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In Search of Lucy
Interview > Natia Khuluzauri
Donald Carl Johanson is the famous American paleoanthropologist known for his expedition to Hadar, Ethiopia
in1974 with archeologist Tom Gray. He discovered the remains of a human ancestor dated at 3.2 million years ago,
and classified as Australopithecus afarensis. The remains later became known as “Lucy”. In 1981 Johanson wrote a
popular scientific book by the same title, thus defining the future profession of many young readers.
Professor Johanson visited Georgia to participate in the international Senckenberg conference “100+25 Years of
Homo erectus: Dmanisi and Beyond” in September 2016, where he gave a public lecture. We were honored to
interview Professor Johanson at that time.

Prof. Johanson, what can you tell
us about your bestseller, “Lucy”, that
has impacted the choice of profession
of so many youngsters interested in
sciences since the 1980s? What inspi-
red you to become a paleoanthropo-
logist?
Of course I'm very happy and pleased
to be so rewarded that my book, Lucy,
published many years ago in 1981, has
been an inspiration to the younger ge-
nerations who are following in my foots-
teps, and have this fascination about
paleoanthropology, the study of human
origins. I was very fortunate as a young
boy growing up in America when a pro-
fessor who lived close to my house sho-
wed me a book written by Thomas Henry
Huxley, published in the late 1800s. Hu-
xley was a close friend of Darwin’s and
they talked a great deal. They talked very
often about the idea of evolution and if
humans also evolved. At that time they
saw the close similarity between African
apes and humans and decided the ear-
liest human, the most ancient human
would be found in Africa. And to me – I
was 13 years old – this idea just explo-
ded in my head! I decided I wanted to be
part of that search and to look for those
ancestors that would tell us something
about our origins. The idea that we sha-
red a common ancestor with the African
apes was fascinating to me.
In the beginning of your career did
you expect that you would find some-
thing of this importance?
There have been so many anthropo-
logists who have traveled to Africa or
to Asia hoping to make a discovery. It is
very rare to make a major discovery like
Lucy. I never dreamed that I would find
something so important. I wanted to be
a part of this search, and of course I wan-
ted to find something, but for the first
three years in Africa I found nothing. So,
it took a while to get used to that, and
when I found Lucy in 1974 it was an in-
credible moment for me! It was really
the defining moment of my career as
an anthropologist. That single moment
when I found the first bone changed my
life entirely!
Can you remember how you felt
when you realized that you were hol-
ding the bone of a human ancestor?
Well, of course the moment I recogni-
zed the bone as coming from a human
ancestor I had a big smile; I was emo-
tionally very excited, and I didn't realize
then, until I looked up the slope, on the
side of the hill, that there were other pie-
ces of the skeleton! And when I saw tho-
se pieces of a skeleton, I thought: This
is part of a skeleton, it’s part of one in-
dividual! And I did not know who it was
– she is now a species of human, called
Australopithecus afarensis – but I did not
know how important it would be for the
science of paleoanthropology. I didn't

Prof. Donald Johanson, who has discovered, in 1974, together with archaeologist Tom Gray, the remains of a
GEORGIAN NATIONAL MUSEUM
human ancestor classified as Australopithecus afarensis, dated at 3.2 million
11
years ago, in Hadar, Ethiopia.

Prof. Donald Johanson and Prof. David Lordkipanidze with the famous discoveries from
Dmanisi. Prod. Lordkipanidze holds Prof. Johanson's legendary book Lucy. This book
impacted the final decision of Prof. Lordkipanidze when choosing his profession.
know when we gave her the name that
evening, when we called her Lucy after
the Beatle’s song, Lucy in the Sky with
Diamonds, that she would become so
popular with people around the world
– not just to scientists, but to the avera-
ge person who reads the newspaper for
example.
You mentioned that for three years
you found nothing. Why didn’t you
stop? Do you think that along with
luck, that scientific curiosity and pa-
tience are also important? What are
the most important assets that the
scientist should have, and what would
you say to the next generation?
I think that it is terribly important for
all humans to have curiosity about the
world around them. How we got here,
how the world works – particularly the
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natural world. I was fortunate to develop
a passion as a young boy, something I
wanted to do above everything else. I ne-
ver thought about making money; I ne-
ver thought about being a businessman
and successful. I wanted to do something
that really excited me – that made me
feel like it was going to change what we
know about the world. But the passion I
had as a young boy I have carried throu-
ghout my life. And I think for people who
have come after me, to be successful you
have to be curious; you have to have a
passion for something; you have to have
dedication; and most importantly you
have to have knowledge. Education is
extraordinarily important.
Sometimes people say that I just stum-
bled or fell on this – I did not. I studied
many years at the university; I had this
passion, this curiosity and patience. The-
re were so many others who came before
and after, who had the education I had,
the passion and curiosity – but they did
not have, I think, the patience to stay and
work and look, every single day – and
most days never find anything. So, it is
not really luck – it is a combination of
these different elements that brings suc-
cess – and in my case I was wonderfully
rewarded with the discovery of Lucy in
1974.
Why did you decide to write a book
that was not only for scientific cir-
cles?
When I made the discovery, Lucy was
in the newspaper, and people were res-
ponding by asking questions: “How old
was she when she died?”; “How many
years ago did she live?”; “Was she an
adult?”; “Did she have babies?” There is a
tremendous thirst; people want to know
about where they come from, their ori-
gins. The first question we ask as a child
is “Where did I come from?” and I think
that paleoanthropology as a scientific
inquiry is the scientific way of trying to
understand our origins. It was really the
stimulus from the public that made me
realize – sure, I could write scientific arti-
cles that only my colleagues would read,
filled with terminology and tactical des-
criptions and so forth – but the public
has a real interest in this. I felt it was very
important to translate the science so that
everyone can understand it. Just as I’m
not an astrophysicist or a cosmologist;
yet I’m very interested in how the univer-
se came to be. I am not a specialist, and I
am always happy when a scientist writes
a book in a language I can comprehend,
that helps me understand the details of
cosmology, for example.
What was your reaction when you
first heard about the Dmanisi disco-
very?
Well, the first reaction I had was in early
1990s when the first lower jaw or man-
dible was found I knew immediately this
was important; I knew secondly, it was a
big surprise. Who would’ve expected it?
It was so exciting for me because it was
“out of Africa”. My focus had been on Afri-
ca, but we knew humans left Africa. We
thought it was very recent, but when I
learned it was almost 2 million years ago
– 1.8 million years ago – it greatly chan-
ged our ideas about the sequence in ter-
ms of the time when our ancestors left.
They didn’t control fire; they did not have
big brains… they were the first pioneers;
they were exploring a world beyond Afri-
ca. And then as the team here, from this
museum, began to find more complete
specimens, we were all terribly excited.
It is an amazing collection. The preser-
vation of the specimens is absolutely
perfect and work is still going on; they
are still looking at these specimens and
learning much more about them, but it
really is an important discovery helping
us understand when the first “out of Afri-
ca” experience happened.
Where would you situate the disco-
veries and the Dmanisi archeological
site in the context of paleoanthropo-
logy – how important are the Dmanisi
discoveries?
I think the Dmanisi fossils are extraor-
dinarily important because they tell us
about what the earliest humans out of
Africa look like, and the fact that they
left Africa long before we thought they
would leave. This has been a very impor-
tant international conference here in Tbi-
lisi and has brought together scientists
from all over the world to share informa-
tion about the importance of this. All of
us are terribly excited to be here to be
able to see the original specimens and
talk to the discoverers and the scientists
personally.
To be in the desert were I worked in Ethiopia for
2-3 months a year, living in place of the size of
a tent and being part of the natural world,
brought me some of the greatest satisfactions I
have ever felt.
It seems Dmanisi is among the most
important sites?
Oh absolutely, it is, in terms of “out of
Africa «one of the most important sites;
there is an important site in Spain where
they are finding many specimens, but of
this age – this is the single most impor-
tant site in all of Eurasia.
According to your opinion, what is
the future of paleoanthropology?
Well, I am often asked by my students:
- “Is there anymore place to look? You
seem to have found so many places al-
ready!” I say, “You must keep your mind
open and your energy high to go out
and look for new places.” Who would’ve
expected these discoveries in Dmanisi, in
Georgia? – no one! There may be more
important discoveries in this country or
the Caucasus region or elsewhere, but
we cannot find them unless we leave our
offices and our laboratories and get out
into the field and explore. Exploration is
really the answer, and I try to encoura-
ge my students to spend some of their
time and effort participating in these ex-
peditions, and to think about, perhaps,
forming their own exploration in some
place.
Do you miss fieldwork?
Yes, I do, very much. Those were glo-
rious years, wonderful years, when you
are away from what we call “civilization”.
I thought doing fieldwork is much more
civilized, but to be in the desert were I
worked in Ethiopia for 2-3 months a year,
living in place of the size of a tent and
being part of the natural world, brought
me some of the greatest satisfactions I
have ever felt. And the sense of disco-
very – never knowing when you get up if
something important will be found that
day; and working as a team is a wonder-
ful experience!
What is your main activity now?
I am still teaching, mostly online, a
course at www.edx.org, which is a human
origins course that goes out to about ten
thousand people a year. Also, I am still
working at the Arizona State University
Institute of Human Origins and conti-
nuing to write scientific articles. And I’ve
begun to write a book about myself – an
autobiography.
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