Analysis of MKULTRA, 1977 Joint Hearing (Part 11)

by Dr. Jeffrey Russell, PhD

[Second Round of Questions of Admiral Turner by Senator Kennedy—some paraphrasing and

redactions by author]
Kennedy: It is your intention to notify the individuals who have been subjects of the research, is
that right?
Turner: Yes.
Kennedy: If you can identify them, you intend to notify them?
Turner: Yes.
Kennedy: And you intend to notify the universities and research centers as well?
Turner: Senator, I am torn on that. If the institution was a witting participant, they already have
access to the information. If they were not witting, I’m afraid the process of informing them of
their participation might be damaging to their reputation. I really don’t know the equities here.
Kennedy: The problem is, all you have to do is to pick up a newspaper and see the universities
mentioned. I think you would be putting many universities at a disadvantage by not notifying
them. It seems to me that those universities should be entitled to that information in order to
protect their integrity.
Turner: So, if we identify them privately, then you are saying they will have some protection
against a public disclosure? There are many of the 80 universities that have not been publicly
identified.
Kennedy: I think the universities should be notified. Then, they can decide whatever steps they
need to take to protect themselves in the future. I think they are entitled to know this.
Turner: I have a great sympathy with what you are saying. I have already notified one
university due to its extensive involvement. One thing that will be difficult to comply with is to
inform each institution the extent and nature of its participation.
Kennedy: Well, you can tell them to the best of your information. Certainly, the universities are
entitled to know.
Turner: Yes. Not all of these are unwitting.
Kennedy: That’s right.
Turner: I am only interested in doing it in a way that will not lead to public disclosure of the
individuals, whom I am not allowed to disclose.
Kennedy: That could be done, it seems to me.
Turner: So, we will see if we can devise a method of informing these universities on a private
basis and then letting them decide how to proceed.
Kennedy: What if they ask you to announce it publicly?
Turner: I think I would be doing a disservice by announcing that publicly.
Kennedy: Would you meet with university officials and ask what their views are on this topic?
Turner: Fine. I will phone several university presidents today who are not involved and ask them
what they think the equities would be.
Kennedy: All right. You let us know, too.
Turner: But I am not sure I see any great benefit in my notifying the public as opposed to the
university doing this.
Kennedy: Yes. Let’s see how your phone inquiries go. If I could, let me ask a question on the
use of these safe houses. As I understand it, the drug testing was done on a variety of people
with regards to social level and race. I understood that to be the nature of the project. I am just
wondering whether those tests were conducted at the two safe houses. To your knowledge, is
that correct?
Turner: Yes.
Kennedy: So, the research did not go beyond the safe houses located on the east and west coast?
Turner: That type of unwitting testing of randomly selected individuals, yes.
Kennedy: It was just located in those two places?
Turner: To the best of our knowledge, there were only two locations.
Kennedy: How do we interpret randomly selected?
Turner: Well, as opposed to prisoners in a cell selected differently.
Kennedy: All right. Do you know how many people were recruited?
Turner: No idea.
Kennedy: Do you know approximately?
Turner: I asked the same question the other day and apparently either there were no records kept
or they were destroyed in that 1973 incident.
[End of second round of questions from Senator Kennedy]