2 #r %i%teen #r t<enty ye rs y#$ h ?e listened t# Krishn 7i. RH0 '$t the b##= h s c#*+letely n#thin1 t# d# <ith Krishn 7i b$t it is this b sis in Krishn 7iB s te chin1s. S"0 Then it h s the b sis in Krishn 7iBs te chin1s. Th tBs <h t I * s yin12 y#$ see. RH0 '$t s y s#*eb#dy else c *e t# *e2 s y sch#l r2 #r +ers#n <h# <#r=ed in the s *e %ield2 nd h d this #ther inter+ret ti#n2 <hy c nBt I <h# h ?e listened t# Krishn 7i2 t l= t# hi* <h# d#esnBt =n#< nythin1 b#$t Krishn 7i nd +#int #$t2 brin1 Krishn 7i s ne< s$b7ectA Y#$ see2 <h t I d#nBt < nt t# c$t #$t is brin1in1 Krishn 7i t# s#*eb#dy <h# h s n# cl$e t# it2 nd h snBt e?en he rd his n *e #r nythin1. '$t the i*+$lse c#*es %r#* *e2 n#t %r#* hi*. S"0 Yes2 b$t <hy <#$ld th t +ers#n c#*e t# this +l ceA RH0 @ell he * y h ?e *et *e2 he * y h ?e h d s#*e c#**#n interest in s#*e sch#l rly <#r=. S"0 Y#$ see i% s#*e#ne < nts t# c#*e in nd i% I h ?e <ritten s#*e b##= nd s#*e#ne < nts t# c#*e nd s+end s#*e ti*e <ith *e E ri1htA I <ill s y %ine2 nd +e#+le h ?e d#ne th t. Ri1htA E n#t th t I h ?e <ritten b##= b$t they =n#< *e +ers#n lly2 s# they c n c#*e nd they c n st y t 'r#c=<##d. RH0 '$t n#t t the St$dy Centre. S"0 '$t n#t in the St$dy Centre. There re +l ces in 'r#c=<##d <here they c n c#*e nd st y. @e ,,.

h ?e the cl#isters b$ildin1s2 there re #ther +l ces. I% I c n 7$st 1# #n. "#r inst nce2 t# 1i?e y#$ n e4 11er ted c se0 *y + rents2 ri1ht2 c#*e nd i% they c#*e nd st y t 'r#c=<##d I <#$ld n#t h ?e the* st y in the St$dy. RH0 '$t Sc#tt2 I h ?e %riends <h# % ll int# th t c te1#ry2 cert inly I h ?e %riends <h# % ll int# th t c te1#ry <h# h ?e n#thin1 t# d# <ith Krishn 7i2 they c#*e nd ?isit *e. And I <#$ld n#t +$t the* in the St$dy Centre2 b$t there re #ther +e#+le <h# I *i1ht < nt t# +$t in the St$dy Centre2 th#$1h they h ?e n#thin1 t# d# <ith Krishn 7i. S"0 @ell2 this is <here <e <#$ld di%%er2 y#$ see. I <#$ld h ?e #nly th#se +e#+le <h# re interested2 %#r #ne re s#n #r n#ther2 * y be they re rdent C th#lics #r rdent '$ddhists2 #r rdent <h te?er2 b$t they h ?e c#*e bec $se s#*ethin1 b#$t <h t the te chin1s h ?e s id interests the*. And s# they re c#*in1 there t# %ind #$t b#$t E bec $se it is #nly %r#* th t th t <e re 1#in1 t# 1ener te n t*#s+here2 <hich is the #ne th t <e < nt t# h ?e in this Centre2 the St$dy Centre. Other<ise it c n t$rn int# =ind #% reli1i#$s s*#r1 sb#rd. E?eryb#dy <h# is interested in nythin1 they thin= is s cred is 1#in1 t# c#*e there ... RH0 N#b#dy < nts th t. S"0 E4 ctly. It h s 1#t E i% it is 1#in1 t# h ?e n t*#s+here it is 1#in1 t# h ?e n t*#s+here bec $se +e#+le re l##=in1 t s#*ethin1 t#1ether. And then th t thin1 they re l##=in1 t t#1ether h s t# d# <ith the te chin1s. I% s#*e#ne is there nd they re interested in 1#in1 int# the T#r h bec $se they re Je<ish2 nd s#*e#ne else is interested in '$ddhis*2 nd s#*e#ne else is interested in S int A$1$stine2 nd (#d =n#<s <h t2 then y#$ h ?e n t*#s+here <hich is 7$st... RH0 N#2 n#b#dy < nts th t. S"0 '$t this is <hy I s y the #nly thin1 th t is 1#in1 t# +re?ent th t is i% y#$ h ?e e?ery#ne <h# is there is interested in Krishn 7iBs te chin1s. M y be interested in rel ti#n t# s#*ethin1 else b$t interested in the te chin1s. RH0 @ell t s#*e le?el I 1ree <ith y#$. I 1ree <ith y#$ essenti lly. '$t I <#$ld ls# 1i?e +l ce t# +e#+le <h# d#nBt =n#< nd y#$ %eel h ?e +#ssibility2 <h# * y e?en +retend n#t t# be interested2 #r ct$ lly * y n#t be interested2 b$t #ne * y %eel +#ssibilities. S"0 Then h ?e the* st y s#*e +l ce else nd t l= <ith the*. H ?e the* st y E y#$ =n#<2 y#$ h ?e 1#t the ne< 1$est h#$se2 y#$ h ?e 1#t this #ld 1$est h#$se. Y#$ h ?e 1#t +l ces %#r +e#+le t# st y2 s# h ?e the* c#*e here nd t l= <ith the*. K0 All ri1ht2 ll ri1ht2 ll ri1ht. He < nted t# he r *y ?#ice. S"0 He is still there t the <ind#<. K0 All ri1ht2 ll ri1ht. ItBs ll ri1ht <e re t l=in1 t#1ether. M y <eA All ri1ht. He < nts t# be ss$red th t I * here2 bec $se <e t l=ed t# e ch #ther in the *#rnin12 the %tern##n. All ri1ht. N#< letBs c rry #n. @h t d# y#$ s y SirA >0 I * inclined t# 1ree <ith R dhi= th t I d#nBt thin= <e sh#$ld e4cl$de s#*e +e#+le. "#r e4 *+le2 <h t re the te chin1s b#$tA The te chin1s re b#$t li%e. S#*e +e#+le2 #r + rtic$l r +ers#n * y h ?e ++r# ched li%e in + rtic$l r < y b$t their interest is in li%e. S# they c#*e nd ,,C

th t is the +#int <here <e *eet. S"0 @h t <#$ld they c#*e %#rA >0 3e#+le d# c#*e t# h ?e te chin1s. S"0 Yes2 <hy n#t. >0 Y#$ *e n t# s y #nce y#$ h ?e d#+ted cert in < y #% li%e y#$ <ill ne?er ch n1e %r#* th tA S"0 N#. I% they re c#*in1 bec $se they h ?e he rd #% Krishn 7i nd they re interested in th t < y #% li%e2 then th t is %ine. >0 N#2 n# l##=. I d#nBt <ish t# be +ers#n l Sir. @hen I c *e t# R dhi= I h d he rd Krishn *$rti2 t<ice2 nd 7$st re d #ne bi#1r +hy nd he rd +e#+le t l=in1 here nd %elt th t I < s interested in this <#r=. They ll#<ed *e t# st rt. I% they h d n#t ll#<ed *e t# st rt 7$st bec $se I did n#t h ?e en#$1h =n#<led1e b#$t KBs b##=s ... S"0 It is n#t D$esti#n #% en#$1h =n#<led1e. '$t y#$ h d re d s#*ethin12 y#$ <ere interested in it. >0 '$t I h d re d th#$s nds #% #ther b##=s #n #ther s$b7ects. RH0 '$t I <#$ld li=e t# s y s#*ethin12 the r1$*ent see*s t# hin1e #n <hether <e +$t the % ith in de%initi#ns2 #r in the h$* n bein1s. This is h#< I see it. @hether the % ith sh#$ld be re+#sed in h$* n bein1s #r in de%initi#ns. S"0 N#. The di%%erence is in the centr l intenti#n2 bec $se n# * tter <h t y#$ d# it is 1#in1 t# de+end #n h$* n bein1s. @hether <e re h ?in12 cre tin1 +l ces <hich re #% s y 1ener l interest. Here * y be <e h ?e 1r#$+ #% '$ddhists nd <e thin= #h2 these '$ddhists re ?ery reli1i#$s +e#+le2 nd they < nt t# h ?e c#n%erence #% '$ddhists #n '$ddhis* nd s# they c#*e t# $s. Or <e s y2 l##= <e h ?e l#?ely +l ce2 <hy d#nBt y#$ c#*e nd h ?e y#$r c#n%erence #n '$ddhis* in #$r +l ce. And I <#$ld s y t# th t2 n#. I <#$ld s y i% there is 1r#$+ #% '$ddhists <h# * y h ?e re d #ne + r 1r +h #% the te chin1s b$t they thin= this is s#*ethin1 interestin12 I <#$ld li=e t# l##= *#re t this thin1. I <#$ld li=e t# re d the ne4t + r 1r +h. Th t is en#$1h. They re c#*in1 there t# in?esti1 te %$rther int# these * tters. RH0 N#< Krishn 7i in?ites +e#+le %r#* ll < l=s #% li%e. Sh#$ld <e h ?e the s *e %reed#*2 #r n#tA )etBs +$t it di%%erently. Krishn 7i h s in?ited nyb#dy2 ll < l=s #% li%e2 +e#+le c#*e %r#* ll < l=s #% li%e. Sh#$ld <e h ?e the s *e %reed#* #r n#t. Th t is the D$esti#n. K0 All ri1ht. All ri1ht. S"0 They c#*e %r#* ll < l=s #% li%e nd they still d# bec $se +e#+le %r#* ll < l=s #% li%e re interested in the te chin1s. And <hen Krishn 7i t l=s t# +e#+le Krishn 7i t l=s t# the* b#$t the te chin1s. RH0 Yes2 b$t c#$ldnBt <e d# th tA Sh#$ldnBt <e d# th tA S"0 Th t is <h t I s y. Th t is <h t the +l ces re %#r. They re n#t t# h ?e t l=s #n s#*ethin1 else. ,,/ l##= t the <#r=2 th t there is cert in < y #% li%e2 by K nd his

They re t# h ?e t l=s #n the te chin1s. N#< i% s#*e#ne is n#t interested ... RH0 O% c#$rse2 #% c#$rse. S"0 I% s#*e#ne is n#t interested in the te chin1s they <#$ldnBt c#*e here t# t l= <ith Krishn 7i. >0 3e#+le c#*e t# the Centre2 s y %#r <ee=2 ten d ys2 three *#nths. They <#$ld < nt t# st$dy Krishn *$rti2 listen t# the c ssettes2 see the ?ide# c ssettes2 en1 1e in disc$ssi#n <ith s#*e #% $s. I thin= th t <#$ld be the * in thin1. '$t the b c=1r#$nd ... !In $dible2 ll t l=in1 t #nce.& S"0 @ell I * 7$st... s l#n1 s <e d#nBt s y2 l##= this is %#r ny cti?ity th t <e thin= s s cred. >0 O% c#$rse n#t2 #% c#$rse n#t. S"0 It is n#t %#r ny cti?ity <hich s#*e#ne thin=s #% s s cred. >0 N#2 n#. S"0 It is %#r nythin1 <hich is rel ted t# the te chin1s. Then th t is %ine. K0 Sir2 letBs be cle r2 y#$ nd I. I% I $nderst nd y#$2 nd y#$ $nderst nd *e. I * $sin1 the <#rd $nderst nd. He is insistin1 th t these Centres sh#$ld be e4cl$si?ely2 e4cl$si?ely in D$#tes2 %#r KBs te chin1s. I 1# there t# $nderst nd2 st$dy2 he r2 t l= <ith #thers <h# re in the s *e h#$se2 <h# re ls# ++ rently interested in the s *e thin1. And I c#*e there. N#t t# st$dy '$ddhis* #r ny #ther Bis*B. I c#*e there. And Sc#tt is insistin1 #n th t. My b c=1r#$nd * y be '$ddhis* #r Christi nity2 Christi n Science2 #r 3resbyt ri n #r nythin1 else2 b$t I c#*e there t# $nderst nd <h t K is t l=in1 b#$t. T# st$dy2 t# listen2 t# $nderst nd nd t# disc$ss2 bec $se y#$ re ls# there. Y#$ c n s y2 l##= <h t d#es he *e n by this2 I d#nBt 1ree. @e disc$ss it. N#<2 y#$ nd R dhi= 7i re s yin1 they * y be interested. I c#*e %r#* % r < y2 *y interests re in Isl *. Anyh#< d#nBt b#ther. An Isl *ic * n c#*es there2 his b c=1r#$nd is s# str#n1 in Isl * th t he s ys I <ill dd this t# th t. I <ill dd K t# th t. '$t th t is his b c=1r#$nd. He <#nBt ch n1e E ri1htA A1reeA S# sh#$ld he c#*eA >0 Sir2 re <e +res$*in1 <hen he c#*es th t he <#nBt ch n1eA In this <e re +res$*in1 th t he <#nBt ch n1e. @hy sh#$ld <e +res$*e th t he <#nBt ch n1eA K0 I d#nBt ss$*e. >0 He *i1ht2 #r he *i1ht n#t. And there%#re <e h ?e t# 1i?e hi* ccess. K0 Yes2 I $nderst nd <h t y#$ re s yin1. '$t is th t the +l ceA >0 @here else <ill he 1et n #++#rt$nityA K0 He is s yin1 in?ite hi* nd =ee+ hi* < y here. )et hi* *eet y#$ ll2 b$t =ee+ th t2 i% I $nderst nd hi* ri1htly2 he c n c#*e there nd listen b$t he c nBt st y there. S"0 Krishn 7i I * s yin1 s#*ethin1 else. I * s yin1 ls# th t i% this * n is interested in %indin1 #$t *#re #% <h t Krishn 7i s ys2 then I s y he h s +#ssibility #% ch n1e2 then I <ill n#t +res$*e ,,-

th t he c nBt ch n1e. '$t i% he d#es n#t h ?e this interest in %indin1 #$t <h t Krishn 7i t l=s b#$t2 then I s y s#rry. I <ill +res$*e. >0 In th t c se Sir th t <ill h ?e t# de+end $+#n the 7$d1e*ent #% the +e#+le t th t ti*e <ith res+ect t# th t indi?id$ l. H#< c n y#$ de%ine it n#<A S"0 '$t the 7$d1e*ent <ill be b sed #n n#t <hether #r n#t he is interested in the s cred2 <h te?er th t * y be2 the interest E I * +erh +s #b7ectin1 t## *$ch t# y#$r < ntin1 t# * =e it nythin1 th t is c#nsidered s cred E b$t his interest <ill be in the te chin1s2 in %indin1 #$t *#re b#$t the te chin1s. K0 Sir2 renBt y#$ bein1 ... RH0 '$t Sir there re * ny c ses <hen #ne sees s#*eb#dy E I s < tic=et * ster2 I <ent t# t =e Mrs. E t# the b$s st ti#n nd I s < * n there2 nd he h d s$ch nice % ce2 he < s sellin1 tic=ets2 nd I %elt h#< sensiti?e2 s$ch nice % ce2 I s id <h t is this * n d#in1 sellin1 tic=ets. And +erh +s i% I h d *et hi* s#*eti*e I *i1ht h ?e s=ed <hy d#nBt y#$ E this is n e4 11er ted c se E b$t I %elt li=e s yin1 th t * n is l#st here. This =ind #% thin1. S"0 'rin1 hi* t# this +l ce. )et hi* E i% he c#*es here nd he is st yin1 in the ne< 1$est h#$se2 #r s#*ethin1 else2 nd he l##=s nd then he s ys2 *y 1##dness this is n e4tr #rdin ry +l ce y#$ h ?e here2 h#< did it 1et t# be s# e4tr #rdin ryA And y#$ 1i?e hi* b##=. And he c#*es b c= %ter< rds nd he s ys2 this b##= < s bs#l$tely % b$l#$s. I *e n I < nt t# %ind #$t *#re b#$t this. Then I <#$ld s y c#*e nd st y. RH0 I thin= there is s#*e tr$th t# th t ls#. '$t s I l##= t it this <h#le +l ce is s cred. "#r *e ... S"0 '$t y#$ h ?e l#t #% +e#+le here2 st$dents nd d$lts2 <h# h ?e n# interest in the te chin1s. S# <here s I 1ree this <h#le +l ce is s cred2 y#$ h ?e n#t s id th t e?eryb#dy <h# c#*es here *$st h ?e n interest in the te chin1s. '$t %#r th t #ne +l ce2 th t + rt #% it2 <hich sh#$ld s#*eh#< be the 1ener tin1 %#rce #% the <h#le thin12 it sh#$ld be <here the thin1 is =e+t t its +$rest. Th t +l ce sh#$ld be ... K0 All ri1ht. All ri1ht. S"0 .. .li=e the s nct$* s nct#r$*2 it sh#$ld be the +l ce %r#* <hich the #ther thin1s s+rin1. >0 The $se #% th t +hr se brin1s t# *y *ind the ri1idity t# <hich the te*+les <ere s$b7ected2 nd th t < s ne1 ti?e % ct#r. Th t $nless y#$ belie?ed in th t deity y#$ <#$ld n#t be ll#<ed t# enter the te*+le. And th t < s ne1 ti?e. K0 ArenBt y#$ Sc#tt * =in1 it t## n rr#<A S"0 I d#nBt thin= s# Sir. I thin= it is #nly <ith th t <e <ill +r#tect #$rsel?es %r#* bec#*in1 <ishy < shy E y#$ =n#< there re s# * ny +l ces Sir <hich e4ist in the <#rld n#< <here e?erythin1 1#es. K0 I =n#<2 I =n#<2 e?erythin1 1#es. S"0 'ec $se it is ll reli1i#$s isnBt itA It is ll h ?in1 t# d# <ith the s cred nd Krishn *$rti nd ,96

'$ddh nd Jes$s nd M#h **ed2 they <ere ll s yin1 the s *e thin12 nd it is s# <#nder%$l E s# y#$ c n st$dy nythin1 bec $se it is ll the s *e2 nd <e re ll 1#in1 in the s *e directi#n2 nd it is ll s# terri%ic. And t# h ?e E t# +re?ent E nd there is tendency lre dy Sir2 there is c#nst nt tendency %#r th t t# h ++en. K0 I =n#< th t ?ery <ell. S"0 And i% <e d#nBt st rt #%% <ith cle r ide th t this is %#r the te chin1s2 it is 1#in1 t# bec#*e this h#*#1eniGed blend #% e?eryb#dyBs ide s #% <h t the reli1i#$s is. RH0 M y I s y s#*ethin1A There re d n1ers in b#th. A h#*#1ene#$s * ss2 nd the sec#nd is bec#*in1 ri1id thr#$1h de%initi#ns. S# <e re 7$st E I * e4 11er tin1 the d n1ers #% #ne +#siti#n2 nd y#$ re e4 11er tin1 the #ther. I d#nBt =n#< h#< <e c n res#l?e this. S"0 It <#$ldnBt be strict nd ri1id in the sense2 Krishn 7i th t e?eryb#dy h s t# %eel th t the te chin1s re the #nly thin1. K0 I d#nBt nyh#<. All ri1ht. (# #n. S"0 All <e re s yin1 is th t +e#+le <ill c#*e there %#r #nly #ne thin12 <hich is t# +$rs$e2 h#<e?er they %eel is ++r#+ri te2 their interest in the te chin1s. RH0 M y I s y s#*ethin1A Sir2 the di%%erence * y lie in the % ct th t I d#nBt see the St$dy Centre s the s nct$* s nct#r$* I see the <h#le +l ce +er? din1 nd ... S"0 3erh +s the s nct$* s nct#r$* isnBt the ri1ht <#rd b$t itBs ... RH0 ... +er*e tin1 e?en the n#nEbelie?ers2 e?erythin12 enc#*+ ssin1 it. This is *y %eelin1. I d#nBt see the St$dy Centre s e4cl$si?e2 in this +l ce2 in Rishi ; lley. I d#nBt li=e < lls. It is 7$st ? 1$e %eelin1. And I * s$re the d n1ers th t y#$ +#int #$t re cert inly inherent. K0 )##=2 * y I +#int #$t s#*ethin1 else. 'r#c=<##d h s n#< bec#*e n intern ti#n l 1 therin1 +l ce. There is n# *#re S nen2 s# 'r#c=<##d. 'r#c=<##d n#< is sch##l2 e4ce+t %#r 1 therin1s <hich h ++en #nce ye r. S# %r#* <h t Sc#tt is s yin1 E I * n#t t =in1 his side #r n#t E there *$st be +l ce <here 1 therin1s2 sch##ls2 they re ll ri1ht2 b$t there is s#*ethin1 th t is n#t e4cl$si?e2 n#t li*ited2 n#t +$t < ll r#$nd it nd s#rry y#$ c nBt c#*e in2 #nly thr#$1h this 1 te. He is s yin1 this 1ener l s+re d2 sch##l2 1 therin12 * y $lti* tely destr#y the <h#le thin1. RH0 Oh yes2 #% c#$rse. K0 ... s# his +#int is2 %r#* <h t I 1 ther2 this is the 1 therin1 <hich is +retty bi1 %% ir2 nd the sch##l ls# is bi1 %% ir2 these t<# re s+re din1 the te chin1s2 d#in1 e?erythin12 b$t here <e < nt it c#ncentr ted. Th tBs ll. Ri1ht. Are y#$ #++#sed t# th tA N#. Y#$ re n#t #++#sed t# th t. RH0 N#2 Sir. K0 'en res is n#t. 'en res h s 1#t sch##l. It <ill h ?e 1 therin1 +r#b bly #r s#*ethin1 #r #ther2 nd this +l ce <here the s#ldiers 1r ?es re2 y#$ h ?e been there2 this +l ce s ys enter here i% y#$ li=e2 b$t enter t# st$dy.

,9,

RH0 Yes2 #% c#$rse. K0 T# <#r=2 t# %ind #$t. N#t c s$ lly. Th t is ll he is s yin1. RH0 Th t2 #% c#$rse. >0 3e#+le re c s$ l2 nd s#*eti*es <e * =e *ist =e. Y#$ send the* < y in ten d ys. RH0 )ess th n th t. >0 I% they re n#t the ri1ht +e#+le y#$ send the* < y. K0 Yes2 yes. Y#$ h ?e t# h ?e c#**ittee nd ll th t. Dr30 I <#$ld li=e t# s=2 listenin1 t# this2 <hy h s the need %#r St$dy Centre c#*e $+A I% the +l ces2 s they re t#d y2 re *e nt %#r KBs te chin1s2 the sch##l * y be d#in1 c de*ic <#r= b$t +ri* rily they be1 n %#r the te chin1s2 nd they h ?e str$ct$res <here +e#+le c n c#*e nd st y li=e 1$est h#$ses2 %#r e tin12 etc. They h ?e libr ries2 they h ?e b##=s t# re d2 etc. @hy is this necessity %#r ne< ... K0 N#2 Sir2 I <#$ld s y it is n#t s#*ethin1 ne< #r necessity ... !T +e t$rns #?er& S"0 St rt th t 1 in +le se bec $se y#$ <ere s yin1 s#*ethin1 i*+#rt nt. K0 Sir2 s I see it2 St$dy Centre h s bec#*e necessity bec $se th t is the +l ce <here the tre s$re is. Ri1htA The tre s$re. "r#* th t tre s$re y#$ c n dr <. Y#$ $nderst ndA Y#$ c n dr < y#$r stren1th2 y#$ c n dr < y#$r ener1y2 y#$ c n dr < y#$r s$sten nce2 n#$rish*ent nd s# #n. Sch##ls h ?e their li*it ti#ns E ri1htA Here2 I d#nBt =n#< h#< t# +$t it2 here is s#*ethin1 th t is s cred2 letBs c ll it %#r the *#*ent. And %r#* th t e?erythin1 %l#<s. Dr30 Sc#tt s=ed in rel ti#n t# these D$esti#ns2 <h t is there in the St$dy Centre <hich <ill enh nce the sch##lsA K0 Th t de+ends #n the +e#+le <h# c#*e there. Dr30 S# in th t c#nte4t <e <ere disc$ssin1 <h t =ind #% +e#+le. K0 Th t c#*es little l ter. @e < nt St$dy Centre here nd 'en res. And <hy d# <e < nt itA Th t is <h t y#$ re s=in1. I <#$ld s y yes2 %#r ?ery si*+le re s#n0 sch##l2 nd the +e#+le <h# c#*e t# the sch##l2 <h# c#*e ls# bec $se they re interested in the te chin1s2 h ?enBt the ti*e2 h ?enBt the ... i% I 1# t# the cl ss e?eryd y I <#$ldnBt h ?e the ener1y t# 1# $+ there nd st$dy. I * y be interested2 I * y st$dy by *ysel% b$t I c#*e %r#* ... I d#nBt =n#< <here2 it d#esnBt * tter2 %r#* the % r S#$th2 nd I s y I he r there is +l ce <here I c n 1# nd enD$ire int# KB s te chin1s. I c nBt c#*e t# the sch##l nd s y2 +le se. Y#$ $nderst nd SirA Th tBs the re s#n I %eel it is i*+#rt nt. >0 One th#$1ht < s c#*in10 inste d #% c llin1 St$dy Centre c ll it The Centre. K0 @h te?er y#$ li=e t# c ll it. ,99

S"0 Sir2 I <#$ld h ?e s id2 t le st in ter*s #% 'r#c=<##d2 nd I <#$ld h ?e th#$1ht +erh +s in ter*s #% the #ther sch##ls here s <ell2 th t <e r$n the ris= #% bein1 7$st sch##ls. K0 I =n#<2 th t is <h t I * %r id #%. Y#$ $nderst nd SirA S"0 And the thin1 <hich h s t# d te =e+t $s %r#* bein1 7$st sch##ls is the te chin1s. And the #nly thin1 th t <ill +re?ent $s in the %$t$re %r#* bec#*in1 7$st sch##ls2 is the s *e thin1. K0 I $nderst nd Sir. N#< it is %inished.

JSelected <ith *ini*$* editin1 %r#* ?erb tiin tr nscri+t0 J.Krisbn *$rti disc$ssin1 <ith Sc#tt "#rbes2 R dhi= HerGber1er2 T.K 3 rch$re nd #thers2 Rishi ; lley2 Dece*ber ,-2 ,-/5. Tr nscribed2 ty+ed nd chec=ed by J ne H **#nd2 M rch 962 ,-/.K

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What *ind o& Centre?

K0 N#< the ne4t D$esti#n is0 @h t =ind #% Centre is it 1#in1 t# beA D# y#$ e4+ect +e#+le t# c#*e nd st y there + rt %r#* the sch##ls. RH0 @e h#+e s# Sir. @e re n#t s$re b$t <e h#+e s#. K0 N#. The *#*ent y#$ s y th t <e <ill h ?e r##*s nd ll the rest #% it2 ll +e#+le <ill c#*e there bec $se it is #ne #% the c tch +#ints. RH0 Yes. K0 It <ill ttr ct +e#+le. Y#$ =n#<2 it <ill bec#*e n shr * nd ll th t n#nsense. S# <#$ld y#$ < nt +e#+le t# c#*e nd st y thereA 'r#c=<##d h s rr n1ed %#r t<enty +e#+le t# c#*e nd st y there. @#$ld y#$ < nt itA RH0 Yes Sir. K0 N#< <h# <ill t =e ch r1e #% itA S y %#r inst nce in 'en res2 there is U+ s ni2 M hesh7i2 Dr.Krishn 2 nd S ty is 1#in1 there. @ill it be the c#**ittee t# in?ite2 t# 7$d1e2 t# s y n#2 s#rry y#$ c nBt st y2 y#$ c n st yA D# y#$ < nt c#**ittee li=e th t hereA RH0 @e h ?e c#**ittee. K0 Oh <ell2 th tBs ll ri1ht2 the * n 1e*ent c#**ittee. >0 @e h ?e c#**ittee b$t she s ys <e <ill n#t t =e ll the +e#+le %r#* * n 1e*ent c#**ittee2 * ybe three #r %#$r %r#* the * n 1e*ent c#**ittee <ill l##= %ter this. K0 I $nderst nd. N#< <h t re the r$lesA N#t r$les2 y#$ $nderst nd <h t I *e nA I c#*e here2 I c#*e t# the St$dy Centre2 I h ?e t =en l#n1 tri+2 c r2 b$s2 tr in. I c#*e here2 l#?ely +l ce2 I h ?e retired2 I * si4ty nd s y t# *ysel%2 *y 1#d2 <h t l#?ely +l ce this is. I <ill t l= b#$t the te chin1s2 I * <%$lly interested in the te chin1s2 s+end +erh +s n h#$r there2 b$t I <#$ld li=e t# 1# r#$nd it. H#< <ill y#$ decideA >0 Decide #n the +e#+le <h# re c#*in12 #r. .. A K0 The +e#+le re c#*in1. I h ?e c#*e %r#* !A&2 #r %r#* )$c=n#<. A l#n1 dist nce. It is * r?ell#$s +l ce2 c##l2 +le s nt2 nice +e#+le2 nd I h ?e retired. >0 @e d#nBt e4+ect retired +e#+le t# t$rn $+. RH0 Sir2 <e d#nBt ll#< +e#+le t# retire there. K0 H#< <ill y#$ +re?ent itA Th t is <h t I * s=in1 y#$. >0 They <ill c#*e2 I s$++#se ... RH0 @e <ill +$t li*it #n the *#nths +ers#n st ys there. ,9:

>0 @e s y y#$ c n st y here %#r <ee= t# three *#nths nd then s$b7ect t# y#$r bein1 %#$nd ... K0 Sir2 s# I <ill +l y $+ t# y#$. >0 Th t is +#ssible. K0 I <ill +l y $+. I <ill s y yes2 I <ill st$dy2 I <ill s+end n h#$r E bec $se y#$ c nBt st$dy *#re th n n h#$r. RH0 S# then y#$ +$t d#<n r$le th t s ys n# #ne c#*es %#r *#re th n three *#nths2 #r si4 *#nths. K0 @h t is the li*itA RH0 Sir <e h ?enBt disc$ssed it yet b$t i% y#$ h ?e disc$ssed it * ybe y#$ c n s$11est li*it. K0 @h t h ?e y#$ decided A S"0 @ell <e h ?e decided th t t<# #r three <ee=s2 e4ce+t %#r D$ite e4tr #rdin ry indi?id$ ls. 'ec $se t# be seri#$s b#$t this %#r t<# #r three <ee=s is lre dy 1#in1 t# be ... K0 ...+retty tires#*e. S"0 ...+retty tires#*e. E4ce+t %#r2 s <e s y2 e4tr #rdin ry. RH0 Th t is 1##d en#$1h. >0 J$st *#nth. K0 N#. Yes. RH0 T<# <ee=s2 <h te?er2 it is 1##d en#$1h. >0 One <ee= t# #ne *#nth. >0 One <ee= t# #ne *#nth. RH0 Or t<enty %#$r h#$rsL K0 Y#$ c n s+#t the*. Ri1htA S"0 Yes Sir. I *e n #ne < y #% l##=in1 t it2 is th t t the *#*ent there re +l ns %#r %#$r bedr##*s2 is th t c#rrectA S y %#$r bedr##*s. RH0 N#2 th#se s#Ec lled st$dies re c#n?erted int# bedr##*s2 c n be c#n?erted int# bedr##*s. S"0 @ell h#< * ny bedr##*sA RH0 "#$r nd t<#2 si4. And <e h ?e E I sh#<ed Mr (r#he the +l ns %#r l#< c#st h#$sin1 ls#. S"0 H#< * ny t#t l bedr##*sA

,95

RH0 De+endin1 #n h#< the *#ney r$ns2 bec $se these re se+ r te. S"0 All ri1ht2 letBs s y ten2 ri1htA RH0 Yes. S"0 Ten. RH0 Ten2 #r * ybe t<el?e. S"0 All ri1ht2 t<el?e. Then i% y#$ ll#< e?eryb#dy t# st y %#r *#nth2 then y#$ re #nly 1#in1 t# be ble t# h ?e h$ndred nd %#rty %#$r +e#+le in ye r. And #$t #% se?en h$ndred *illi#n +e#+le in Indi 2 d# y#$ thin= th t there re #nly 1#in1 t# be #ne h$ndred nd %#rty %#$r +e#+le <h# re interestedA >0 I% y#$ re 1#in1 t# be selecti?e2 yes. RH0 )ess th n h$ndred nd %#rty %#$r in ye r. S"0 '$t l##=2 t the s *e ti*e2 l##= t the n$*ber #% +e#+le th t re dr <n t# the t l=s. "#$r th#$s nd in '#*b y2 three th#$s nd in M dr s E h#< * ny +e#+leA Y#$ h ?e 1#t th#$s nds #% +e#+le in Indi <h# re interested. Th#$s nds. S# re y#$ s yin1 th t #$t #% the th#$s nds <h# t =e the tr#$ble t# c#*e t# the t l=s there *i1ht #nly be h$ndred nd %#rty %#$r <h# re interestedA RH0 N#t e?en th t. @e <#$ld select n#t e?en h$ndred nd %#rty %#$r. >0 M y be h$ndred +e#+le t# st rt <ith. RH0 N# Sc#tt. >0 I% <e re 1#in1 t# be selecti?e2 <e h#+e t# be selecti?e. RH0 N#. I <#$ld s y h$ndred nd %#rty %#$r is t## l r1e. S"0 Then they c n st y %#r *#nth2 there is n# +r#ble*. Dr30 There < s n nn#$nce*ent in the !A& b#$t cc#**#d ti#n ? il ble t ; s nt ;ih r %#r +e#+le <h# re interested in the te chin1s. @hile y#$ re there nd t l=s re 1#in1 #n there it is <#rth<hile =n#<in1 h#< * ny +e#+le ++lied t# ; s nt ;ih r t# h ?e cc#**#d ti#n. In si4 *#nths n#thin1. S"0 Re llyA >0 S#*e +e#+le did t$rn $+ there. Dr30 They t$rned $+ b$t n#t %#r st yin1. >0 They <ere in?ited %#r + rtic$l r +r#1r **e. S"0 It is interestin1 y#$ see bec $se in the <est <e h ?e +e#+le <h# re lly re interested. @e h ?e ,9.

l#t #% +e#+le <h# <ill c#*e. I *e n there re +e#+le <h# s ?e $+ ll their *#ney n#<2 ll the ye r l#n12 nd t =e the #nly ? c ti#n ti*e they h ?e2 t# c#*e nd he r the t l=s in 'r#c=<##d #r in S nen. They s+end ll the *#ney th t they h ?e been ble t# s ?e t# c#*e t# the te chin1s2 t# he r the te chin1s. And +e#+le2 the res+#nse th t <e h ?e h d %#r the st$dy s# % r h s been en#r*#$s. >0 YesA S"0 Yes. Dr30 I thin= there is 1#in1 t# be di%%erent sit$ ti#n in 'r#c=<##d nd Indi . K0 Yes. >0 Y#$ see there re t<# thin1s th t li*it. They c nBt e?en i% they < nt it2 they c nBt %%#rd t# + y the *#ney nd c#*e. And i% y#$ re selecti?e2 th t is 1#in1 t# +$t li*it. I thin= t# st rt <ith %#r the %irst ye r <e <ill n#t 1et *#re th n %i%ty #r si4ty +e#+le. K0 I thin= the *#*ent it is =n#<n2 'en res nd this2 it <ill be in$nd ted. S"0 I thn= s#. I thin= s#. RH0 Des+ite the st tisticsA Dr30 There * y be re cti#n i% there is n#b#dy then they <ill r$n %#r ... There is the %in nces2 the dist nces2 the le?el #% s#ciety they c#*e %r#*. RH0 @e <ill +r#b bly % ce +r#ble* %#r +e#+le <h# < nt t# c#*e %r#* br# d bec $se <e h ?e n# *e ns #% 7$d1in1. Alre dy <e h ?e +r#ble*. 3e#+le <rite nd y#$ d#nBt re lly h ?e cl$e <h t they re li=e. And th t is 1#in1 t# be * 7#r +r#ble* %#r $s. K0 M ny +e#+le h ?e t#ld *e0 Sir2 I <ish y#$ <#$ld st y in #ne +l ce nd I <#$ld then c#*e there2 s+end l#t #% ti*e. '$t the *#*ent they =n#< th t there is s$ch +l ce <here E y#$ =n#< ll the rest <h t <e h ?e t l=ed b#$t E I * s$re there <ill be d#Gens 1#in1 t# c#*e. Dr30 In <hich c se <e * y h ?e t# red$ce the +eri#d #% #ne *#nth #r three <ee=s2 t# t<# <ee=s #r #ne <ee=2 de+endin1. Th t c n be ch n1ed. >0 @e need n#t %i4 th t +eri#d. K0 N#2 d#nBt %i4 nythin1 b#$t th t. S"0 N#2 b$t I #nly br#$1ht this $+ bec $se i% y#$ thin= #% h ?in1 +e#+le st y %#r si4 *#nths2 the n$*ber #% +e#+le y#$ c n h ?e is s# s* ll th t... K0 All ri1ht2 ll ri1ht. D# y#$ < nt t# c#*e inA S"0 He d#es. K0 I <ill #+en th t <ind#<2 he <ill +ee+ in thr#$1h there. S"0 He <ill c#*e in. ,9C

K0 N#t s# *$ch then he <ill c#*e ri1ht in. There. I h ?e tried the* ll. D# y#$ ch r1e the*A Or is it ll %reeA RH0 @e h ?e t# ch r1e the*. '$t i% there is s#*eb#dy <h# c nBt + y <e <ill ... K0 @here <ill they e tA RH0 They <ill h ?e their #<n =itchen2 I *e n 7#int =itchen. K0 I *e n the St$dy Centre <ill h ?e its #<n =itchenA S"0 Yes Sir. And +e#+le <ill E s y#$ s id2 +e#+le c nBt st$dy ll d y l#n12 s# they <ill2 s +e#+le n#< c#*e nd hel+ #$t in the =itchen2 they <ill c#*e nd hel+ #$t in the =itchen there2 they <ill hel+ #$t in the 1 rden2 hel+ l##= %ter the +l ce. RH0 Sir2 <e <#$ld li=e t# se+ r te the residences %r#* the st$dy + rt. @e <#$ld li=e t# h ?e s#*e l#< c#st residences < y %r#* the * in2 <here the t +es re2 the D$iet c#$rty rd is. K0 I d#nMt $nderst nd. RH0 Sir2 +e#+le li?e cert in dist nce < y %r#* the st$dy. Th tBs #$r +l n. 3e#+le li?e in #ne +l ce nd the St$dy is little bit se+ r te. '$t the t<# t#1ether %#r* the Centre. S"0 There is #ne residenti l bl#c= nd then there is #ne bl#c= <here +e#+le st$dy. K0 H#< * ny residenti lA RH0 Sir2 I s id th t <#$ld de+end #n h#< % r the *#ney stretches. 'ec $se <e c#$ld ls# dd2 =ee+ ddin1. @e < nt t# h ?e +l n s the *#ney2 the need is there ... K0 They h ?e 1#t s+ ce here2 y#$ h ?enBt 1#t it. RH0 @e <#$ld =ee+ ddin1. >0 T# st rt <ith2 the cc#**#d ti#n is there %#r b#$t ten +e#+leA RH0 Ten. De+endin12 t<el?e. @e h ?enBt th#$1ht b#$t it yet. The #ther residenti l + rt <e <ill see. K0 Th t residenti l + rt is #nly %#r the st$dy2 #r <ill y#$ $se itA RH0 J$st %#r the St$dy2 %#r the St$dy. K0 '$t s$++#se ... RH0 .. .it is n#t %illed. C n + rent c#*e nd st y thereA K0 Th t is d n1er#$s.

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>0 N#2 n#. There is en#$1h cc#**#d ti#n in the 1$est h#$se. RH0 Is th t the D$esti#nA >0 Then it bec#*es 1$est h#$se. RH0 Yes. K0 Th t is <h t I * s=in1. Y#$ re b#$nd by the s+ ce y#$ h ?e. Here there is ... S"0 @ell <e ls# %eel th t *#re th n t<enty2 then <e c nBt re lly h ndle it. It <#$ld bec#*e t## +l yed #$t. RH0 N#2 <e <#$ld ls# li=e t# =ee+ it s* ll. @e <#$ld li=e t# =ee+ it s s* ll s +#ssible. '$t i% the need is l r1er... K0 Only %#r th#se <h# re %#r the St$dy CentreA Or <#$ld y#$ incl$de +e#+le <h# c#*e here t# see their s#ns nd d $1htersA RH0 N#2 Sir2 n#t th t. @h t d# y#$ s y SirA K0 I d#nBt =n#<2 I * n#t here. RH0 '$t + rent <h# is interested c#$ld cert inly st y there. K0 Oh they <ill ll s y2 yes <e re interested. S"0 Yes. RH0 '$t y#$ c nBt c$t the* #%% bec $se they re interested + rents. S"0 Yes b$t 1 in2 I s#$nd li=e br#=en rec#rd. '$t h ?e they c#*e here t# ?isit their s#ns #r h ?e they c#*e here t# st$dy the te chin1sA I% they h ?e c#*e here t# d# b#th then th t is %ine. '$t i% they h ?e re lly c#*e here t# ?isit their s#n then <e s y ... RH0 Th t <ill h ?e t# de+end #n the *#*ent. K0 H#< * ny r##*s <ill y#$ h ?e t the be1innin1A RH0 Ab#$t ten #r t<el?e. S"0 And <h t =ind #% thin1s <ill y#$ h ?e in y#$r2 c ll it2 St$dy bl#c=A RH0 @e <ill h ?e libr ry ... S"0 A libr ry. RH0 @e <ill h ?e t +es2 +l ce %#r t +es. S"0 A t +e r##*. ,9-

RH0 And silent c#$rty rd r#$nd <hich +e#+le c n +r#*en de. And <e *i1ht h ?e2 <e < nt t# h ?e l r1e r##* s# th t y#$ c n l##= t Rishi K#nd . >0 A D$iet r##* y#$ c n c ll it. S"0 A D$iet r##*. S# libr ry2 t +e r##* nd D$iet r##*. RH0 And +l ce <here +e#+le <h# < nt t# d# s#*e <#r= nd sit2 nd <rite2 s$ch st$dy s+ ces. S"0 And s#*e st$dy s+ ces. RH0 Y#$ =n#<2 <ith t ble nd <#r= s+ ce. K0 ;ide#. RH0 '$t Sir <e d#nMt h ?e ?ide#. @e d#nMt h ?e ?ide#. S"0 '$t th t sh#$ld be + rt #% it. RH0 It de+ends #n <hether <e c n b$y. ;ide#s here re ?ery e4+ensi?e. And t# b$ild $+ libr ry <#$ld be ... S"0 '$t th t sh#$ld be in y#$r b$ildin1 c#sts. RH0 @ell <e re +$ttin1 the b$ildin1 E <e h ?e t#ld the rchitects t# b$ild E <e h ?e le%t lee< y E s# ll th#se thin1s <ill h ?e t# c#*e in. '$t ls# t +es %#r $s c n be ?ery e4+ensi?e. S"0 '$t they h ?e t +es t ;is nt ;h r. RH0 Yes2 s# <e c n b#rr#< the*2 <e c nBt h ?e +er* nent libr ry. S"0 '$t they c n * =e c#+ies %#r y#$. They c n * =e c#+ies there nd 1i?e y#$ c#+ies. RH0 '$t it is e4+ensi?e Sc#tt. S"0 Y#$ *e n the r < t +e. RH0 R < t +e +l$s the c#+yin1 c#sts. S"0 '$t the c#+yin1 c#sts they c n d# t ; s nt ;ih r. >0 @e need ?ide# t +es. RH0 '$t th t <e h ?e t# ne1#ti te <ith ; s nt ;ih r. >0 Yes2 th t is ?ery i*+#rt nt. S"0 Yes2 b$t th t <#$ld be + rt #% y#$r b$ildin1 c#sts I <#$ld h ?e th#$1ht. '$t y#$ c n b$y bl n= ?ide# c ssettes in Indi n#<. ,86 bi1 ?ide#

RH0 Als# t the ir+#rt. S"0 I s < the* d?ertised In ' n1 l#re2 M 4<ells2 ?ide# c ssettes. RH0 '$t they re %ri1ht%$lly e4+ensi?e. >0 '$t <e <ill c#llect the*2 ?ide# c ssettes. RH0 @e * y n#t be ble t# h ?e the* ll. S"0 I *e n th t e?en c#$ld be 1##d +r#7ect %#r the %#$nd ti#n t# d#. The %#$nd ti#n I *e n2 be11in1 e?eryb#dyBs + rd#n2 b$t the %#$nd ti#n it <#$ld see* #ne #% their +ri* ry res+#nsibilities sh#$ld be t# +r#?ide these Centres <ith the * teri l. K0 I 1ree Sir. S"0 They %ind the *#ney2 they b$y the ?ide# t +es2 they * =e the c#+ies2 they +r#?ide the*. S y2 this is #$r 7#b. RH0 @e h ?e t# ne1#ti te ll th t. K0 N#. RH0 @ell Sir2 I c nBt s y t# *ysel%2 nn#$nce it. K0 It is the %$ncti#n #% the %#$nd ti#n t# d# th t.

JSelected <ith *ini*$* editin1 %r#* ?erb ti* tr nscri+t0 J.Krishn *$rti disc$ssin1 <ith Sc#tt "#rbes2 Dr R dhi= HerGber1er2 Dr.T.K. 3 rch$re nd %riends #% the Rishi ; lley Sch##l2 Rishi ; lley2 Dece*ber ,-2 ,-/5 Tr nscribed2 ty+ed nd chec=ed by J ne H *rn#nd2 M rch 962 ,-/.K

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)i/#iograph(
. Un+$blished l.Re+#rt #% the Intern ti#n l Tr$steesB Meetin1s2 O7 i2 ,-CC. C#*+iled <ith *ini*$* editin1 %r#* ?erb ti* tr nscri+ts. C#+yri1ht ,-CCO,--6 Krishn *$rti "#$nd ti#n Tr$st )td.2 'r#c=<##d 3 r=2 H *+shire2 UK. 9.J. Krishn *$rti2 F'r#c=<##d T#d y nd in the "$t$re2F ,-/9 8.Krishn *$rti2 F@h t he <#$ld li=e ; s nt ;ih r t# beF2 Disc$ssi#n en r#$te t# Rishi ; lley2 ,-.,,.,-/8. :.FDisc$ssi#n #n the St$dyF2 Sch#nried2 S<itGerl nd2 .th A$1$st ,-/:. 5.F@h t * =es +l ce reli1i#$sAF !Tr nscri+t #% t +e #% s* ll 1r#$+ disc$ssi#n <ith J.Krishn *$rti held t R 71h t "#rt2 ; r n si #n N#?e*ber 962 ,-/:&. ..C#**ittee Meetin1s2 S nen2 ,-th J$ly ,-/5 !Tr nscri+t&. C.J. Krishn *$rti2 Meetin1 <ith the Intern ti#n l C#**ittees2 Sch#nried2 S<itGerl nd2 J$ly ,-/5 !Tr nscri+t&. /.A c#n?ers ti#n bet<een J. Krishn *$rti2 Sc#tt "#rbes2 M ry Ii*b list nd "riedrich (r#he b#$t The St$dy2 Sch#nried2 Cth A$1$st2 ,-/:. -.J. Krishn *$rti2 FThe Krishn *$rti CentreF2 tr nscri+t #% disc$ssi#n <ith Sc#tt "#rbes2 Dr.T.K.3 rch$re2 Dr. R dhi= HerGber1er nd #thers2 Rishi ; lley2 ,-th Dece*ber ,-/5. b03$blished0 ,6.FThe Krishn *$rti St$dyF2 +ulletin ,-2 A$t$*nO@inter2 ,-/:2 Krishn *$rti "#$nd ti#n Tr$st )td.2 En1l nd. ,,.A disc$ssi#n <ith the Intern ti#n l C#**ittees2 +ulletin ,.2 A$t$*nO@inter2 ,-/52 Krishn *$rti "#$nd ti#n Tr$st2 )td.2 En1l nd. ,9.The Krishn *$rti Centre2 Krishn *$rti "#$nd ti#n Tr$st2 )td.2 'r#c=<##d 3 r=2 En1l nd2 !Und ted&. ,8.M ry )$tyens2 Krishn *$rti0 !he /%en 0oor2 )#nd#n0 J#hn M$rr y2 ,-//2 +.C/2 ++ ,9,E,98. ,:.M ry )$tyens2 !he 1ife and 0eath of Krishnamurti2 )#nd#n0 J#hn M$rr y2 ,--62 +,/62 ++ ,-9E ,-8. ,5.,. Krishn *$rti2 FIt is essenti lly ,--5. reli1i#$s +l ceF2 2asanta 2ihar Newsletter 32 N#?e*ber2

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