ADonsLife

MaryBeardwrites"ADon'sLife"reportingonboththemodernandtheancientworld.
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March26,2015

MarciaFurnilla

<
InthelatestintheTLSVoicesseries,TheaLenarduzzi
speakstoHermioneLeeaboutVirginiaWoolf'sdebut
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Iamrespondingheretoarequestforabitmoreinformationaboutthestatueof
MarciaFurnilla.Imeanthesocalled"MarciaFurnilla"MFwasthesecondwifeof
theemperorTitusbut,althoughthehairdomakesthisabouttherightdate,thereisno
reasontosupposethatthisisher.
ShecomesfromRome,ishousedintheNyCarlsbergGlyptotekinCopenhagen,and
iscurrentlyintheDefiningBeautyexhibitionattheBritishMuseum.Ihavetalkedto
studentsaboutherformorethanthirtyyears.IhavetosaythatwhenIwasyoung,I
usedtoencouragethemtobeverysniffyaboutthis.Iwouldsay...lookthisissome
idiotpatron/sculptorwhojustdoesnt"get"whatthebasicissueaboutancientbeauty
normsare.
ButIwaswrongIthink.
Twothingsonthisreally.
First,theincongruityofthemiddleagedheadontheVenusbodyisfarless
incongruousinreallifethanitisinthestilpictures.WhenIwasinvolvedintheRoyal
AcademyshowoftheNyCarlsbergsculpturesome10yearsago,webroughtherto
London,andactuallysheismuchless"odd"whenyouseeher"intheflesh".It'sa
goodcaseoftheneedtolookatthingsinreallife,
Butthatisnotthebiggestpoint.Whatthe"DefiningBeauty"exhibitionshowsisthat
sculptureslikethisarereallypushingawayatthenormativeideasofGreekbeauty,
andthattherearebigquestionsancientsculptorsareraisingaboutbeauty.Whoever
madethissculpture,he(Iassumeahe)issurelyaskingabouttherelationship
betweenageanddesire...heisnottakingthepissoutofelderlyladies,heisasking
aboutwhattherelationshipisbetweenVenusyoungandVenusold.Heisaskingus
tochallengeourownviewofclassicalbeauty...canyouputanoldheadonyoung
shoulders?
Whatdoyouthink?

PostedbyMaryBeardonMarch26,2015at10:20PM|Permalink

Comments
MalcolmMcLeandijo...
Presumablytheladydidn'tgoaboutveiled.Soeveryoneknewwhatherfacewaslike.
Butshewouldn'thavegoneaboutnakedeither.Soinmakinganudestatue,the
sculptorworkedfromimagination,withadesiretoflatterhispatron.
Whilsthe'stechnicallycompetent,hedoesn'treallyhaveanyartisticsensibility,sothe
resultsareabitincongruous.Butnoonemindsthat,thepatronisn'tamanofgreat
tasteeither,thesubjectispleasedtobeshownyouthful.
Thestraightforwardsexplanationsusuallyturnouttoberight.Icouldbewrong.Butis
thereanythingelsefromtheperiodtosuggestthatthingswerebeingrunbyageing
BabyBoomers?
ResponderMarch26,2015at10:34PM
ColinGoughdijo...
GenuinequestionwhydoyousayitispushingawaythenormativeideasofGreek
beautywhenitisastatueofaRomanemperor'swifeandwasfromRome?
ResponderMarch26,2015at11:00PM
BarryBaldwindijo...
Seethisweek'sSpectator(March28)forreviewarticleaproposthe'DefiningBeauty'

MaryBeardisawickedlysubversive
commentatoronboththemodernand
theancientworld.Sheisaprofessorin
classicsatCambridgeandclassicseditor
oftheTLS.

exhibition.
Givenhowoftenclassicalwriters'tookthepiss'outofelderlyladies(Horace,etc),itis
notimpossiblethatasculptorshoulddothesame.
Or,perhapshe(orshe?whyassumethemasculine?)simplywasn'tgoodat
heads..?
ResponderMarch26,2015at11:40PM
Andrewdijo...
Thanks,Mary.Afewratherunformedimmediatethoughts:perhapsitisintendedtobe
amusing,ortransgressive?Perhapsitistheaffectionatetributeofa(middleaged?)
husbandtoabelovedwife?
ResponderMarch27,2015at08:37AM
Andrewdijo...
Hacatchingmyownprejudices.Perhapsthewomancommissionedit?
ResponderMarch27,2015at08:38AM
vbedijo...
Soundsaccuratetheincongruityisquitestriking.HoweverIamnotclearhasthe
headbeenreaffixed?
SadlysheappearstohavestuckherheadintoabeehivewhilenudeandIpresume
herhandsarefranticallybrushngthemoff
ResponderMarch27,2015at08:48AM
Jamiedijo...
Iamtoodistractedbythehairdotocomment...Wasthatthe"in"look,then?It'sabold
choice.J
ResponderMarch27,2015at09:00AM
Chrysostomdijo...
ProfessorMary,thisisaninterestingpiece,butwhydoyoufeelobligedtoputthe
crudeexpressions"takingthep"?IsthisthebestthatCambridgeprofessorscan
donowadays?ThewebsiteofTHEDAILYMAILreportsthatoneintwentystudents
takesajobasa"prostitute"orinthe"sexindustry".Dodonsfeelanyresponsibility?
Dodonsencouragetheirowndaughterstojointhis"industry"?
ResponderMarch27,2015at10:38AM
MichaelBulleydijo...
WouldFurnillasnamehavebeenunderstoodatthetimeasmeaninglittleoven?The
Latinfurnusmeansoven.InItalian,thatisfornoandthediminutivefornelloisa
gasring,asyoufindontopofacooker.
ResponderMarch27,2015at10:57AM
MaryBearddijo...
Well.Iverymuchdoubtitreallyisfurnilla.Butitiscertainlyroman.Myshorthandwas
sloppyIguess.TheideawouldbethattheRomans"inherited"thosenormativeideas
andthenplayedwiththem.
ResponderMarch27,2015at10:59AM
enuspudicadijo...
ThebodylookstomelikeastandardVenusPudicaandanotespeciallywell
executedversionofthatclich.Theheadwhichontheotherhand,isobviouslya
portraitalsostrikesmeasartisticallyunremarkable.
Ialsodoubtthatthediscrepancywhichwecanthelpfeelingbetweenthestatues
realisticheadanditsidealizedbodywouldhavemuchstruckthoseforwhomthe
statuewasmade.Forusitisaboveallayouthfulbody.Forthemitmusthavebeen
abovealladivineoneandnotjustdivine,butexpressingthedivinityofoneofthe
greatestoftheOlympians,oneespeciallyholytothedescendentsofAeneas.
Ofcoursewhenthegodsappearinhumanformthatformisgenerallyyouthful
humanityattheheightofitspowersandthereforesuggestingpowersevenbeyond
that.IcantthinkofanydescriptionbyapoetofVenusasyouthful.Itis,atleast,not
oneofherroutineepithets,andIthinkitwouldhavebeenimpossibleforaRomanto
imagineitasone.
MyGooglesearchhasturnedupsomeinterestingremarksontherepresentationof
RomanmatronsasgoddessesinLauraSarahNasrallahsChristianResponsesto
RomanArtandArchitecture:TheSecondCenturyChurch.Excerpts,includinga
briefdiscussionofthisstatue(whichshetakestobeofMarciaFurnilla)canberead
inPDFformathttp://tinyurl.com/qdeghww
ResponderMarch27,2015at12:38PM
enuspudicadijo...
enuspudicaisme.Someaccidentalmispasting.Sorry.
ResponderMarch27,2015at12:40PM
GigiSantowdijo...
Whathascapturedmyattentionisthehairdo.Yousaythatitisoftherightperiod.So
istherealiteratureonRomanwigs?
Itmustbeawig,surely.
WhatitremindedmeofwasaphotographofanEthiopianempress(awifeofMenelik,
Ithink)ofthemidtolatenineteenthcentury(sadly,itwasonapostcardthatIsentto
anAfricanistfriend,soIcan'tcheck).Equallyugly,herwigwas,andmadefrom
humanhair.WHYwouldanyonewearsuchathing?Itmusthavebeenhotand
uncomfortableorwasitjustwornforbriefceremonialmomentsandthenremovedso
onecouldhaveagoodscratch?
TheEthiopianchurchisveryold,ofcourse,evenifonediscountstheSolomonand
Shebabusiness(whichEthiopiansdon't,necessarily)butstill,onecan'thelpthinking
ofthewigswornbyOrthodoxJewishwomeninthepastandtoday.
Perhapsthere'sarealliteratureaboutsuchthings,andperhapssomeofyouwill
knowaboutit.Ihopeso.
ResponderMarch27,2015at12:50PM
MalcolmMcLeandijoenrespuestaaChrysostom...
Cantabsaren'tallowedtoseekpaidemploymentduringtermtime.SoMary'scollege
hascoveredthatone.
ResponderMarch27,2015at12:59PM
GigiSantowdijo...
Sorry,I'vegotmore.TookeentonatteronabouttheheadpieceIforgottomention
bitslowerdown.
There'sagreatsamenesstomanyofthesebodies.Theleastconvincingbit,apart
fromthevaguenessinthegenitalarea,isIthinkthewonderfullytrimknees.These
womenarealwayspudgynotnecessarilyfatbutcertainlywellcoveredsohowisit
whenitcomestotheirlowerlegsthey'resoathletic?
Notenoughlivemodels,Iguess.
PerhapsLordClarkhasalreadycommentedonsuch,forgivemeifso.
ResponderMarch27,2015at01:32PM
adennisdijo...
beinganarranged
marriage,maybe
Titus,goinginto
itforasecondtime,
wantedanold
headonayoung
body.Theword
Marciahasplebeian
roots,soperhaps
thetensionbetween
theoldandnew
aristocracy,shows
inthefaceofthis
statue.
ResponderMarch27,2015at01:47PM
adennisdijoenrespuestaaChrysostom...
atleastonein
tenparents,
accordingtoa
popularnewspaper,
alsothinkthat
crispsareapartof
theirchildren's
fiveadayIwould,

PETERMARSHALL

EarlyverdictsonPopeFrancis
MICHAELSTEED

TakingriskswithJeremyThorpe
AMBERK.REGIS

ExtrasinthelivesofHaroldandVita
ARIKELMAN

Bruteslaverydebate

therefore,conclude,that
MarciaFurnillatook
theequivalentof
crispstoschool
andsufferedasa
result.
ResponderMarch27,2015at01:51PM
rogueclassicistdijo...
Surelythisisbutthe'equivalent'ofallthosenaked'heroic'emperors...incongruous,
perhaps,butI'dbewillingtoaverthatit'smuchlessincongruousthananaked
Claudiusconquering'Britannia'atAphrodisias...
ResponderMarch27,2015at04:13PM
Grainnedijo...
wecanneverknowwiththemissinghandandfingersbuttomethisisastatueofa
womanselfpleasuring.Thereforeisitacommentaboutdesirenotdying.
ResponderMarch27,2015at04:22PM
AndrewCaterdijo...
Aquestionraisedbythisandtheimmediatelypriorblog:isitfeasiblethatsomeof
thesestatueswereintendedtobeseenclothedinsumptuousclothes?
Thatwouldmeanthatthestatueherewouldnotbeseenpersebutjustlenditsshape
tothefoldsofdraperyinthesamewayasashopwindowmannequin.
Again,ourproblemisthatwehavefractionsofapercentofthenumbersofstatues
thatthereoncewere,eitherpubliclyorinprivate.
Wehavewrittendescriptionsofwhat'sexpectedfromfamousstatues,wehave
copies,someofthemnthhand,offamousoriginalsdowehaveenoughtocorrelate
goodcompliancewiththeoryandcorrectformandmatchingstatues.
Athoughtexperiment:you'reveryfamiliarwithKing'sCollegeChapel.Ifallyouhadto
goonwereguidebooks,written?descriptions,afewphotographsand,perhaps,a
coupleofruinsfromthesameperiod/similarstylese.gtheruinedabbeysofRievaulx
andFountainsorasmallercopye.g.CheltenhamCollegeChapelwouldthe
synthesisofthisenableyoutounderstandKing'sinasfulladetailasbeingthere?
Nothingisstraightforward.
ResponderMarch27,2015at07:20PM
TohudijoenrespuestaaChrysostom...
DearChrysostom,
Isyourcommentthebestafastidiouspersonsuchasyoucandonowadays?
Thesyntaxofthefirsttwolinesisoddindeed.Theword"expressions"shouldbe
singularnotplural.Theword"put"isusedunidiomatically.
Therestofyourcommentisuncalledforandbesidethepoint.
Tara,
T
ResponderMarch27,2015at07:24PM
Tohudijo...
It'saverystrangestatue.Whatistherighthanddoing?Whatwouldthelefthandbe
doingifwecouldstillseeit?Arethegesturesmodestorimmodest?
Therearetwotinyfeetjusttotheleftofthefigure.
ResponderMarch27,2015at07:44PM
Anastassiadesdijo...
[theideawouldbe,probably,too,thattheRomansinheritedboththosenormative
ideasandtheclassicposes,andthenplayedwiththemtheorder,too,mighthave
beenherespecificallyforaVenuspudicaMarciaFurnilla]
ResponderMarch27,2015at08:46PM
Vincentdijo...
MyissueisIdon'tthinktheGreeksmadesculpturewiththemindsetofviewingthe
humanbodyassexual.AndIalsothinkforthemostparttheRomansfollowedthe
Greeksinthis.Wedon'tthinkofportraitsoftheVirginMaryinthecontextofasexual
being.
Togoabitfurther.WhentheGreeksusedreferencetoDionysus,AphroditeorEros
itwasn'ttheperson/deitybuttheinfluence.
ResponderMarch27,2015at09:19PM
Truthlorddijo...
SurelyitsPrincessMargaret,madeabouttheearlysixties,theresemblanceis
remarkable,sheisevenwearingherfavouriteupsweptstrawhatsheoftenusedat
gardenparties.ForsomereasonshesnotwearingafullskirtedNormanHartnell
creation..
IsuspectthepiecewasmadebyLordSnowdonwhowasversatileinsomany
ways.......
Onceyouknowwhoitisitbecomesquiteerotic...
ResponderMarch27,2015at10:23PM
PaulRogersdijo...
Itwasstrange(andunpleasant)afewyearsago,onabeachinCyprus,tosee
ageingladiesgoingtoplesshavingrecentlyundergonewhatIbelieveiscalleda"boob
job."Presumably,thesewomenwishedtoflaunttheirplasticsurgeon'shandiwork.It
wasbizarretoseefacsimilesofpert,youngbreastsonwhatwereotherwisefairly
wrinkledtorsos.I'msurethere'saconnectionhere,butnotaveryedifyingone.
ResponderMarch28,2015at01:13AM
JHdijo...
Ican'thelpbutnoticethatallthecommentsthusfararefrommen.Asawoman'ofa
certainage',withoccasiontofrequentthecommunalchangingroomofahealthclub,
theconjunctionsoflinedfaceandyouthfulfigure(orviceversa)arealltoofamiliarin
life.
ResponderMarch28,2015at03:26AM
Gidijo...
Mary,Idon'treallythinkthesculptorwasouttoproveanything.Itwasfrequentfora
richmantohavehisrealfaceportraitaddedtoahero'sorageneral'sidealizedbody,
right?Wasn'tthereasortofmassproductionofthosebodies?Sowhywouldthere
notbetheequivalentforrichwomen?
ResponderMarch28,2015at01:34PM
PLdijoenrespuestaaenuspudica...
Imeantme,PL.Dammit!
ResponderMarch28,2015at04:16PM
MichaelBulleydijo...
IclickedontheimagetogetabetterviewofthetinyfeetandallIgotwasawhite
square.Anyonehadmoresuccess?
ResponderMarch28,2015at04:30PM
MichaelBulleydijo...
MaryBeardreferstoelderlyladiesinhertext.Whatage,then,wouldreadershere
proposeforthefaceinthestatue.Ihavenowlookedatvariousversions,availableon
theinternet,inalargerformatthanabove.Thereare,indeedacoupleofstronglines
goingdownfromeachsideofthenose,butotherwisenowrinklesatall.Ishouldbe
happytosaythiswasthefaceofa30yearoldwomanwhosehabitualexpression
wasseriousorsevere.
ResponderMarch28,2015at07:53PM
PLdijo...
LetmetrytoputmoreclearlysomeofwhatIcommentedabove.Idontbelieve
contemporariessawthatstatueasrepresentingthebodyofabeautifulyoungwoman.
Ourseeingitthatwayisananachronisticdistortion.Theywouldhaveseenitas
representingadeityofgreatpowerandinfluence(literallyinfluenceintheastrological
sense)inwhomtheyferventlybelievedandtowhomtheyofferedprayersand
sacrifices.TheywouldnothaveseentheassociationofsomeRomanladywiththis
deityasanactofcosmeticvanitypompousnessorpretension,maybe,butnot
vanity.Thefactthatherheadisrepresented(inaccordancewiththeRomancustom
ofportraitbustsrootedinfuneralrites)realisticallywithanexpressionofindividualized
dignitymakesitclearthatifanyflatterywasintendeditwasflatteryoftheladyssocial
statusandperhapsherpietyofthevainnotionthatshesomehowpossessed
(fromtheneckdown)thebeautyofthegoddessVenus.
ResponderMarch28,2015at08:11PM
OliviaByarddijo...

Couldshebe(evenpartly)blackAfrican?Thatwouldexplainthehair,orhead
dressingwhyshouldshenecessarilybe'white'becauseshe'sinmarble?
Sinceyouhadtobeactiveandfittoliveintomiddleage,Ifindnothingweirdor
strangelyoveryoungaboutthisbody.I'veseenyoungerlooking60yearoldsatthe
gym......
ResponderMarch28,2015at10:02PM
tohudijo...
There'sawomannamedJanetStephenswhospecialisesinrecreatingRoman
hairstylessuchastheoneillustratedwithouttheuseofwigs.Therearenumerous
videosonYoutubeofhercreations.
I'venoideahowplausibletheyarebutthey'reworthwatching.
ResponderMarch28,2015at11:07PM
MichaelBulleydijo...
TheresanotherstatueofMarciafromthesamemuseum,thistimejustaportraitbust.
Sheswearingadrapedchiton.Itsthesamehairstyleandsamefacialexpression.
Youcanfindithere:
http://www2.cnr.edu/home/araia/state.html
ResponderMarch29,2015at11:00AM
SusanCaterdijo...
Romanaristocraticladiesofthisperiodwererenownedforincrediblyelaborate
hairstyles.Someveryfancydoswereachievedwithwigs,moreoftenwiththeladies'
ownhairplussomefalsehairinterwoven.Theyhadlotsofleisuretimeandlotsof
slavestohelp.Justgoogle"Romanfemalehairstyles"andyoucanviewsome
wonderfulexamples.
ResponderMarch29,2015at12:19PM
SusanCaterdijo...
Somewomenpurchsedfemaleslaveswithparticularlyluxurianthairjustforthe
purposeofusingthathairforthemselves.RedhairfromBritishslaveswashighly
prized.
ResponderMarch29,2015at12:21PM
PLdijoenrespuestaaPL...
NOTofthevainnotioniswhatImeanttowriteinmylastsentence.
ResponderMarch29,2015at01:06PM
PLdijoenrespuestaaOliviaByard...
ItwasapopularRomanhairstyleatthetime.Thereareotherexamplesaparticularly
fineoneistheFonsecaBustintheCapitolinemuseuminRome.Neitherthe
subjectsfacialfeaturesnorherhairlookevenremotelyblackAfrican.Thereisa
goodphotoofthebustat
http://tinyurl.com/nkrthgz
ItisalsoshownintheWikiarticleonRomanHairstyles.
ResponderMarch29,2015at01:18PM
itumpidijoenrespuestaaMichaelBulley...
IhavetriedthepopupscreensonthethreebrowsersIhaveaccessto(Firefox,
ChromeandSafari)andthepopupsareallblanktoo.I'velookedintothecodingand
changedthepermissionsfrom'block'to'allow'butstillnopic!Ifyoustaywiththemain
screenhoweverandgotoViewandZoomInthenyoushouldbeabletogetaphoto
widthof30cmsplus.IfyourbrowserisFirefoxthenmakesuretogetridofthetickon
ZoomInTextOnly.Thoselittlefeetcanbeseenquitewell(atinylossoffocus)atthis
size.Mycomputerscreenisquitesmall(15in)sowithabiggerscreenyoumaybe
abletotakethephotouptoanevenlargersize.
Ithinkyouarerightandthoselittlefeetarecrucial.
ResponderMarch29,2015at02:54PM
OliviaByarddijo...
Itakeitbackherbodycouldn'tbemiddleagedherbreastsaretooyoung.Butshe
justdoesn'tlookincongruoustome.Infactshelooksratherlovely.
Iamveryboredbythemodernideaofwoman'sbeauty.It'sdemeaningandnotvery
sexy.NotcommentingonthissubjectfurtherIknowit'sjustgoingtomakeme
cross.Anydiscussionofwomanasbodyobjectdoes.
ResponderMarch29,2015at08:26PM
tohudijoenrespuestaaMichaelBulley...
Clickingproducedthesameresultformebutyoucangetamagnifiedviewbyoneof
thefollowingprocedures:
1.ifyouhaveapcpresscontrol+
2.Ifyouhaveanipadputtwofingersonthescreenandmovethemapart.
Goodluckandletmeknowhowyougeton.
Regards,
T.
ResponderMarch29,2015at09:35PM
MalcolmMcLeandijoenrespuestaaOliviaByard...
Thelatesttrendisthethighgap,whichyou'llobservethatourstatuedoesn'thave,
thoughthatmaybeformechanicalstability.
Idon'tthinkanymanhadeverheardofathighgapuntilsomewomeninventedit.
ResponderMarch29,2015at09:57PM
PLdijoenrespuestaaOliviaByard...
Right.Butthisisnotmeanttobethebodyofawoman.Itisarepresentationofa
goddess:shewhoistheforceindwellingeverythingthatisamorous,whorulesover
thefertilityofspringtimesheisalsothemorningstar,whoseinfluencegrowscopper
intheearthshewasbornfromtheseafoam(SeeBottticelli)sheisthemotherof
Aeneas,theurmotheroftheRomanrace.Theidealizedbodytowhichthewomans
portraitbustisattachedisaconventionalversionofhowthatgoddessmightappear
tohumansightifshedeignedtoassumeahumanform.Thesculptorhas
complimentedsomeRomanladybyjoiningherhonorablyhumanfeatureswiththat
transcendentlydivineform.Thereligiousmotivationbehindthisisnaturallyhardfor
modernpeopletounderstand.Buttoputitintermsofsexinessandobjectifying
womensbodiesiswildlymisleading.Thinkoftheidealizedmasculinebodiesgivento
Romangentlemenforthesamepiouslyexpressivepurposeorthemoulded
musculatureofaRomancuirasse.
ResponderMarch29,2015at11:51PM
vbedijo...
Truthlordsaid...
SurelyitsPrincessMargaret,madeabouttheearlysixties"
Yesthiswasmyimpression.Thewholethingisbasicallyacod
ResponderMarch30,2015at09:32AM
vbedijo...
saidinreplytoOliviaByard...
Right.Butthisisnotmeanttobethebodyofawoman.Itisarepresentationofa
goddess:shewhoistheforceindwellingeverythingthatisamorous,whorulesover
thefertilityofspringtimesheisalsothemorningstar,whoseinfluencegrowscopper
intheearthshewasbornfromtheseafoam(SeeBottticelli)sheisthemotherof
Aeneas,theurmotheroftheRomanrace.Theidealizedbodytowhichthewomans
portraitbustisattachedisaconventionalversion
Erfascinatingbuthowdoyouknowallthis?Isthereacaptionroundtheback?
AndisthereanyvaluetoreferencingBoticellitoexplainapiecethatwasmade
milleniabeforehewasborn?
ResponderMarch30,2015at12:52PM
PLdijoenrespuestaavbe...
LookupVenusPudicaonGoogleImagesandyouwillunderstandwhyoursculptor
didntneedtoputacaptiononthatbodyforhisaudiencetorecognizewhoseitwas.
IreferencedBotticellispicturebecauseitissofamiliar.Ofcoursetherearecountless
ancientexamplesofthesamething.DanteisaboutasfarchronologicallyfromVirgil
asBotticelliisfromour2ndcsculptor(notquitemilleniabutmorethanone
millennium).Perhapsyouwouldsaythereisnovalueinexplaininganythingabout
VirgilbyreferencetoDante.Iwoulddisagreewithyou.Wemighthaveaninteresting
discussion.
ResponderMarch30,2015at04:04PM

MichaelBulleydijoenrespuestaavbe...
Aw,giveusabreak,vbe!Copyandpastehasitslimits.Atthisrate,halfofwhatgets
postedhererisksfindingitselfrepeatedverbatimatthetopofoneofyourcomments.
IfyouseenooptionbuttheYousaidthis,butyourewrongstyleofcomment,how
aboutabbreviatingit?Maybesomethinglike:ToPL:onyourcommentofMarch29
Right....conventionalversion,Iwonderhowyou....
ResponderMarch30,2015at04:18PM
OliviaByarddijoenrespuestaaPL...
Yes,understoodnow.Wasallatsea.8)
IdidrememberthismorningthatintheAshmoleum,thereisaroomfullofRoman
statuesofreallyfitheroicmenandalsoseveralheadshangingonthewall.
NewheadswereputonthebodieswhenanewEmperortookcontrol.Musthave
beenthebeginningofheadsoncoinsIshouldhavethought...?
Anyway,what'sgoodforthegander...?
ButdotellMalcolmthattheidealbmiorbodysizeformodernpeople,(anditaffects
womenmost),wascreatedbyadodgylifeinsurancemaninthe1950s,onthemake.
Hesawthatthebestlifeexpectancywasfor2530yearoldsofacertainweight.So
decidedtoshiftthecurveovertosuggestallhumansshouldbeinthatweightrange
nomattertheirageorbodytype.OvernighthalfoftheUSAbecameobese,beganto
worryabout
it,wentondietsetc.andtheobesitycrisiswasborn.Themassiveindustrialisationof
food,marketing,andpoordietfinishedthejob.
MarilynMonroewassize18!8)
ResponderMarch30,2015at04:45PM
RosaSinespinadijo...
Canwebesurethatthiswasntacaseofamuseumtechniciancomingacrossa
bodyinneedofaheadandaheadlookingforabodyandthusdecidingthata
marriagetwixtbothartefactswouldbeaneatsolutiontotheproblemofbothbitsbeing
bereft?
IamassuredbySomeoneWhoKnowsthatthissortofthinghappens.
ResponderMarch31,2015at01:08PM
vbedijo...
ToPL..
"LookupVenusPudicaonGoogleImagesandyouwillunderstandwhyoursculptor
didntneedtoputacaptiononthatbodyforhisaudiencetorecognizewhoseitwas."
Iunderstandthistobeatypeofpose.Idon'tthinkitallowsyoutoknowwhoisbeing
modelledorindeedallthevaluesyouapparentlyassociatewithapose.
Inanycaseisthetermancientroman?
"IreferencedBotticellispicturebecauseitissofamiliar.Ofcoursethereare
countlessancientexamplesofthesamething.Danteisaboutasfarchronologically
fromVirgilasBotticelliisfromour2ndcsculptor(notquitemilleniabutmorethan
onemillennium).Perhapsyouwouldsaythereisnovalueinexplaininganythingabout
VirgilbyreferencetoDante."
LiteratureisaltogetherdiffirentsincemanuscriptsofVirgilwereknown,thoughnot
widely.Interestinglyoneofthebestpreserved,thoughnottheonlyone,maycome
from5thcenturyBritainwhichifeverconfirmedwouldbeanastonishingattribution.
Theclassicalsculpturaltraditionbycontrastwasalmostentirelylost.Byzantiumfor
examplepreservedtexts,butitssculpturalarchiveisexceptionallysmall.
WehavetobeverycarefullaboutmakingassumptionsofinfluenceetcDanteopenly
citesVirgil,BotticelliasfarasIknowcitednoone.
ResponderMarch31,2015at04:50PM
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