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Feb
3

Systemd for better or worse

by Richard Hillesley

Systemd hopes to simplify the growing number of processes across Linux distributions. Its a worthy
goal, but things are never that simple
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The average Linux user can be forgiven for being mystified by the passion and anger that surround the arguments over systemd, which aims to replace the traditional init daemon
and shell scripts that initialise a Linux installation. Shell scripts are the tried and trusted method by which the Linux kernel is instructed on the options for its startup processes, and
are seen by many sysadmins as the Unix way of doing things. Scripts can be changed at will and the kernel doesnt need a reboot.

Times change. As Linux has become more popular the number of subsystems and processes have multiplied and diversified. Some make conflicting demands on the kernel. A
mobile or embedded device has very different expectations to a dedicated server and each implementation has its own demands. Some of the controversies surrounding systemd
have come into focus because the Gnome developers have seen an integrated startup procedure as essential to the wellbeing of future implementations of Gnome. Similar
arguments apply to Wayland and other subsystems.

Most developers are agreed that a tidier, more consistent and faster boot time for Linux is desirable. Systemd hopes to simplify and regularise the configuration of the growing
number of subsystems and processes across Linux distributions. The hope is that this will make life easier for everybody developers, distributions, device manufacturers and
Linux administrators. Of course, its not that easy.

Rather than minimising the number of processes it controls systemd has become, in the words of one sceptical LWN commenter, init system, device manager, login manager,
cron, DNS resolver, console terminal emulator, package manager, kitchen sink, slopbucket, API breaker. The complaint is that systemd is monolithic, and monolithic control
systems with one point of failure have never been the Unix, or Linux, way of doing things. This is the kind of issue that has dogged Microsoft operating systems, where the failure
of one process can bring down the whole system. Patrick Volkerding, Slackware developer, puts it succinctly:

I do like the idea of a faster boot time (obviously), but I also like controlling the startup of the system with shell scripts that are readable, and Im guessing thats what most

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10/02/15 Systemd for better or worse | Linux User & Developer - the Linux and FOSS mag for a GNU generation
Slackware users prefer too. I dont spend all day rebooting my machine, and having looked at systemd config files it seems to me a very foreign way of controlling a system to
me, and attempting to control services, sockets, devices, mounts, etc, all within one daemon flies in the face of the UNIX concept of doing one thing and doing it well.

Changes in the Linux community are often dogged by controversy, sometimes justified, sometimes not, as Gnome and Wayland developers have discovered in recent times.
Kernel developers have joined in on both sides of the argument. Most distributions have opted for systemd, among them Debian and Ubuntu, which, in any case, had been using
its own startup procedure. Debians choice of systemd as the default option for startup was put to a democratic vote, and sysvinit remains an option. Nonetheless, a group of
Debian Developers, styling themselves the Veteran Unix Admins, have announced a fork of Debian to be known as Devuan. Devuan will be Debian without systemd, and the
developers unlikely ambition is to replicate the Debian development and maintenance environment from scratch.

Free software communities hope to be open and democratic. Some are more so than others. Debian developers are known for their willingness to down tools in defence of the
principles that keep their community together. Developers are passionate about right and wrong ways of doing things and technical differences sometimes spill over into personal
animosity and hyperbole. Antagonists on both sides of the argument become entrenched and harden their positions, and it becomes more difficult to disentangle the real issues
from the imagined and personal, and just as difficult to find a compromise.

Most developers know when a piece of software has reached the end of its useful life. Gnome had to be rationalised because the bits had begun to fall apart at the seams. X was
20 years out of date and entirely dysfunctional, and in an increasingly complex world of conflicting subsystems and processes, a new ignition system was required for the Linux
kernel. The alternatives may be imperfect, but time and refinement will tell whether the right decisions have been made.

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Tags: devuan, init, systemd

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Robert Pogson 7 days ago

The thing that bugs me about systemd is that the thing is still being written and is not debugged yet distros like Debian are making it the default init system.
That's just not right. The particular issue which causes me not to use systemd on my main machine is that I have a bunch of processes running on it and
systemd wants all of them to have priority over X, my interface, what I want to be up as soon as possible. I kid you not. Apache, DHCP, NFS, MySQL,
PostgreSQL, and some others all have to finish starting up before systemd will even begin to start X. I don't require every server on the Internet to be up
before I get a usable desktop but systemd won't allow me to have a desktop before I start my little version of the Internet. Now, I could rewrite all the
configurations that come by default with systemd on Debian but that's a big job and not well documented. I just want the old behaviour back where a bunch
of stuff starts at the same time and X comes up before a couple of minutes elapse. Is that too much to ask? If I try to write my own configuration all I get is
a bunch of "loop" error messages from systemd. It knows best and it won't allow me to control my own system. That's too much like that other OS, the one
I left 15 years ago to get the best from my hardware. Either this gets fixed real soon or I will have to change distros to escape systemd. This isn't even a
bug. It's a feature. My system that used to boot in ~40s now takes 2min. I reboot a lot because I build and install kernels with it. Systemd is wasting my
time. I'm old and don't have much left.
4 Reply Share

Daniel Sandman > Robert Pogson 6 days ago

Try and learn little more about systemd.. you will probably be very pleasantly surprised how easy it is. My 10 year old machine went from a minute
upstart to about 10 seconds. The thing with systemd is that it start services in parallel instead of serial. So it will not do as the old init that had to wait
for services before it could start the next one. Systemd can theoretically start them all at once.

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10/02/15 Systemd for better or worse | Linux User & Developer - the Linux and FOSS mag for a GNU generation

Another good thing is that it work with dependencies... Some stuff like DHCP need to have a working Internet connection or it will fail. What systemd
does here is to make sure you have that connection before it starts DHCP. If you have an issue with your Internet connection you can easily
troubleshoot with with 'systemctl status' and similar. I use the inbuilt capability of systemd.. the systemd-networkd. It improved the connection time
from 10 seconds to 0.250 seconds.

So even if you are old... take the time getting into it. You will change your mind. I am sure.
3 Reply Share

rtfazeberdee > Robert Pogson 6 days ago

thats all down to your configuration of systemd, Debian has had a few issues creating a good config. go back to sysvinit by pointing the kernel init
setting to "/bin/init" instead of "init=/bin/systemd"
2 Reply Share

lucius-cornelius 6 days ago

"They" tried, for years, to destroy Linux. "Only hackers use it", "only hippies use it", "only communists or terrorists use it", "we own patents for most of it"
and each one failed. Now they're attacking it from within and it's worked beautifully. One community torn asunder over systemd. Most distros now firmly in
the palm of Red Hat and thus under their control. The modularity and control that distinguished Linux from other OS's, now mostly gone and by the time
Poettering has finished, it will all be gone. And then it will be too late.
Thankfully there are still some distros holding out - Slackware, Crux, Pisi, Manjaro OpenRC and Devuan if it gets off the ground. Long may they continue to
resist. But I don't hold out much hope in the long run. This is Corporate takeover 101 and so few even see what's happening that the chances of stopping it
are next to zero. Sad.
5 Reply Share

average linux user > lucius-cornelius 6 days ago

The evil corporations are at it again. Is that what you are saying? Well, I am glad you are sad. RedHat does not control anything, they just develop
stuff. The other Linux distros are FREE to use RedHat code or not use it.
4 Reply Share

rtfazeberdee > lucius-cornelius 6 days ago

oh well, you can always stay living in the past

2 Reply Share

KeithE4Phx > rtfazeberdee 5 days ago

That doesn't help. Got any good, engineering-based reasons why it's good? Or why it's bad?
Reply Share

rtfazeberdee > KeithE4Phx 21 hours ago

check out L. Poettering's systemd talks on Youtube

Reply Share

TheRealTachyon 5 days ago

I've never rebooted so much after simple updates as I have since my systems became infected with systemd. It's monolithic approach and wide reaching
tentacles have it integrated into so many systems that it already has become a single point of failure.
It is destroying all the advantages that Linux had as an operating system for minimal return in benefits.
2 Reply Share

KeithE4Phx > TheRealTachyon 5 days ago

Don't like it? Then use Slackware. It has its own advantages and disadvantages, most of the latter make it useless to me as a desktop OS. But it's
perfect for server-related uses. And it doesn't use systemd.

I have Slackware, Xubuntu, and Mint machines. Xubuntu only needs a reboot when the kernel is updated. Slackware (when using slapt-get) and Mint
never update the kernel by default, so never need to be rebooted (although I think it's a good idea once in a great while). If you're doing a lot of
rebooting after updates, you might want to check your update manager's settings. But between the three of them, I don't see any issues whether or
not a particular machine is (Mint,Xubuntu) or not (Slackware) is using systemd. It's never crashed.
Reply Share

IJK 6 days ago

What worries me about systemd is the dependencies that it will introduce. I don't care if Gnome depends on it, for Gnome is a pile of manure and I won't
use it anyway (I still think it is a gross mistake to make it dependent on systemd though.) However, if things like Gimp are dependent on systemd my blood
starts to boil. If that dependency exists, systemd has clearly exceeded its role and is on its way of becoming a lock-in module - my way or the highway. If
that comes to pass that will be the end of Linux for me.
2 Reply Share

rtfazeberdee > IJK 6 days ago

if Gimp ever becomes dependent on systemd, that will be down to the developers of gimp, not the systemd developers
2 Reply Share

average linux user > IJK 6 days ago

Off-topic, but I agree that Gnome 3 has been one of the most horrible desktop environments in the entire history of desktop environments. However
I tried it recently on Fedora 21 and it can be usable if you tweak it. It is very far from perfect, but at least now you can work with it.
1 Reply Share

Eddie O'Connor > average linux user 2 days ago

Well I'm from the other side of the tracks on this issue, which yes...is indeed of topic. I have used Gnome since it's 2.x days and I still use it
today....while it's not for everyone I find it usable for my daily driver and its not that hard to grasp as everyone makes out. It might take a little
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10/02/15 Systemd for better or worse | Linux User & Developer - the Linux and FOSS mag for a GNU generation
today....while it's not for everyone I find it usable for my daily driver and its not that hard to grasp as everyone makes out. It might take a little
getting used to, but if give it a chance you might find its very "lovable" on your desktop or laptop.....not quite sure how it would fare on a tablet
but I guess to each their own....
Reply Share

Mike H > Eddie O'Connor 8 hours ago

Same here. Gnome 3.14 is spectacular. Especially now that "Workspaces to dock" works again. I'v never been happier with a
desktop as I am with Gnome 3 on Arch.
Reply Share

TheRealTachyon 5 days ago

The thing that is most disturbing about systemd is the organized and active group of defenders and trolls that scour the Internet for articles and discussions
on systemd and actively go after detractors. I haven't the stomach to read all the comments on this article, but I guarantee you'll find what I'm talking about
in the comments.
Anyone that disagrees will be called names. Told they're living in the past. Told they don't know what they're talking about etc. Never have I seen this kind of
organized, professional trolling on a Linux topic before. It's something I've only seen from corporations and lobby groups. That fact alone makes me
confident in my distrust of everything systemd stands for.
1 Reply Share

Andrew M. 6 days ago

Poettering rebuts criticism such as 'systemd is monolithic unlike Unix' or 'systemd is a RedHat project' in this interesting interview:
http://www.linuxvoice.com/inte....
1 Reply Share

rtfazeberdee > Andrew M. 6 days ago

trolls against systemd have no real arguments so they make them up.
1 Reply Share

KeithE4Phx > rtfazeberdee 5 days ago

I want real, engineering-based reasons why systemd is good and why it's bad. I have some systems with it and some without. No difference
in speed or stability, quite frankly.

But I'm absolutely sick and tired of all the whiny-azz beotches on both sides of the argument.
1 Reply Share

rtfazeberdee > KeithE4Phx 21 hours ago

Go to Youtube and search for systemd and watch Lennart Poettering's talks.
Reply Share

purplelibraryguy > rtfazeberdee 5 days ago

So, what's their motivation for that supposed to be? Are they in the pay of the Secret Masters?
Reply Share

Eddie O'Connor 2 days ago

Is there no way to "change" systemd to make it do what you want it to do?...I thought that was the core....the very heart-beat of Linux, to be able to take
what's there and make it what YOU want/need it to be. Surely they have SysAdmin books for systemd that give you the code/scripts to change what you
dont like about it and make it what you want?....right?....
Reply Share

Glenn Holmer 5 days ago

The complaint is that systemd is monolithic, and monolithic control

systems with one point of failure have never been the Unix, or Linux,
way of doing things.
http://0pointer.de/blog/projec...
Reply Share

KeithE4Phx > Glenn Holmer 5 days ago

Unless one is using or administering a real Unix system, that statement is irrelevant.

Linux evolves. Deal with it. If Linus Torvalds doesn't care -- and from what I've read, he doesn't -- neither should we.
Reply Share

Glenn Holmer > KeithE4Phx 4 days ago

I think you misunderstood my post: I was rebutting the statement in the article that systemd is monolithic (I should have used quotes). I love
systemd:
http://www.lyonlabs.org/system...
1 Reply Share

KeithE4Phx > Glenn Holmer 4 days ago

OK. Sorry about that. I did misunderstand your post. But my point still stands, it's just not directed at you.

I've been a Linux user since 1998 and a Slackware user since 2000. But I'm getting sick and tired of the whiners, mostly from the
Slackware "camp," pissing and moaning about every improvement that comes along. Some work, some don't. Systemd seems to
be one that's working, at least as far as I can determine.

I don't know very much about systemd because I've never had a need to mess around with any init system. Regardless of which one
is used, I've never had a failure.
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10/02/15 Systemd for better or worse | Linux User & Developer - the Linux and FOSS mag for a GNU generation
is used, I've never had a failure.
Reply Share

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