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visualmemory.co.uk

http://www.visualmemory.co.uk/amk/doc/interview.bl.html

KubrickonBarryLyndon

AninterviewwithMichelCiment
MichelCiment:YouhavegivenalmostnointerviewsonBarryLyndon.Doesthisdecisionrelate
tothisfilmparticularly,orisitbecauseyouarereluctanttospeakaboutyourwork?
StanleyKubrick:Isupposemyexcuseisthatthepicturewasreadyonlyafewweeksbeforeit
openedandIreallyhadnotimetodoanyinterviews.ButifI'mtobecompletelyhonest,it's
probablyduemoretothefactthatIdon'tlikedoinginterviews.Thereisalwaystheproblemof
beingmisquotedor,what'sevenworse,ofbeingquotedexactly,andhavingtoseewhatyou've
saidinprint.Thentherearethemandatory"HowdidyougetalongwithactorX,YorZ?"
"WhoreallythoughtofgoodideaA,BorC?"IthinkNabokovmayhavehadtherightapproach
tointerviews.Hewouldonlyagreetowritedowntheanswersandthensendthemontothe
interviewerwhowouldthenwritethequestions.
DoyoufeelthatBarryLyndonisamoresecretfilm,moredifficulttotalkabout?
Notreally.I'vealwaysfounditdifficulttotalkaboutanyofmyfilms.WhatIgenerallymanageto
doistodiscussthebackgroundinformationconnectedwiththestory,orperhapssomeofthe
interestingfactswhichmightbeassociatedwithit.Thisapproachoftenallowsmetoavoidthe
"Whatdoesitmean?Whydidyoudoit?"questions.Forexample,withDr.StrangeloveIcould
talkaboutthespectrumofbizarreideasconnectedwiththepossibilitiesofaccidentalor
unintentionalwarfare.2001:ASpaceOdysseyallowedspeculationaboutultraintelligent
computers,lifeintheuniverse,andawholerangeofsciencefictionideas.AClockworkOrange
involvedlawandorder,criminalviolence,authorityversusfreedom,etc.WithBarryLyndonyou
haven'tgotthesetopicalissuestotalkaround,soIsupposethatdoesmakeitabitmoredifficult.
Yourlastthreefilmsweresetinthefuture.Whatledyoutomakeanhistoricalfilm?
Ican'thonestlysaywhatledmetomakeanyofmyfilms.ThebestIcandoistosayIjustfellin
lovewiththestories.Goingbeyondthatisabitliketryingtoexplainwhyyoufellinlovewithyour
wife:she'sintelligent,hasbrowneyes,agoodfigure.Haveyoureallysaidanything?SinceIam
currentlygoingthroughtheprocessoftryingtodecidewhatfilmtomakenext,Irealizejusthow
uncontrollableisthebusinessoffindingastory,andhowmuchitdependsonchanceand
spontaneousreaction.Youcansayalotof"architectural"thingsaboutwhatafilmstoryshould
have:astrongplot,interestingcharacters,possibilitiesforcinematicdevelopment,good
opportunitiesfortheactorstodisplayemotion,andthepresentationofitsthematicideas
truthfullyandintelligently.But,ofcourse,thatstilldoesn'treallyexplainwhyyoufinallychose
something,nordoesitleadyoutoastory.Youcanonlysaythatyouprobablywouldn'tchoosea
storythatdoesn'thavemostofthosequalities.
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Sinceyouarecompletelyfreeinyourchoiceofstorymaterial,howdidyoucometopickupa
bookbyThackeray,almostforgottenandhardlyrepublishedsincethenineteenthcentury?
IhavehadacompletesetofThackeraysittingonmybookshelfathomeforyears,andIhadto
readseveralofhisnovelsbeforereadingBarryLyndon.Atonetime,VanityFairinterestedmeas
apossiblefilmbut,intheend,Idecidedthestorycouldnotbesuccessfullycompressedintothe
relativelyshorttimespanofafeaturefilm.Thisproblemoflength,bytheway,isnowwonderfully
accommodatedforbythetelevisionminiserieswhich,withitstentotwelvehourlength,pressed
onconsecutivenights,hascreatedacompletelydifferentdramaticform.Anyway,assoonasI
readBarryLyndonIbecameveryexcitedaboutit.Ilovedthestoryandthecharacters,andit
seemedpossibletomakethetransitionfromnoveltofilmwithoutdestroyingitintheprocess.It
alsoofferedtheopportunitytodooneofthethingsthatmoviescandobetterthananyotherart
form,andthatistopresenthistoricalsubjectmatter.Descriptionisnotoneofthethingsthat
novelsdobestbutitissomethingthatmoviesdoeffortlessly,atleastwithrespecttotheeffort
requiredoftheaudience.Thisisequallytrueforsciencefictionandfantasy,whichoffervisual
challengesandpossibilitiesyoudon'tfindincontemporarystories.
Howdidyoucometoadoptathirdpersoncommentaryinsteadofthefirstpersonnarrative
whichisfoundinthebook?
IbelieveThackerayusedRedmondBarrytotellhisownstoryinadeliberatelydistortedway
becauseitmadeitmoreinteresting.Insteadoftheomniscientauthor,Thackerayusedthe
imperfectobserver,orperhapsitwouldbemoreaccuratetosaythedishonestobserver,thus
allowingthereadertojudgeforhimself,withlittledifficulty,theprobabletruthinRedmondBarry's
viewofhislife.Thistechniqueworkedextremelywellinthenovelbut,ofcourse,inafilmyou
haveobjectiverealityinfrontofyouallofthetime,sotheeffectofThackeray'sfirstpersonstory
tellercouldnotberepeatedonthescreen.Itmighthaveworkedascomedybythejuxtaposition
ofBarry'sversionofthetruthwiththerealityonthescreen,butIdon'tthinkthatBarryLyndon
shouldhavebeendoneasacomedy.
Youdidn'tthinkofhavingnocommentary?
Thereistoomuchstorytotell.Avoiceoversparesyouthecumbersomebusinessoftellingthe
necessaryfactsofthestorythroughexpositionaldialoguesceneswhichcanbecomevery
tiresomeandfrequentlyunconvincing:"Cursetheblastedstormthat'swreckedourblessed
ship!"Voiceover,ontheotherhand,isaperfectlylegitimateandeconomicalwayofconveying
storyinformationwhichdoesnotneeddramaticweightandwhichwouldotherwisebetoobulky
todramatize.
Butyouuseitinotherwaytocooldowntheemotionofascene,andtoanticipatethestory.
Forinstance,justafterthemeetingwiththeGermanpeasantgirlaverymovingscenethe
voiceovercompareshertoatownhavingbeenoftenconqueredbysiege.
Inthescenethatyou'rereferringto,thevoiceoverworksasanironiccounterpointtowhatyou
seeportrayedbytheactorsonthescreen.Thisisonlyaminorsequenceinthestoryandhasto
bepresentedwitheconomy.Barryistenderandromanticwiththegirlbutallhereallywantsisto
getherintobed.ThegirlislonelyandBarryisattractiveandattentive.Ifyouthinkaboutit,itisn't
likelythatheistheonlysoldiershehasbroughthomewhileherhusbandhasbeenawaytothe
wars.YoucouldhavehadBarrygivesignalstotheaudience,throughhisperformance,
indicatingthatheisreallyinsincereandopportunistic,butthiswouldbeunreal.Whenwetryto
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deceiveweareasconvincingaswecanbe,aren'twe?
Thefilm'scommentaryalsoservesanotherpurpose,butthistimeinmuchthesamemannerit
didinthenovel.Thestoryhasmanytwistsandturns,andThackerayusesBarrytogiveyou
hintsinadvanceofmostoftheimportantplotdevelopments,thuslesseningtheriskoftheir
seemingcontrived.
WhenheisgoingtomeettheChevalierBalibari,thecommentaryanticipatestheemotionswe
areabouttosee,thuspossiblylesseningtheireffect.
BarryLyndonisastorywhichdoesnotdependuponsurprise.Whatisimportantisnotwhatis
goingtohappen,buthowitwillhappen.IthinkThackeraytradesofftheadvantageofsurpriseto
gainagreatersenseofinevitabilityandabetterintegrationofwhatmightotherwiseseem
melodramaticorcontrived.InthesceneyourefertowhereBarrymeetstheChevalier,thefilm's
voiceoverestablishesthenecessarygroundworkfortheimportantnewrelationshipwhichis
rapidlytodevelopbetweenthetwomen.BytalkingaboutBarry'slonelinessbeingsofarfrom
home,hissenseofisolationasanexile,andhisjoyatmeetingafellowcountrymaninaforeign
land,thecommentarypreparesthewayforthesceneswhicharequicklytofollowshowinghis
closeattachmenttotheChevalier.AnotherplaceinthestorywhereIthinkthistechniqueworks
particularlywelliswherewearetoldthatBarry'syoungson,Bryan,isgoingtodieatthesame
timewewatchthetwoofthemplayinghappilytogether.Inthiscase,Ithinkthecommentary
createsthesamedramaticeffectas,forexample,theknowledgethattheTitanicisdoomed
whileyouwatchthecarefreescenesofpreparationanddeparture.Theseearlysceneswouldbe
inexplicablydullifyoudidn'tknowabouttheship'sappointmentwiththeiceberg.Beingtoldin
advanceoftheimpendingdisastergivesawaysurprisebutcreatessuspense.
Thereisverylittleintrospectioninthefilm.Barryisopenabouthisfeelingsatthebeginningof
thefilm,butthenhebecomeslessso.
Atthebeginningofthestory,Barryhasmorepeoplearoundhimtowhomhecanexpresshis
feelings.Asthestoryprogresses,andparticularlyafterhismarriage,hebecomesmoreand
moreisolated.Thereisfinallynoonewholoveshim,orwithwhomhecantalkfreely,withthe
possibleexceptionofhisyoungson,whoistoououngtobeofmuchhelp.AtthesametimeI
don'tthinkthatthelackofintrospectivedialoguescenesareanylosstothestory.Barry's
feelingsaretheretobeseenashereactstotheincreasinglydifficultcircumstancesofhislife.I
thinkthisisequallytruefortheothercharactersinthestory.Inanyevent,scenesofpeople
talkingaboutthemselvesareoftenverydull.
Incontrasttofilmswhicharepreoccupiedwithanalyzingthepsychologyofthecharacters,yours
tendtomaintainamysteryaroundthem.ReverendRunt,forinstance,isaveryopaqueperson.
Youdon'tknowexactlywhathismotivationsare.
ButyouknowalotaboutReverendRunt,certainlyallthatisnecessary.HedislikesBarry.Heis
secretlyinlovewithLadyLyndon,inhisownprim,repressed,littleway.Hislittlesmileof
triumph,inthesceneinthecoach,neartheendofthefilm,tellsyouallyouneedtoknow
regardingthewayhefeelsaboutBarry'smisfortune,andthewaythingshaveworkedout.You
certainlydon'thavethetimeinafilmtodevelopthemotivationsofminorcharacters.
LadyLyndonisevenmoreopaque.
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Thackeraydoesn'ttellyouagreatdealaboutherinthenovel.Ifoundthatverystrange.He
doesn'tgiveyoualottogoon.Thereare,infact,veryfewdialoguesceneswithherinthebook.
Perhapshemeanthertobesomethingofamystery.Butthefilmgivesyouasufficient
understandingofheranyway.
Youmadeimportantchangesinyouradaptation,suchastheinventionofthelastduel,andthe
endingitself.
Yes,Idid,butIwassatisfiedthattheywereconsistentwiththespiritofthenovelandbroughtthe
storytoaboutthesameplacethenoveldid,butinlesstime.Inthebook,Barryispensionedoff
byLadyLyndon.LordBullingdon,havingbeenbelieveddead,returnsfromAmerica.Hefinds
Barryandgiveshimabeating.Barry,tendedbyhismother,subsequentlydiesinprison,adrunk.
This,andeverythingthatwentalongwithitinthenoveltomakeitcrediblewouldhavetakentoo
muchtimeonthescreen.Inthefilm,BullingdongetshisrevengeandBarryistotallydefeated,
destined,onecanassume,forafatenotunlikethatwhichawaitedhiminthenovel.
Andthesceneofthetwohomosexualsinthelakewasnotinthebookeither.
TheproblemherewashowtogetBarryoutoftheBritishArmy.Thesectionofthebookdealing
withthisisalsofairlylengthyandcomplicated.
ThefunctionofthescenebetweenthetwogayofficerswastoprovideasimplerwayforBarryto
escape.Again,itleadstothesameendresultasthenovelbutbyadifferentroute.Barrysteals
thepapersanduniformofaBritishofficerwhichallowhimtomakehiswaytofreedom.Sincethe
sceneispurelyexpositional,thecomicsituationhelpstomaskyourintentions.
Wereyouawareofthemultipleechoesthatarefoundinthefilm:flogginginthearmy,floggingat
home,theduels,etc.,andthenarrativestructureresemblingthatofAClockworkOrange?Does
thisgeometricalpatternattractyou?
Thenarrativesymmetryaroseprimarilyoutoftheneedsoftellingthestoryratherthanaspartof
aconsciousdesign.Theartisticprocessyougothroughinmakingafilmisasmuchamatterof
discoveryasitistheexecutionofaplan.Yourfirstresponsibilityinwritingascreenplayistopay
theclosestpossibleattentiontotheauthor'sideasandmakesureyoureallyunderstandwhathe
haswrittenandwhyhehaswrittenit.Iknowthissoundsprettyobviousbutyou'dbesurprised
howoftenthisisnotdone.Thereisatendencyforthescreenplaywritertobe"creative"too
quickly.Thenextthingistomakesurethatthestorysurvivestheselectionandcompression
whichhastooccurinordertotellitinamaximumofthreehours,andpreferablytwo.Thisphase
usuallysealsthefateofmostmajornovels,whichreallyneedthelargecanvasuponwhichthey
arepresented.
InthefirstpartofAClockworkOrange,wewereagainstAlex.Inthesecondpart,wewereonhis
side.Inthisfilm,theattraction/repulsionfeelingtowardsBarryispresentthroughout.
Thackerayreferredtoitas"anovelwithoutahero".Barryisnaiveanduneducated.Heisdriven
byarelentlessambitionforwealthandsocialposition.Thisprovestobeanunfortunate
combinationofqualitieswhicheventuallyleadtogreatmisfortuneandunhappinessforhimself
andthosearoundhim.YourfeelingsaboutBarryaremixedbuthehascharmandcourage,and
itisimpossiblenottolikehimdespitehisvanity,hisinsensitivityandhisweaknesses.Heisa
veryrealcharacterwhoisneitheraconventionalheronoraconventionalvillain.
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Thefeelingthatwehaveattheendisoneofutterwaste.
Perhapsmoreasenseoftragedy,andbecauseofthisthestorycanassimilatethetwistsand
turnsoftheplotwithoutbecomingmelodrama.Melodramausesalltheproblemsoftheworld,
andthedifficultiesanddisasterswhichbefallthecharacters,todemonstratethattheworldis,
afterall,abenevolentandjustplace.
Thelastsentencewhichsaysthatallthecharactersarenowequalcanbetakenasanihilisticor
religiousstatement.Fromyourfilms,onehasthefeelingthatyouareanihilistwhowouldliketo
believe.
Ithinkyou'llfindthatitismerelyanironicpostscripttakenfromthenovel.Itsmeaningseems
quitecleartomeand,asfarasI'mconcerned,ithasnothingtodowithnihilismorreligion.
Onehasthefeelinginyourfilmsthattheworldisinaconstantstateofwar.Theapesare
fightingin2001.Thereisfighting,too,inPathsOfGlory,andDr.Strangelove.InBarryLyndon,
youhaveawarinthefirstpart,andtheninthesecondpartwefindthehomeisabattleground,
too.
Dramaisconflict,andviolentconflictdoesnotfinditsexclusivedomaininmyfilms.Norisit
uncommonforafilmtobebuiltaroundasituationwhereviolentconflictisthedrivingforce.With
respecttoBarryLyndon,afterhissuccessfulstruggletoachievewealthandsocialposition,
Barryprovestobebadlyunsuitedtothisrole.Hehasclawedhiswayintoagildedcage,and
onceinsidehislifegoesreallybad.Theviolentconflictswhichsubsequentlyarisecome
inevitablyasaresultofthecharactersandtheirrelationships.Barry'searlyconflictscarryhim
forthintolifeandtheybringhimadventureandhappiness,butthoseinlaterlifeleadonlytopain
andeventuallytotragedy.
Inmanyways,thefilmremindsusofsilentmovies.Iamthinkingparticularlyoftheseductionof
LadyLyndonbyBarryatthegamblingtable.
That'sgood.Ithinkthatsilentfilmsgotalotmorethingsrightthantalkies.BarryandLady
Lyndonsitatthegamingtableandexchangelingeringlooks.Theydonotsayaword.Lady
Lyndongoesoutonthebalconyforsomeair.Barryfollowsheroutside.Theygazelonginglyinto
eachother'seyesandkiss.Stillnotawordisspoken.It'sveryromantic,butatthesametime,I
thinkitsuggeststheemptyattractiontheyhaveforeachotherthatistodisappearasquicklyasit
arose.Itsetsthestageforeverythingthatistofollowintheirrelationship.Theactors,theimages
andtheSchubertworkedwelltogether,Ithink.
DidyouhaveSchubert'sTrioinmindwhilepreparingandshootingthisparticularscene?
No,Idecidedonitwhilewewereediting.Initially,Ithoughtitwasrighttouseonlyeighteenth
centurymusic.Butsometimesyoucanmakegroundrulesforyourselfwhichproveunnecessary
andcounterproductive.IthinkImusthavelistenedtoeveryLPyoucanbuyofeighteenth
centurymusic.Oneoftheproblemswhichsoonbecameapparentisthattherearenotragic
lovethemesineighteenthcenturymusic.SoeventuallyIdecidedtouseSchubert'sTrioinE
Flat,Opus100,writtenin1828.It'samagnificentpieceofmusicandithasjusttheright
restrainedbalancebetweenthetragicandtheromanticwithoutgettingintotheheadierstuffof
laterRomanticism.

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YoualsocheatedinanotherwaybyhavingLeonardRosenmanorchestrateHandel'sSarabande
inamoredramaticstylethanyouwouldfindineighteenthcenturycomposition.
Thisarosefromanotherproblemabouteighteenthcenturymusicitisn'tverydramatic,either.I
firstcameacrosstheHandelthemeplayedonaguitarand,strangelyenough,itmademethink
ofEnnioMorricone.Ithinkitworkedverywellinthefilm,andtheverysimpleorchestrationkeptit
fromsoundingoutofplace.
Italsoaccompaniesthelastduelnotpresentinthenovelwhichisoneofthemoststriking
scenesinthefilmandissetinadovecote.
Thesettingwasatithebarnwhichalsohappenedtohavealotofpigeonsrestingintherafters.
We'veseenmanyduelsbeforeinfilms,andIwantedtofindadifferentandinterestingwayto
presentthescene.Thesoundofthepigeonsaddedsomethingtothis,and,ifitwereacomedy,
wecouldhavehadfurtherevidenceofthepigeons.Anyway,youtendtoexpectmovieduelsto
befoughtoutdoors,possiblyinamistygroveoftreesatdawn.Ithoughttheideaofplacingthe
duelinabarngaveitaninterestingdifference.Thisideacamequitebyaccidentwhenoneofthe
locationscoutsreturnedwithsomephotographsofthebarn.IthinkitwasJoycewhoobserved
thataccidentsaretheportalstodiscovery.Well,that'scertainlytrueinmakingfilms.And
perhapsinmuchthesameway,thereisanaspectoffilmmakingwhichcanbecomparedtoa
sportingcontest.Youcanstartwithagameplanbutdependingonwheretheballbouncesand
wheretheothersidehappenstobe,opportunitiesandproblemsarisewhichcanonlybe
effectivelydealtwithatthatverymoment.
In2001:ASpaceOdyssey,forexample,thereseemednocleverwayforHALtolearnthatthe
twoastronautsdistrustedhimandwereplanningtodisconnecthisbrain.Itwouldhavebeen
irritatinglycarelessofthemtotalkaloud,knowingthatHALwouldhearandunderstandthem.
Thentheperfectsolutionpresenteditselffromtheactualphsicallayoutofthespacepodinthe
podbay.Thetwomenwentintothepodandturnedoffeveryswitchtomakethemsafefrom
HAL'smicrophones.Theysatinthepodfacingeachotherandinthecenteroftheshot,visible
throughthesoundproofglassport,youcouldplainlyseetheredglowofHAL'sbugeyelens,
somefifteenfeetaway.Whattheconspiratorsdidn'tthinkofwasthatHALwouldbeabletoread
theirlips.
Didyoufinditmoreconstricting,lessfree,makinganhistoricalfilmwhereweallhaveprecise
conceptionsofaperiod?Wasitmoreofachallenge?
No,becauseatleastyouknowwhateverythinglookedlike.In2001:ASpaceOdyssey
everythinghadtobedesigned.Butneithertypeoffilmiseasytodo.Inhistoricalandfuturistic
films,thereisaninverserelationshipbetweentheeasetheaudiencehastakinginataglance
thesets,costumesanddecor,andthefilmmaker'sproblemsincreatingit.Wheneverythingyou
seehastobedesignedandconstructed,yougreatlyincreasethecostofthefilm,add
tremendouslytoallthenormalproblemsoffilmmaking,makingitvirtuallyimpossibletohavethe
flexibilityoflastminutechangeswhichyoucanmanageinacontemporaryfilm.
Youarewellknownforthethoroughnesswithwhichyouaccumulateinformationanddo
researchwhenyouworkonaproject.Isitforyouthethrillofbeingareporteroradetective?
Isupposeyoucouldsayitisabitlikebeingadetective.OnBarryLyndon,Iaccumulatedavery
largepicturefileofdrawingsandpaintingstakenfromartbooks.Thesepicturesservedasthe
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referenceforeverythingweneededtomakeclothes,furniture,handprops,architecture,
vehicles,etc.Unfortunately,thepictureswouldhavebeentooawkwardtousewhiletheywere
stillinthebooks,andI'mafraidwefinallyhadveryguiltilytotearupalotofbeautifulartbooks.
Theywereall,fortunately,stillinprintwhichmadeitseemalittlelesssinful.Goodresearchisan
absolutenecessityandIenjoydoingit.Youhaveanimportantreasontostudyasubjectinmuch
greaterdepththanyouwouldeverhavedoneotherwise,andthenyouhavethesatisfactionof
puttingtheknowledgetoimmediategooduse.Thedesignsfortheclotheswereallcopiedfrom
drawingsandpaintingsoftheperiod.Noneofthemweredesignedinthenormalsense.Thisis
thebestway,inmyopinion,tomakehistoricalcostumes.Itdoesn'tseemsensibletohavea
designerinterpretsaytheeighteenthcentury,usingthesamepicturesourcesfromwhich
youcouldfaithfullycopytheclothes.Neitheristheremuchpointsketchingthecostumesagain
whentheyarealreadybeautifullyrepresentedinthepaintingsanddrawingsoftheperiod.What
isveryimportantistogetsomeactualclothesoftheperiodtolearnhowtheywereoriginally
made.Togetthemtolookright,youreallyhavetomakethemthesameway.Consideralsothe
problemoftasteindesigningclothes,evenfortoday.Onlyahandfulofdesignersseemtohave
asenseofwhatisstrikingandbeautiful.Howcanadesigner,howeverbrilliant,haveafeelingfor
theclothesofanotherperiodwhichisequaltothatofthepeopleandthedesignersoftheperiod
itself,asrecordedintheirpictures?IspentayearpreparingBarryLyndonbeforetheshooting
beganandIthinkthistimewasverywellspent.Thestartingpointandsinequanonofany
historicalorfuturisticstoryistomakeyoubelievewhatyousee.
Thedangerinanhistoricalfilmisthatyouloseyourselfindetails,andbecomedecorative.
Thedangerconnectedwithanymultifacetedproblemisthatyoumightpaytoomuchattention
tosomeoftheproblemstothedetrimentofothers,butIamveryconsciousofthisandImake
sureIdon'tdothat.
Whydoyouprefernaturallighting?
Becauseit'sthewayweseethings.Ihavealwaystriedtolightmyfilmstosimulatenaturallight
inthedaytimeusingthewindowsactuallytolighttheset,andinnightscenesthepracticallights
youseeintheset.Thisapproachhasitsproblemswhenyoucanusebrightelectriclight
sources,butwhencandelabrasandoillampsarethebrightestlightsourceswhichcanbeinthe
set,thedifficultiesarevastlyincreased.PriortoBarryLyndon,theproblemhasneverbeen
properlysolved.Evenifthedirectorandcameramanhadthedesiretolightwithpracticallight
sources,thefilmandthelenseswerenotfastenoughtogetanexposure.A35mmmovie
camerashutterexposesatabout1/50ofasecond,andauseableexposurewasonlypossible
withalensatleast100%fasterthananywhichhadeverbeenusedonamoviecamera.
Fortunately,Ifoundjustsuchalens,oneofagroupoftenwhichZeisshadspecially
manufacturedforNASAsatellitephotography.ThelenshadaspeedoffO.7,anditwas100%
fasterthanthefastestmovielens.Alotofworkstillhadtobedonetoitandtothecamerato
makeituseable.Foronething,therearelementofthelenshadtobe2.5mmawayfromthefilm
plane,requiringspecialmodificationtotherotatingcamerashutter.Butwiththislensitwasnow
possibletoshootinlightconditionssodimthatitwasdifficulttoread.Forthedayinterior
scenes,weusedeithertherealdaylightfromthewindows,orsimulateddaylightbybanking
lightsoutsidethewindowsanddiffusingthemwithtracingpapertapedontheglass.Inaddition
totheverybeautifullightingyoucanachievethisway,itisalsoaverypracticalwaytowork.You
don'thavetoworryaboutshootingintoyourlightingequipment.Allyourlightingisoutsidethe
windowbehindtracingpaper,andifyoushoottowwardsthewindowyougetaverybeautifuland
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realisticflareeffect.
HowdidyoudecideonRyanO'Neal?
Hewasthebestactorforthepart.HelookedrightandIwasconfidentthathepossessedmuch
greateractingabilitythanhehadbeenallowedtoshowinmanyofthefilmshehadpreviously
done.Inretrospect,Ithinkmyconfidenceinhimwasfullyjustifiedbyhisperformance,andIstill
can'tthinkofanyonewhowouldhavebeenbetterforthepart.Thepersonalqualitiesofanactor,
astheyrelatetotherole,arealmostasimportantashisability,andotheractors,say,likeAl
Pacino,JackNicholsonorDustinHoffman,justtonameafewwhoaregreatactors,would
neverthelesshavebeenwrongtoplayBarryLyndon.IlikedRyanandwegotalongverywell
together.InthisregardtheonlydifficultiesIhaveeverhadwithactorshappenedwhentheir
actingtechniquewasn'tgoodenoughtodosomethingyouaskedofthem.Onewayanactor
dealswiththisdifficultyistoinventalotofexcusesthathavenothingtodowiththerealproblem.
ThiswasverywellrepresentedinTruuffaut'sDayForNightwhenValentinaCortese,thestarof
thefilmwithinthefilm,hadn'tbotheredtolearnherlinesandclaimedherdialoguefluffswere
duetotheconfusioncreatedbythescriptgirlplayingabitpartinthescene.
HowdoyouexplainsomeofthemisunderstandingsaboutthefilmbytheAmericanpressand
theEnglishpress?
TheAmericanpresswaspredominantlyenthusiasticaboutthefilm,andTimemagazinerana
coverstoryaboutit.Theinternationalpresswasevenmoreenthusiastic.Itistruethatthe
Englishpresswasbadlysplit.Butfromtheverybeginning,allofmyfilmshavedividedthecritics.
Somehavethoughtthemwonderful,andothershavefoundverylittlegoodtosay.But
subsequentcriticalopinionhasalwaysresultedinaveryremarkableshifttothefavorable.Inone
instance,thesamecriticwhooriginallyrappedthefilmhasseveralyearslaterputitonanall
timebestlist.But,ofcourse,thelastingandultimatelymostimportantreputationofafilmisnot
basedonreviews,butonwhat,ifanything,peoplesayaboutitovertheyears,andonhowmuch
affectionforittheyhave.
Youareaninnovator,butatthesametimeyouareveryconsciousoftradition.
Itrytobe,anyway.Ithinkthatoneoftheproblemswithtwentiethcenturyartisitspreoccupation
withsubjectivityandoriginalityattheexpenseofeverythingelse.Thishasbeenespeciallytrue
inpaintingandmusic.Thoughinitiallystimulating,thissoonimpededthefulldevelopmentofany
particularstyle,andrewardeduninterestingandsterileoriginality.Atthesametime,itisverysad
tosay,filmshavehadtheoppositeproblemtheyhaveconsistentlytriedtoformalizeand
repeatsuccess,andtheyhaveclungtoaformandstyleintroducedintheirinfancy.Thesure
thingiswhateveronewants,andoriginalityisnotanicewordinthiscontext.Thisistruedespite
therepeatedexamplethatnothingisasdangerousasasurething.
Youhaveabandonedoriginalfilmmusicinyourlastthreefilms.
ExcludeapopmusicscorefromwhatIamabouttosay.Howevergoodourbestfilmcomposers
maybe,theyarenotaBeethoven,aMozartoraBrahms.Whyusemusicwhichislessgood
whenthereissuchamultitudeofgreatorchestralmusicavailablefromthepastandfromour
owntime?Whenyou'reeditingafilm,it'sveryhelpfultobeabletotryoutdifferentpiecesof
musictoseehowtheyworkwiththescene.Thisisnotatallanuncommonpractice.Well,witha
littlemorecareandthought,thesetemporarymusictrackscanbecomethefinalscore.WhenI
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hadcompletedtheeditingof2001:ASpaceOdyssey,Ihadlaidintemporarymusictracksfor
almostallofthemusicwhichwaseventuallyusedinthefilm.Then,inthenormalway,Iengaged
theservicesofadistinguishedfilmcomposertowritethescore.AlthoughheandIwentoverthe
pictureverycarefully,andhelistenedtothesetemporarytracks(Strauss,Ligeti,Khatchaturian)
andagreedthattheyworkedfineandwouldserveasaguidetothemusicalobjectivesofeach
sequencehe,nevertheless,wroteandrecordedascorewhichcouldnothavebeenmorealien
tothemusicwehadlistenedto,andmuchmoreseriousthanthat,ascorewhich,inmyopinion,
wascompletelyinadequateforthefilm.Withthepremiereloomingup,Ihadnotimeleftevento
thinkaboutanotherscorebeingwritten,andhadInotbeenabletousethemusicIhadalready
selectedforthetemporarytracksIdon'tknowwhatIwouldhavedone.Thecomposer'sagent
phonedRobertO'Brien,thethenheadofMGM,towarnhimthatifIdidn'tusehisclient'sscore
thefilmwouldnotmakeitspremieredate.Butinthatinstance,asinallothers,O'Brientrusted
myjudgment.Heisawonderfulman,andoneoftheveryfewfilmbossesabletoinspiregenuine
loyaltyandaffectionfromhisfilmmakers.
Whydidyouchoosetohaveonlyoneflashbackinthefilm:thechildfallingfromthehorse?
Ididn'twanttospendthetimewhichwouldhavebeenrequiredtoshowtheentirestoryactionof
youngBryansneakingawayfromthehouse,takingthehorse,falling,beingfound,etc.NordidI
wanttolearnabouttheaccidentsolelythroughthedialoguesceneinwhichthefarmworkers,
carryingtheinjuredboy,tellBarry.Puttingtheflashbackfragmentinthemiddleofthedialogue
sceneseemedtobetherightthingtodo.
Areyourcameramovementsplannedbefore?
Veryrarely.Ithinkthereisvirtuallynopointputtingcamerainstructionsintoascreenplay,and
onlyifsomereallyimportantcameraideaoccurstome,doIwriteitdown.Whenyourehearsea
scene,itisusuallybestnottothinkaboutthecameraatall.Ifyoudo,Ihavefoundthatit
invariablyinterfereswiththefullestexplorationoftheideasofthescene.When,atlast,
somethinghappenswhichyouknowisworthfilming,thatisthetimetodecidehowtoshootit.It
isalmostbutnotquitetruetosaythatwhensomethingreallyexcitingandworthwhileis
happening,itdoesn'tmatterhowyoushootit.Inanyevent,itnevertakesmelongtodecideon
setups,lightingorcameramovements.Thevisualpartoffilmmakinghasalwayscomeeasiest
tome,andthatiswhyIamcarefultosubordinateittothestoryandtheperformances.
Doyoulikewritingaloneorwouldyouliketoworkwithascriptwriter?
IenjoyworkingwithsomeoneIfindstimulating.Oneofthemostfruitfulandenjoyable
collaborationsIhavehadwaswithArthurC.Clarkeinwritingthestoryof2001:ASpace
Odyssey.Oneoftheparadoxesofmoviewritingisthat,withafewnotableexceptions,writers
whocanreallywritearenotinterestedinworkingonfilmscripts.Theyquitecorrectlyregardtheir
importantworkasbeingdoneforpublication.IwrotethescreenplayforBarryLyndonalone.The
firstdrafttookthreeorfourmonthsbut,aswithallmyfilms,thesubsequentwritingprocess
neverreallystopped.Whatyouhavewrittenandisyetunfilmedisinevitablyaffectedbywhat
hasbeenfilmed.Newproblemsofcontentordramaticweightrevealthemselves.Rehearsinga
scenecanalsocausescriptchanges.Howevercarefullyyouthinkaboutascene,andhowever
clearlyyoubelieveyouhavevisualizedit,it'sneverthesamewhenyoufinallyseeitplayed.
Sometimesatotallynewideacomesupoutoftheblue,duringarehearsal,orevenduringactual
shooting,whichissimplytoogoodtoignore.Thiscannecessitatethenewscenebeingworked
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outwiththeactorsrightthenandthere.Aslongastheactorsknowtheobjectivesofthescene,
andunderstandtheircharacters,thisislessdifficultandmuchquickertodothanyoumight
imagine.

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