S2-11_EAZC473: DCT Calculation in EC3

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S2-11_EAZC473 Forums General Discussion Forum DCT Calculation in EC3

DCT Calculation in EC3

by DHEERAJ SHARMA . - Wednesday, 28 March 2012, 12:12 AM

I am unable to use the 2D DCT equation to solve old question papers. Its a very lengthy equation. Any smart guy knows how to find the DCT for a 3x3 block with given quantization table.

Re: DCT Calculation in EC3

by ROSHNA A K . - Wednesday, 28 March 2012, 10:52 AM

There is no other choice but to use the lengthy equation

DCT and IDCT is a tedious process especially if its a 8 x 8 matrix.

Frankly speaking the marks donot justify the time we spend solving the question.
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Re: DCT Calculation in EC3

by DHEERAJ SHARMA . - Wednesday, 28 March 2012, 12:23 PM

Thanks Roshna for a reconfirmation.

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Re: DCT Calculation in EC3

by RACHNA AGARWAL . - Wednesday, 28 March 2012, 04:57 PM

Hi Roshan , Could you please share an approach to apply it. Regards, Rachna
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Re: DCT Calculation in EC3

by ROSHNA A K . - Wednesday, 28 March 2012, 08:36 PM

Rachna, there is no approach as such. You have to substitute the values from the matrix in the formula and calculate the values. What approach are you looking for specifically?
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Re: DCT Calculation in EC3

by ABHAY DUTT PAROHA . - Wednesday, 28 March 2012, 04:50 PM

I have one doubt. Can we apply the same 2D DCT equation here which we generally use for 8X8 blocks? (because we have 3X3 blocks, so what would be value of N which denotes size)
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Re: DCT Calculation in EC3

by DHEERAJ SHARMA . - Wednesday, 28 March 2012, 04:52 PM

N,M would be 3,3

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Re: DCT Calculation in EC3

by ROSHNA A K . - Wednesday, 28 March 2012, 08:38 PM

M x N is the order of the matrix. so for 8 x 8, M = 8 and N=8 for 3 x 3, M=3 and N=3.
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Re: DCT Calculation in EC3

by DHEERAJ SHARMA . - Wednesday, 28 March 2012, 08:53 PM

Roshna, I am having trouble to expand the equation and in substitution of values. would it be possible for you to give an example solution by expanding the eqaution for a 3x3 table.(having trouble substituing the values in equation and ultimately using calculator). Your help would be really appreciable by all who are struggling with this problem.

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Re: DCT Calculation in EC3

by ROSHNA A K . - Wednesday, 28 March 2012, 09:19 PM

Ok am not a pro, but i'll try. I couldn't do this in EC-2

Learnt it now for Open book

1. First do the range shifting by subtracting 128 from each value of the matrix. Ex. at (0,0) 70-128 = -58. This is value of f(0,0). Do the same for all other values. 2. Apply DCT for all values of the matrix by substituting values. Ex. H(0,0)=2/root(8*8) * C(0) * C(0) * [f(0,0) * cos 0 * cos 0 + f(0,1) * cos 0 * cos 0 + f(0,2) * cos 0 * cos 0 + f(1,0) * cos 0 * cos 0 + f(1,1) * cos 0 * cos 0 + f(1,2) * cos 0 * cos 0 + f(2,0) * cos 0 * cos 0 + f(2,1) * cos 0 * cos 0 + f(2,2) * cos 0 * cos 0] Here C(0) = 1/root(2) because index is 0. all the cos terms are cos 0 because both u and v are 0. (According to the equation) It's tough to explain by typing the solution. Hope you understood.
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Re: DCT Calculation in EC3

by OMAARATHI S . - Thursday, 29 March 2012, 11:28 PM

hey Roshna very good effort and explained ur best and got the prb thq for it
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Re: DCT Calculation in EC3

by RUPAYAN DUTTA . - Saturday, 31 March 2012, 09:06 PM

Hi Roshna, Thanks for giving the hint but I have a doubt. Why are we doing 2/root(8*8) instead of 2/root(3*3)? Please correct me if I am wrong. Regards Ruapayn
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Re: DCT Calculation in EC3

by ROSHNA A K . - Sunday, 1 April 2012, 05:40 PM

you are right. sorry it should be 3 x 3. Thanks for pointing it out

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Re: DCT Calculation in EC3

by DHEERAJ SHARMA . - Friday, 30 March 2012, 02:11 AM

Folks solving this mathematically using the DCT 2D equation in exam would take mote than 1 hour. Anybody has a better idea. please help as this is a real important question. If somebody could throw some light please.
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Re: DCT Calculation in EC3

by SOUNAV MAIKAP . - Saturday, 31 March 2012, 12:19 AM

There is no better way. The solution as follows (exactly like ROSANA): (a) Sub 128 from each element of the matrix (getting a new matrix say M) (b) Use the matrix like below: a = .3536 b = .4904 c = .4157 d = .2778

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e = .0975 f = .4619 g = .1913 use a 8x8 a a b c f g c -e T = a -a d -b g -f e -d matrix (for a a a a d e -e -d -g -f -f -g -b -d d b -a a a -a e c -c -e f -g -g f c -b b -c real JPEG problems) or use a 4 x 4 for the problem in question a a -c -b g f e -c -a a b -d -f g d -e

The reason why I am proposing the above hard core values, is that if you compute according to ROSANA using calculator you will end with a different value than the one mentioned (I did). You need to use Taylor series for proper precision (http://en.wikipedia.org /wiki/Taylor_series). Otherwise remember the hard core values for time limitation. (c) Compute the product D = TMT' (T' is the transpose) (d) Quantization requires you divide each element of D by the corresponding element in the Quantization matrix Attaching with dct.pdf Hope the above helps
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Re: DCT Calculation in EC3

by DHEERAJ SHARMA . - Saturday, 31 March 2012, 10:39 AM

Sounav, Thanks for a breakthrough for this problem.Just one question. Can we use a 4X4 matrix as T even is the table input is 3X3 as in the above question.
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Re: DCT Calculation in EC3

by SOUNAV MAIKAP . - Sunday, 1 April 2012, 04:59 PM

whatever is the input crop T to that. In this case (I some how missed the 3x3 matrix) 3x3 should be OK for the value of T.
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Re: DCT Calculation in EC3

by ANU . - Monday, 2 April 2012, 02:15 PM

Can you please attach the dct.pdf again. I didnt find the attachment. Thanks
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Re: DCT Calculation in EC3

by HARIHARA PRASAD MUVVALA . - Tuesday, 3 April 2012, 07:42 AM

Hi Sounav, Could you please re-attach the dct.pdf. Thanks Hari Hara
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